The NFL Catches and Credibility

[T-RO]

Oh yeah, Mike Pereira is an idiot.

I want to turn the game off whenever they bring him on.

Two feet on the ground while not bobbling the ball it is a catch. The ground can't cause a fumble. The impact with the ground should have no bearing on catch status. BOOM FIXED

Exactly. Children have for centuries been able to make up games with rules that are easy to understand and agree to. It's only difficult if someone makes it difficult.

 

[JD_KaPow]

Perirara himself used to state once the player with possession of the football gets the ball over the plane of the goal line, a TD is scored and the ball becomes dead.

This is still exactly the rule. The key is "player with possession." You can't fumble in the opponent's end zone, because the instant you enter the end zone with possession, or establish possession in the end zone, it's a TD.

If you cross the plane but haven't yet established possession, play continues until you do establish possession, or until you go out of bounds, the ball hits or the ground, or someone else establishes possession (e.g. tip drill). This has always been true. The only thing that's changed is the rule for establishing possession: nothing at all has changed about how the end zone works.

 

[T-RO]

Pereira isn't the "head of officials" or the "president of officiating." He doesn't work for the NFL, and hasn't for more than 5 years.

OK. He was Vice President of Officiating for the National Football League a few years ago. All he does now is study the rules and their application. And try to explain it to us viewers. Can you imagine that job?

If he can't get it right...when a play is in review...multiple 4k video angles...

...you know the rules themselves are the obvious problem.

 

[JD_KaPow]

Two feet on the ground while not bobbling the ball it is a catch. The ground can't cause a fumble. The impact with the ground should have no bearing on catch status. BOOM FIXED

1. The ground can cause a fumble (if you're untouched when you go down).
2. The ground causing a fumble or not has nothing to do with the catch rule. You can't fumble unless you have possession.

Don't get me wrong: the catch rule is terrible, and horribly applied. But I'm constantly hearing people confusing the catch rule with the "ground can't cause a fumble" thing and with the "it's a TD when it crosses the end zone plane" thing, and both are irrelevant to the question of possession.

 

[Lutonio]

They need to add a "common sense" bullet point to the rule. Let the refs use their judgement on whether it's a catch. I bet they're petrified and confused by the rule like we are.

 

[BotchedLobotomy]

Well, When you have a former "replay official", and a guy that started up a company that trains officials on replays as your VP of officiating, it's only natural for the guy to come up with as many scenarios to force the NFL into viewing replays as you can.

I know, it's a reach but it's Monday after a bye week.

 

[jday]

The pass is complete...or it's incomplete.

Can you as a fan explain the current NFL rule for what is a catch and what degree of possession is insufficient? Can any of your buddies?

Have you noticed that the announcers who study the game...can't tell? Even the officials themselves can't seem to agree.

In the Packer game right after the Cole catch the broadcast team bounced over to Mike Pereira...the president of officiating ...and the guy starts to say Cole's catch would be overturned...that it wasn't a completed pass. Of course...that conversation stopped abruptly when the play was rightly upheld.

This play wasn't on the sidelines. It wasn't obscured. Cameras had a clear view. It wasn't in anyway an unusual play. We see that kind of thing all the time on the goal line.

And this has been going on for years now. The league has refused to simplify it, or fix it. The NFL could go back to the old rules, which everyone understood and which made total sense...but they refuse to.

Fans hate it. Players hate it. Coaches hate it. Announcers hate it. The rule is mush and there's no reason for it at all.

I'm open to other possibilities, but the only only conclusion I can come to is that the league wants the rule to stay foggy....that it gives them an opportunities for the League to engineer results that benefit their ratings or even somebody's pocket.

What it essentially comes down to is they wanted to establish a rule that would make Dez's catch not a catch while also making sense and they failed.

 

[haleyrules]

Has long as tne rule, good or bad, applies equally to every team and situation then it can be lived with. Whats really annoying is the uneven application of any rule. If the officials don't really understand it then it must be changed. Simplicity is the answer.

 

[Hoofbite]

I think instant replay should be limited to using only real-time speed replays.

Too much scrutinizing going on. Things that were impossible to see or that looked insignificant suddenly become blatant based on 1,000 frames/sec. Still insignificant but now impossible to miss.

Replay at live speed. Slow motion reserved only for timing and spotting.

 

[TheCount]

Two feet on the ground while not bobbling the ball it is a catch. The ground can't cause a fumble. The impact with the ground should have no bearing on catch status. BOOM FIXED

Sounds good in theory, but there are so many points of clarification one could ask on your simple rule that by the time you got done explaining your answers to them all, your simple rule would be as convoluted as the current "rule".

 

[Everson24]

Before Blandino's rule change, you used to need control, two feet, and a football move. After the Dez fiasco, the 2015 rule required control, two feet, and staying "upright long enough" to become a runner. It was clear last year that the officials on the field had different ideas about how long was "long enough." Changing the rule back has made it easier for officials on the field by reinstating the observable standard of the football move. Now they're back to not having to guess, because when they see the football move, they know it's long enough.

Not perfect by any means, as confusion over what constitutes a catch has gone on for years. But last year was a mess.

The Dez catch led to all of this. Had Blandino and Steretore just stayed with the call on the field, (where the judgement was made that Dez did indeed make a football move) he could have avoided all this garbage. But because a picture of Blandino getting off the Jones' party bus surfaced on TMZ, he felt he needed to show he was an impartial offical.

If he had just admitted that he made a mistake, and that the ruling on the field should have stood, he would not have had to go to such lengths to try to justify his biased decision. All last year, touchdowns and legitimate catches were overturned due to him riding the the Jones' party bus. I have no doubt about these pathetic sequence of events.

Lets face it, Dean Blandino is as crooked as scoliosis.

 

[Dhragon]

I have to admit I really don't have a clue what is a catch and not any more and I watch 4 or 5 games a week. lol

And people wonder why NFL ratings are down. I'm sure there are a number of factors in it (election, etc) but the biggest turn-off for me in the NFL lately is that I can no longer even tell when something is a catch or not with my own eyes until an official tells me. I hate that to the extreme, and if I wasn't such a Cowboys fan for a long, long time, I would have quit watching in frustration already.

I don't like watching something incomprehensible. Luckily, most games don't have this crop up. But it does enough of the time to make in annoying.

 

[csirl]

To throw it open even more, I think NFL rules should be abandoned. Everyone should use NCAA rules.

 

[NEODOG]

This is my take:
Since the ground can't cause a fumble
You catch pass, get 2 feet down in bounds-which is another point - then what happens afterwards doesn't matter.

 

[jwooten15]

Two feet on the ground while not bobbling the ball it is a catch. The ground can't cause a fumble. The impact with the ground should have no bearing on catch status. BOOM FIXED

We would have beaten the Seahawks in the NFC Championship game had this been the rule in 2014. Oh, what might have been.

 

[Kevinicus]

Sometimes I have to wonder if people watch the same feed as I do.

Pereira never said the play should be overturned. He pointed out a possibility the refs might consider when reviewing the play, and he was right to do so. The ruling on the replay was that it stands, not that is was confirmed. That means they did consider the things he brought up, but weren't really sure which way to go with it. When they showed the replay, I was worried the refs might rule it incomplete as well. It would not have surprised me at all.

It does illustrate that the officials don't really understand how they're supposed to rule on these catches anymore (if they ever did). I think a lot of us have a good idea of what the rule was supposed to be about and how it was to be applied, and the NFL has kind of botched that and confused the issue. Now, after all the criticism, I think they are going to just stick with the ruling on the field a lot more and rely on the ability to allow the call to stand without conclusive evidence.

 

[Doomsday]

And people wonder why NFL ratings are down. I'm sure there are a number of factors in it (election, etc) but the biggest turn-off for me in the NFL lately is that I can no longer even tell when something is a catch or not with my own eyes until an official tells me. I hate that to the extreme, and if I wasn't such a Cowboys fan for a long, long time, I would have quit watching in frustration already.

I don't like watching something incomprehensible. Luckily, most games don't have this crop up. But it does enough of the time to make in annoying.

I have to admit I am starting to lose some interest for non Cowboys games as well. Between the protests, not knowing what a catch is, the lame personal fouls when you make a good hit or accidentally hit a guy falling from the air too high, or a QB too low. When you tap the QB in the face mask trying to bat a ball down. I hate how they automatically give teams a first down when they throw the ball and are a 1/2 yard short of the sticks. I also hate myself for watching the lame TNF games.

I think there are a lot of little things that are starting to get under my skin, added altogether it starts taking away from the fan experience.

If it wasn't for Fantasy Football I honestly believe the ratings would be a lot lower.

 

[TwoCentPlain]

I know a catch when I see it. I can't explain it in words to take into account each and every situation.

Forget about the catch/non-catch controversy. Pass interference called or not called is a bigger controversy. The NFL needs to review pass interference and holding. Some of these missed PI calls are downright embarrassing.

 

[robbieruff]

I don't see it as better at all nor see any change. Cole had taken control of the ball, taken several steps and even broke the plane of the end zone. Yet Pereira was starting to argue the play should be over-ruled.

TBH I think Pereira was more COULD than SHOULD in his manner of speaking about that play...talking about how Cole's "going to the ground" COULD be interpreted and what not. My whole thing is this is all becoming so GIMMICKY...like the NFL's version of a tired and contrived The Walking Dead plot twist...it's just so nauseating how practically every play that once upon a time would not have even elicited a second glance is now being talked about during a broadcast with the announcers droning on and on about whether it was this or that...and then it gets even more coverage in post game review/commentary/highlights. It's like the league invented this crap in order to intentionally stir up controversy as frequently as possible under some BS guise of generating even more fan interest (note to Roger G...it's having the reverse effect!!!). I suppose this is the unintended consequence of replay reviews, ultimately...the review goes more and more to a micro level until the very definition of something we all once viewed as obvious is now rethought and redefined by some overzealous navel contemplators. While I am all for "getting the call right" the league has turned this into a farce...and idiots like Pereira are just feeding into it as if it's something that we, the fans, want as part of our NFL experience.

What IS CLEAR to me is that the league is now so self conscious about explaining a catch because, in their heart of hearts, they KNOW Dez caught the ball in 2014 based on every possible interpretation of the rules...but somehow explaining that away as NOT being a catch has opened up this pandora's box where now every catch with even a hint of something requires boat load's of explanation...with every obvious football play (or what SHOULD BE obvious) gets twisted and contemplated and swirled over like some sort of archeological find in a Raider's of the Lost Ark move...it's sickening.

 

[dogunwo]

So far anyway, it's been a lot better than last year. The league got a group of experts together (former pro wide receivers and tight ends) who basically decided to go back to the old rule that was in place before Blandino changed it. In short, they brought the football move back in order to determine when a receiver becomes a runner.

Not perfect, but at least there were several things that counted as a football move. The whole "completing the catch when going to the ground" left too much interpretation up to the referee.