The suspense is killing me so I mock. 4/26

[tm1119]

Seriously, this wait is ridiculous.....

This 1 includes a trade in the 2nd round. I'm gonna say 1 of Amaro or Seferian-Jenkins is still on the board at 47 so the Pats trade up to fill the void in their 2 TE scheme. We get their 2nd and 3rd for our 2nd and 7th.

1st- Anthony Barr DE UCLA- Freak athlete with the potential to be a dominant edge rusher. Might not be a full time player year 1 but he can still make an impact.
2nd- Billy Turner OT/OG North Dakota St- Big frame, long arms, and very quick feet. Good kick and slide. Can also play inside at guard or RT.
3rd- Paul Richardson WR Colorado- Jerry's shiny toy. Ridiculous speed with the ability to stretch the field and demand safety help.
3rd- Jaylen Watkins CB/FS Florida- 6' 195 and 4.41 combine 40. 25 starts between both CB and S in the SEC. 1/2 brother of Sammy Watkins.
4th- Khyri Thornton DT Southern Miss- His quick 1st step jumps off the tape. Add in that hes a strong 6-2 305 and I see him as a perfect 1 tech.
5th- Ben Gardner DE Stanford- Underrated. Played mostly as an undersized 3-4 DE in college so most people don't realize his athleticism. Relentless motor.
7th- Spencer Long OG Nebraska- Preseason all American who tore his acl week 1. Could be a steal.
7th- Ken Bishop DT NIU- Quick and powerful. I'd take his skill set on the roster over a guy like Hayden
Comp- Marquis Flowers LB Arizona- Holloman 2.0. 6'3 230 and sub 4.6 40. Played both LB and S in college
Comp- Mike Flacco TE Delaware- Joe's brother is intriguing. 26 and only played 1 year of football at Delaware after spending the last 4 years playing minor league baseball. He's 6'5 245 and apparently ran a 4.68 40 at his pro day.
Comp- Keith Price QB Washington- I like him....He's small but has the arm to make all the throws and has pretty good scramble ability.

 

[xwalker]

There are other DTs that I like better than Thorton.

Ben Gardner is an interesting player. He looks too slow for a 262 pound player but he is stronger than you would expect for a guy at that weight. I wonder is he played a higher weight. He looks bigger in game footage. He appears to be best in a straight line to the QB rushing to the inside. He does power through some outside rushes in a 4 man line, but he's not exactly bending the corner.

 

[tm1119]

There are other DTs that I like better than Thorton.

Ben Gardner is an interesting player. He looks too slow for a 262 pound player but he is stronger than you would expect for a guy at that weight. I wonder is he played a higher weight. He looks bigger in game footage. He appears to be best in a straight line to the QB rushing to the inside. He does power through some outside rushes in a 4 man line, but he's not exactly bending the corner.

The only guy I like better than Thornton besides the obvious 1st and 2nd rounders is Reid and I dont think he lasts until the 4th. If he does I would definitely take him over Thornton.

And yes I think Gardner played heavier than his pro day weight. And I also think being a 3-4 end didn't allow him to show much as a pass rusher. His pro day 3 cone was 6.78 and his jumping numbers were pretty crazy at 39.5 and 10'9. So yeah I think he's more agile and explosive than you think. Towards the end of this video you can see him doing some drills and he definitely looks fluid to me.

 

[MonsterD]

The only guy I like better than Thornton besides the obvious 1st and 2nd rounders is Reid and I dont think he lasts until the 4th. If he does I would definitely take him over Thornton.

And yes I think Gardner played heavier than his pro day weight. And I also think being a 3-4 end didn't allow him to show much as a pass rusher. His pro day 3 cone was 6.78 and his jumping numbers were pretty crazy at 39.5 and 10'9. So yeah I think he's more agile and explosive than you think. Towards the end of this video you can see him doing some drills and he definitely looks fluid to me.

What about Ego Ferguson or Anthony Johnson if they were there in the fourth? i think Ferguson would make a good hybrid 1 tech, I would even say he is just a level below Jernigan, he is capable of being just as good at the 1 tech, not at 3 tech though.

 

[xwalker]

The only guy I like better than Thornton besides the obvious 1st and 2nd rounders is Reid and I dont think he lasts until the 4th. If he does I would definitely take him over Thornton.

And yes I think Gardner played heavier than his pro day weight. And I also think being a 3-4 end didn't allow him to show much as a pass rusher. His pro day 3 cone was 6.78 and his jumping numbers were pretty crazy at 39.5 and 10'9. So yeah I think he's more agile and explosive than you think. Towards the end of this video you can see him doing some drills and he definitely looks fluid to me.

I'm not against picking him in the 5th. His numbers other than the forty are impressive. I don't recall many guys over 250 jumping that high. Some people do believe that the best measure of a DE is the 3-cone time.

I pulled up my notes on the DTs. Thorton would be a good 1-tech. He has good quickness for a 1 and is strong. He was ranked 466 by NFLDS at the time of my notes. I see he is now ranked 167.

Have you watched Zack Kerr? He is very quick for a big man. He has very similar 40, 10, 3-cone, and SS to Thorton while weighing 22 more pounds. He's also very intense.

Kerr and Ken Bishop are my favorite later rounds DTs.

Bruce Gaston is also interesting. He's hard to evaluate because he played out of position as a 3-4 DE and often rushed from the outside or set the edge against the run on the outside. I would like to see him as a 4-3 DT at 6-2, 308 (college weight 316).

 

[xwalker]

What about Ego Ferguson or Anthony Johnson if they were there in the fourth? i think Ferguson would make a good hybrid 1 tech, I would even say he is just a level below Jernigan, he is capable of being just as good at the 1 tech, not at 3 tech though.

Broaddus says the Cowboys don't like either one and that their college coach gave them a thumbs down. Broaddus is an LSU alum and he does not like them either.

 

[tm1119]

I'm not against picking him in the 5th. His numbers other than the forty are impressive. I don't recall many guys over 250 jumping that high. Some people do believe that the best measure of a DE is the 3-cone time.

I pulled up my notes on the DTs. Thorton would be a good 1-tech. He has good quickness for a 1 and is strong. He was ranked 466 by NFLDS at the time of my notes. I see he is now ranked 167.

Have you watched Zack Kerr? He is very quick for a big man. He has very similar 40, 10, 3-cone, and SS to Thorton while weighing 22 more pounds. He's also very intense.

Kerr and Ken Bishop are my favorite later rounds DTs.

Bruce Gaston is also interesting. He's hard to evaluate because he played out of position as a 3-4 DE and often rushed from the outside or set the edge against the run on the outside. I would like to see him as a 4-3 DT at 6-2, 308 (college weight 316).

I like both Kerr and Gaston. I actually love the depth at DT in rounds 4-7 and probably wouldn't draft a DT in rounds 1-3 unless there was a really good value to be had. Reid, Uko, Thornton, Bromley or Gaston in the 4/5 range + get 1 of Bishop, Kerr, or Villami Moala in the 7th I'd actually feel pretty good about DT going into the season.

 

[Alexander]

What about Ego Ferguson or Anthony Johnson if they were there in the fourth? i think Ferguson would make a good hybrid 1 tech, I would even say he is just a level below Jernigan, he is capable of being just as good at the 1 tech, not at 3 tech though.

Those two, especially Anthony Johnson are getting bad reviews and Johnson is being compared to Sam Montgomery.

 

[XxTDxX]

I like your first 3 rounds but aside from Ken Bishop I don't like the rest of the draft.

 

[DFWJC]

Good players.
I'll be surprised if Barr gets past the Titans.

Gardner in the 5th seems 1-2 rds early, but I could be wrong.

Don't know Thornton well enough....will check him out a bit more.

 

[Biggems]

I'm not against picking him in the 5th. His numbers other than the forty are impressive. I don't recall many guys over 250 jumping that high. Some people do believe that the best measure of a DE is the 3-cone time.

I pulled up my notes on the DTs. Thorton would be a good 1-tech. He has good quickness for a 1 and is strong. He was ranked 466 by NFLDS at the time of my notes. I see he is now ranked 167.

Have you watched Zack Kerr? He is very quick for a big man. He has very similar 40, 10, 3-cone, and SS to Thorton while weighing 22 more pounds. He's also very intense.

Kerr and Ken Bishop are my favorite later rounds DTs.

Bruce Gaston is also interesting. He's hard to evaluate because he played out of position as a 3-4 DE and often rushed from the outside or set the edge against the run on the outside. I would like to see him as a 4-3 DT at 6-2, 308 (college weight 316).

lots of good value in the 7th round this year, too bad we only have 6 picks.......wouldn't mind having 10-12, this way we don't have to risk losing them in the UDFA free-for-all.

prospects I would take in the 7th round:
QB Brock Jensen
FB Trey Millard
OG Kadeem Edwards
OG Kevin Danser
OT Matt Hall
OT Donald Hawkins
DT Zach Kerr
DT Ken Bishop
DE Chris McAllister
CB Aaron Colvin

 

[unionjack8]

love it. good draft. identifies need, accurate player value, i take it in a heartbeat

 

[Risen Star]

I'm seriously getting the draft itch too. I guess my internal clock is telling me it should have taken place this past week.

It's the greatest sporting event on the planet.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I'm seriously getting the draft itch too. I guess my internal clock is telling me it should have taken place this past week.

It's the greatest sporting event on the planet.

Agreed.

 

[starfrombirth]

Seriously, this wait is ridiculous.....

This 1 includes a trade in the 2nd round. I'm gonna say 1 of Amaro or Seferian-Jenkins is still on the board at 47 so the Pats trade up to fill the void in their 2 TE scheme. We get their 2nd and 3rd for our 2nd and 7th.

1st- Anthony Barr DE UCLA- Freak athlete with the potential to be a dominant edge rusher. Might not be a full time player year 1 but he can still make an impact.

4th- Khyri Thornton DT Southern Miss- His quick 1st step jumps off the tape. Add in that hes a strong 6-2 305 and I see him as a perfect 1 tech.
5th- Ben Gardner DE Stanford- Underrated. Played mostly as an undersized 3-4 DE in college so most people don't realize his athleticism. Relentless motor.
7th- Spencer Long OG Nebraska- Preseason all American who tore his acl week 1. Could be a steal.
7th- Ken Bishop DT NIU- Quick and powerful. I'd take his skill set on the roster over a guy like Hayden
Comp- Marquis Flowers LB Arizona- Holloman 2.0. 6'3 230 and sub 4.6 40. Played both LB and S in college
Comp- Mike Flacco TE Delaware- Joe's brother is intriguing. 26 and only played 1 year of football at Delaware after spending the last 4 years playing minor league baseball. He's 6'5 245 and apparently ran a 4.68 40 at his pro day.
Comp- Keith Price QB Washington- I like him....He's small but has the arm to make all the throws and has pretty good scramble ability.

Sooo.. you took a project with our 1st pick - He is routinely blocked by TE's at the college level. He will take AT LEAST 2 years to get big enough and strong enough to be an every down DE at the NFL level and then waited to the 4th rnd to address our biggest need... good mock. Sounds about right...

sorry about the sarcasm but I am so tired of people talking about Barr's freakish athletism as something that he will be able to get by with. Look at his tape... He gets stoned by TE's all the time. If there is an open lane between him and the qb then yes, no one can outrun him but he will get bullied in the NFL. Don't believe me but come talk to me in 2 years. I feel that if you don't go dline completely until the 4th, then you've wasted those picks. I'm sorry but that is just my opinion. In this draft you have completely neglected our biggest needs.

Having said all this. . . thanks for putting the effort in. Everyone has a right to their opinion no matter what anyone else thinks. Look forward to your other posts.

 

[tm1119]

Sooo.. you took a project with our 1st pick - He is routinely blocked by TE's at the college level. He will take AT LEAST 2 years to get big enough and strong enough to be an every down DE at the NFL level and then waited to the 4th rnd to address our biggest need... good mock. Sounds about right...

sorry about the sarcasm but I am so tired of people talking about Barr's freakish athletism as something that he will be able to get by with. Look at his tape... He gets stoned by TE's all the time. If there is an open lane between him and the qb then yes, no one can outrun him but he will get bullied in the NFL. Don't believe me but come talk to me in 2 years. I feel that if you don't go dline completely until the 4th, then you've wasted those picks. I'm sorry but that is just my opinion. In this draft you have completely neglected our biggest needs.

Having said all this. . . thanks for putting the effort in. Everyone has a right to their opinion no matter what anyone else thinks. Look forward to your other posts.

6'3 260 is plenty of size to be a WDE in Marinelli's scheme. Barr will be just fine. He needs technique refinement, there's nothing wrong with his physical tools. But we can agree to disagree on Barr, if you don't like him you don't like him.

And I don't understand what you saying with not adding d line. This draft would add our primary nickle pass rusher in Barr, a guy I believe would be a major rotation piece at 1 tech next to Melton in Thornton, another DE for the rotation with a great motor in Gardner, and then a big powerful DT that could possibly push for a roster spot. What exactly are you expecting? That we are going to go d line with 3 of the first 4 picks?

 

[xwalker]

Sooo.. you took a project with our 1st pick - He is routinely blocked by TE's at the college level. He will take AT LEAST 2 years to get big enough and strong enough to be an every down DE at the NFL level and then waited to the 4th rnd to address our biggest need... good mock. Sounds about right...

sorry about the sarcasm but I am so tired of people talking about Barr's freakish athletism as something that he will be able to get by with. Look at his tape... He gets stoned by TE's all the time. If there is an open lane between him and the qb then yes, no one can outrun him but he will get bullied in the NFL. Don't believe me but come talk to me in 2 years. I feel that if you don't go dline completely until the 4th, then you've wasted those picks. I'm sorry but that is just my opinion. In this draft you have completely neglected our biggest needs.

Having said all this. . . thanks for putting the effort in. Everyone has a right to their opinion no matter what anyone else thinks. Look forward to your other posts.

You have to keep in mind that he played OLB not DE. The OLB does many jobs other than just rushing the QB. I think what you're seeing on some of those TE blocks is that he does not have a "go" to rush in those situations. He is required to stack the blocker similar to a DT playing a 2-gap technique. This is to guard against a short pass to the RB or a run by the QB. I'm not saying that this was the issue 100% of the time, but I did see it often. I remember seeing DWare doing the same thing in RR's defense.

I did see him bull-rush some OLinemen on occasion so I don't think he is completely without strength. His technique is raw and leads to some plays where he does get blown up from being out of position from a leverage perspective.

The 3-4 OLB position is one of the hardest to learn and play on defense. You have to be able to cover, play the run and rush the passer. There is a lot of reading the play involved. IMO, being as good as he is after only playing defense for 2 years is impressive.

If he is drafted by the Cowboys, it would be fine if he was a nickel pass rushing specialist as a rookie. Marinelli should be able to significantly improve his technique is he limits his responsibilities. Play WDE in Marinelli's scheme if already a much simpler position than playing OLB in the 3-4.

He just turned 22 and at 6-5, 255 he has room to get bigger and stronger.

Obviously, it would be nice to have a more developed player at #16, but if he was more developed, then there would be no chance of him being available.

Guys like Ezekiel Ansah and JPP were raw when they were drafted.

 

[visionary]

6'3 260 is plenty of size to be a WDE in Marinelli's scheme. Barr will be just fine. He needs technique refinement, there's nothing wrong with his physical tools. But we can agree to disagree on Barr, if you don't like him you don't like him.

And I don't understand what you saying with not adding d line. This draft would add our primary nickle pass rusher in Barr, a guy I believe would be a major rotation piece at 1 tech next to Melton in Thornton, another DE for the rotation with a great motor in Gardner, and then a big powerful DT that could possibly push for a roster spot. What exactly are you expecting? That we are going to go d line with 3 of the first 4 picks?

What worries me about Barr more than anything is the feeling that he plays with an offensive players mentality ie less intensity
I don't know if this is true but I don't want anyone on the DL that does not play like his hair is on fire no matter what his measureables are
What do you think about his attitude?

 

[starfrombirth]

6'3 260 is plenty of size to be a WDE in Marinelli's scheme. Barr will be just fine. He needs technique refinement, there's nothing wrong with his physical tools. But we can agree to disagree on Barr, if you don't like him you don't like him.

And I don't understand what you saying with not adding d line. This draft would add our primary nickle pass rusher in Barr, a guy I believe would be a major rotation piece at 1 tech next to Melton in Thornton, another DE for the rotation with a great motor in Gardner, and then a big powerful DT that could possibly push for a roster spot. What exactly are you expecting? That we are going to go d line with 3 of the first 4 picks?

ummm.... barr is 242 lbs soak and wet and their isn't a person anwhere who thinks he is NFL ready at this point. In every experts opinion he needs to get better technique and strength.

 

[tm1119]

ummm.... barr is 242 lbs soak and wet and their isn't a person anwhere who thinks he is NFL ready at this point. In every experts opinion he needs to get better technique and strength.

Kinda weird that he weighed in at the combine at 255 then.....yes he's raw but you're over exaggerating what he needs to be in the 1st year, even 2. Put him in nickel packages and tell him to get the qb. He can win with athleticism against a lot of NFL tackles even right now. The weight will come with an nfl strength and conditioning program and a year with Marinelli and the technique will come as well.