Trade Down? No Way, Trade Up For A Nose Tackle

[Arch Stanton]

If Ngata does drop down the board then I doubt Bill will hesitate to trade up for him. Perhaps 3-4 spots, though somehow I think Ngata will be long gone by then.

 

[CrazyCowboy]

Haloti Ngata -- in a New York second

 

[DandyDon]

I'm guessing we are one of the two teams considering Sam Adams (Cincy is the only confirmed of the two teams reported to be interested). With only two teams interested, the price should not be inflated. Dallas would fit for him, as he would only have to play 40-50% of the snaps. Also, the silence about the 2nd interested team points to Dallas (ever since Parcells arrived, the team has been very hush regarding offseason moves). Just speculating.

Bill doesn't like "fat" players - he loves his guys to be in condition. With that being said, I don't think Dallas is looking at Adams.

 

[junk]

A) As someone pointed out, Glover wasn't a nose tackle. That's why he isn't here anymore. So we don't have to replace our backup nose tackle since that wasn't Glover.

B) Has Bunkley ever played the nose in a 3-4? FSU plays a 4-3 base defense. Trading up to get a backup NT who hasn't even played the position doesn't make a lot of sense. Granted Dallas drafted Ware as a 3-4 OLB which was a new position, but they had a gaping hole there and much of his rookie responsibility wasn't that much different from the rush 4-3 DE role he had in college.

Glover wasn't a NT? Who started the bulk of the season there? Who would have played there if Fergy went down?

I think NT is a need, just not early. I think you can develop a guy there. Fergy was a 7th.

Bunkley is only getting NT consideration because he bulked up so much. On nickel downs, Canty, Spears, Ratliff, Johnson and Ellis are all capable of playing inside.

 

[Clove]

I appreciate your post, but I agree with the posters that want Fifta. He's a short stocky strong as an ox player, and you can get him in the Fifth. Parcells got Ferguson in the 7th back in the day.
I'm hearing reports now that the Boys may not be looking at FS in the first couple of rounds and i've heard Jerry himself say that drafting a Tackle in the 1st is not good business, since he has Flozell, and doesn't want to pay left tackle money to a Right tackle.

So this leaves Linebacker or QB. I know what reports have said, but either Jerry is trying to look out for the future of this team by looking at QB, or BP is nervous about going into the season with what we have at backup QB.

So My guess is Linebacker in the 1st round, and that's no knock against NTs.

 

[PullMyFinger]

UUUMMMM Ratliff

 

[lkelly]

Glover wasn't a NT? Who started the bulk of the season there? Who would have played there if Fergy went down?

I think NT is a need, just not early. I think you can develop a guy there. Fergy was a 7th.

Bunkley is only getting NT consideration because he bulked up so much. On nickel downs, Canty, Spears, Ratliff, Johnson and Ellis are all capable of playing inside.

If Glover was a NT, and a pro-bowl player, why did Dallas simply cut him? Did they confuse him with Crispin Glover and make a clerical error?

He was a 4-3 DT playing a greatly reduced role out of position. On passing downs he didn't usually line head up with the center.

Does Roy Williams get typecast and paid as a LB when he lines up near the LOS and blitzes? After all, he's in formation like a linebacker much of the time in that case.

Back to the case on Bunkley - he has hardly gotten "huge" in that 350lb. range, and he hasn't played the NT position. I have trouble seeing the logic of trading up to draft a player who plays the same role as the pro-bowl guy you just cut because he didn't fit your scheme. Did Atlanta continue to go after run-and-shoot WRs after June Jones left?

 

[Bob Gray]

So now not only are we supposed to take a backup NT in round 1, but someone wants to use multiple picks to trade UP to get a backup player? give me a break


and then there is this little tidbit that makes me think a teenager wrote this

Comedy gold.

 

[Dalmations202]

Bill doesn't like "fat" players - he loves his guys to be in condition. With that being said, I don't think Dallas is looking at Adams.

I think you are correct. Add in Bills ego for former players, with the fact that Big Sam is "Big", and that the Cowboys are trying to get younger, and I think that Sam will not be a Cowboy.

But common reasoning says that as a backup, with experience, with talent, coming back to his home state, and 3-time pro-bowler would be great fit, and make perfect logical sense. Especially since they have cap room and are supposedly going for it all this year.

Of course -- when has sense and GM'ing ever come together?

 

[VirusX]

When the Cowboys lost LaRoi Glover they were essentially left with Jason Ferguson as the only real Nose Tackle on the roster. This is not good. Coach Parcells will be the first to tell you that the Nose Tackle is probably the most important position in the 3-4 defense.​

Ferguson is the guy who has to control his area at the point of attack. Now this may entail him being attacked by two offensive lineman, a Center and either of the Guards. The Nose Tackle is considered the brick wall in a 3-4 defense. Are we to expect Jason Ferguson and his 30 something year old frame to hold up after playing 90% of the defensive plays for 16 regular season games?

Who just said the name Thomas 'Pepper' Johnson? Come on now folks. This guy showed some jump in his step last training camp and he contributed a play or two last season, but he is not ready to get into a partnership with Jason Ferguson at the Nose Tackle spot.

Brodrick Bunkley from the Florida State Seminoles is though. He's the 'LaRoi Glover Jr.' in my opinion. 6'2 and 302lbs of muscle just waiting for the opposing running back. Fergy and Bunkley has a nice ring to it. Fergy on first and second down, then Bunkley comes in on third down to help out. Of course there are all kinds of situations you could rotate these two guys in and out of the lineup and not worry about losing much as far as production.

Not feeling the Bunkley idea? How about Haloti Ngata from Oregon. He's even bigger than Bunkley at 6'4 338lbs. The reason I like Bunkley before this kid is that I would like a little different type of guy to spell the starter. Bunkley is a little better at getting to the quarterback as far as I am concerned. If Bunkley is Glover Jr. then Ngata is Fergy Jr. if you know what I mean. Ngata is rated higher by a lot of draft boards and that's because he is being looked at as a starter in some team's 3-4 defense in 2006.

Why do I want to trade up for a guy who will not start right away? Because in a lot of eyes this 2006 season is where the Cowboys are 'going for gold'. So if this is the year to pull out all the stops by signing Free Agents then why wouldn't the Cowboys use the same motto when they approach the 2006 NFL Draft? I say go full steam ahead in every aspect of this off season and leave not stone unturned heading into opening day on September 10, 2006.

Losing Glover was a big hit to the Cowboys defense right? So then someone has to be brought in to replace him. I don't see any Free Agents left that fit the bill. There is no one on the roster who has been waiting in the wings. Then the draft seems like the only other option to me.

Someone will trade with the Cowboys because everyone loves Jerry Jones. The man can work something out where Dallas gets a spot within the top 12 picks. I would assume this would get them either Bunkley or Ngata. If Jerry is reading this then he should agree with me and just go for it.

Think about it Cowboy fans. Jerry took a huge chance by signing Terrell Owens. Jerry made sure he filled the most needed area of Right Tackle with Jason Fabini. Jerry got his Kicker and Linebacker with Mike Vanderjagt and Akin Ayodele. Jerry even made sure he had replacements for Larry Allen and Dan Campbell before the Cowboys even knew these two guys were definitely not coming back. Jerry was even making an attempt to bring Keyshawn back to the team before he signed with the Panthers.

All those moves tell us that this is the year of the Dallas Cowboys. They are thinking big for the 2006 season. So then think big in the draft and make sure you get a replacement for LaRoi Glover which was the Cowboys biggest loss so far.

Trade up to take Brodrick Bunkley or Haloti Ngata in the first round of the 2006 NFL Draft and be happy about it.

:angryno: No way, we have more pressing needs then a backup NT with a first round selection.

 

[ghst187]

Sam Adams is the epitome of a 3-4 stuffer and he's still hanging out as a FA...
if we are going to make our run this year then he would be a fairly inexpensive guy that might be able to play 1 or 2 more years.
Plus there's Fifita hanging around on day 2 of the draft.

trading up for a NT is silly..

 

[AMERICAS_FAN]

Sam Adams is the epitome of a 3-4 stuffer and he's still hanging out as a FA...
if we are going to make our run this year then he would be a fairly inexpensive guy that might be able to play 1 or 2 more years.
Plus there's Fifita hanging around on day 2 of the draft.

trading up for a NT is silly..

Word on the stree is that Sam Adams is too FAT for BP's liking. Now he were to put down those Sam-Admas beers....???

**

 

[Chuck 54]

When the Cowboys lost LaRoi Glover they were essentially left with Jason Ferguson as the only real Nose Tackle on the roster. This is not good. Coach Parcells will be the first to tell you that the Nose Tackle is probably the most important position in the 3-4 defense.​

Ferguson is the guy who has to control his area at the point of attack. Now this may entail him being attacked by two offensive lineman, a Center and either of the Guards. The Nose Tackle is considered the brick wall in a 3-4 defense. Are we to expect Jason Ferguson and his 30 something year old frame to hold up after playing 90% of the defensive plays for 16 regular season games?

Who just said the name Thomas 'Pepper' Johnson? Come on now folks. This guy showed some jump in his step last training camp and he contributed a play or two last season, but he is not ready to get into a partnership with Jason Ferguson at the Nose Tackle spot.

Brodrick Bunkley from the Florida State Seminoles is though. He's the 'LaRoi Glover Jr.' in my opinion. 6'2 and 302lbs of muscle just waiting for the opposing running back. Fergy and Bunkley has a nice ring to it. Fergy on first and second down, then Bunkley comes in on third down to help out. Of course there are all kinds of situations you could rotate these two guys in and out of the lineup and not worry about losing much as far as production.

Not feeling the Bunkley idea? How about Haloti Ngata from Oregon. He's even bigger than Bunkley at 6'4 338lbs. The reason I like Bunkley before this kid is that I would like a little different type of guy to spell the starter. Bunkley is a little better at getting to the quarterback as far as I am concerned. If Bunkley is Glover Jr. then Ngata is Fergy Jr. if you know what I mean. Ngata is rated higher by a lot of draft boards and that's because he is being looked at as a starter in some team's 3-4 defense in 2006.

Why do I want to trade up for a guy who will not start right away? Because in a lot of eyes this 2006 season is where the Cowboys are 'going for gold'. So if this is the year to pull out all the stops by signing Free Agents then why wouldn't the Cowboys use the same motto when they approach the 2006 NFL Draft? I say go full steam ahead in every aspect of this off season and leave not stone unturned heading into opening day on September 10, 2006.

Losing Glover was a big hit to the Cowboys defense right? So then someone has to be brought in to replace him. I don't see any Free Agents left that fit the bill. There is no one on the roster who has been waiting in the wings. Then the draft seems like the only other option to me.

Someone will trade with the Cowboys because everyone loves Jerry Jones. The man can work something out where Dallas gets a spot within the top 12 picks. I would assume this would get them either Bunkley or Ngata. If Jerry is reading this then he should agree with me and just go for it.

Think about it Cowboy fans. Jerry took a huge chance by signing Terrell Owens. Jerry made sure he filled the most needed area of Right Tackle with Jason Fabini. Jerry got his Kicker and Linebacker with Mike Vanderjagt and Akin Ayodele. Jerry even made sure he had replacements for Larry Allen and Dan Campbell before the Cowboys even knew these two guys were definitely not coming back. Jerry was even making an attempt to bring Keyshawn back to the team before he signed with the Panthers.

All those moves tell us that this is the year of the Dallas Cowboys. They are thinking big for the 2006 season. So then think big in the draft and make sure you get a replacement for LaRoi Glover which was the Cowboys biggest loss so far.

Trade up to take Brodrick Bunkley or Haloti Ngata in the first round of the 2006 NFL Draft and be happy about it.

So you think we're going to trade draft picks and move up in round 1 in order to draft a guy who will be the backup NT to Ferguson???? I don't think so.

 

[dcfanatic]

After reading all the responses here's some more of my take on this NT thing.

Glover and Bunkley are similar in body type, but Bunkley is bigger. He's over 300 lbs so he can play NT in the 3-4.

Drafting a LB at 18. Who is goign to be there that can step in and start from day one? I don't think anyone. And what about Burnett whom we just drafted in round 2 last season. The Cowboys aren't gonna just give up on him after one season.

Some people keep saying that Bunkley would be a backup. Maybe we should think of him as the 'pass rushing' NT who comes in on 3rd down, maybe some 2nd and longs. Plus he would be the future every down player and that future may just be 2007 because if Fergy doesn't play way better than he did last season he won't be here in 2007.

To the people who say the Cowboys should wait and find a developmental guy in the later rounds. We didn't wait and draft a young WR to develop. We didn't wait and draft a young RT to develop. We didn't wait and get a young kicker to develop. This 2006 is the one where the Cowboys go for the big one so why not get the best NT available if you can right now? If we are gonna wait and develop a NT, then just develop Pepper Johnson who is already in the defense for a year.

Why trade up for a backup? IMO, whomever gets drafted in the 1st round won't be a starter on this team. The defense is too young as it is to just throw another rookie out there. The OLB is either going to be a FA(yet to be signed), Burnett or Singleton.

And in closing. I like this board because even though people disagree with my opinion, which is all it is, no one just comes on and rips me up in a personal manner by calling me stupid, foolish or dumb. I appreciate that very much.

I also see a lot of you guys want Ngata before Bunkley. I think he will be gone in the first 8 picks. If Dallas doesn't get up there to get Bunkley in the top 12 then the Eagles will get him in my opinion. I really think Bunk is a good one and I would hate for the Eagles to get him, lol.

 

[ghst187]

Word on the stree is that Sam Adams is too FAT for BP's liking. Now he were to put down those Sam-Admas beers....???

**

isn't fat exactly what a NT should be?

I also don't think that a NT in the 3-4 is a position you use a first round pick on. All you're wanting the guy to do is be fat and take up space and blockers. I know we paid big money for Fergi, but where was he drafted again?
I think Pepper J is a fine backup. Sure I would be very concerned if Fergi went down and Pepper was all we had but I think someone like Fifita on day 2 would be fine. We can't have an all star, first round draft pick, probowler as a backup at every position. This isn't the early 90s.

 

[Bledsoe4MVP]

Ferguson is getting up there in years too....I kind of like this idea, in fact I would be willing to trade Julius Jones and the #18 pick if it meant getting into the top 10.

Probably not likely to happen though, we need to address DT at some point in the draft for depth at the very least

 

[ghst187]

Ferguson is getting up there in years too....I kind of like this idea, in fact I would be willing to trade Julius Jones and the #18 pick if it meant getting into the top 10.

Probably not likely to happen though, we need to address DT at some point in the draft for depth at the very least

Yep, lets trade our first, second, third, Julius Jones, Roy Williams, and TNew for a backup NT. Dude, we can't trade JJ. We need more draft picks, not less.

 

[lkelly]

Glover and Bunkley are similar in body type, but Bunkley is bigger. He's over 300 lbs so he can play NT in the 3-4.

You lost me right there. Just being 300lbs. makes you a good candidate for a 3-4 NT? Take a look around the NFL and tell me how many DTs that are playing exclusively in a 4-3 are 300lbs. So all those guys are good fits as well?

Drafting a LB at 18. Who is goign to be there that can step in and start from day one?

Probably 3 or 4 guys.

To the people who say the Cowboys should wait and find a developmental guy in the later rounds. We didn't wait and draft a young WR to develop.

Patrick Crayton

We didn't wait and draft a young RT to develop.

Rob Petitti

We didn't wait and get a young kicker to develop.

When was the last kicker we drafted? Outside of the draft, Dallas has been trying to develop young kickers for a decade.

We're talking about the Dallas Cowboys, right? :

This 2006 is the one where the Cowboys go for the big one so why not get the best NT available if you can right now? If we are gonna wait and develop a NT, then just develop Pepper Johnson who is already in the defense for a year.

Still confused about this "go for the big one" logic. We want to draft Ferguson's backup? Or is your FSU boy better than the guy we signed to a huge deal last offseason? If so, that's a rotten talent evaluation by big Bill.

Why trade up for a backup? IMO, whomever gets drafted in the 1st round won't be a starter on this team. The defense is too young as it is to just throw another rookie out there. The OLB is either going to be a FA(yet to be signed), Burnett or Singleton.

Dallas could draft a starter at 3 of the OL positions. They could draft a starter at LB. They could draft a starter at S. They could draft a "starter" in 3 WR sets.

Maybe you are just rationalizing a way to fit Bunkley into a 3-4 scheme. Nothing wrong with that, but many of us disagree.

And in closing. I like this board because even though people disagree with my opinion, which is all it is, no one just comes on and rips me up in a personal manner by calling me stupid, foolish or dumb. I appreciate that very much.

That's one of the best things I've read on this board in eons. Well said.

 

[Chuck 54]

AT pick #18, I think a WR (Santonio Holmes) would start as the #3 receiver ahead of Crayton easily. I think an OLB would start before the season was halfway over if not earlier. I know a FS anytime in round 1, even with a trade down, would start.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Trade Down? No Way, Trade Up For A Nose Tackle

No thanks.