Training camp battles

GimmeTheBall! said:
Someone elaborate re the 3 QB positions.
It would be folly --- folly, I say! --- to keep only 2 QBs!
Like I said earlier, we are only 1 sprained ankle away (Dak) from a panicked Jerry working the phones for a rethread QB who'd come in cold, rusty and not knowing the system or playbook.
I say keep White and Rush! Develop them!!!

Any thought how we can keep all three or keep 2 and stash White or Rush?

Hollah and brings me a dollah!
Click to expand...
To keep a 3rd QB we would have to go shorter at RB, WR or TE. It's doable though
 
Irvin88_4life said:
So I have seen a few bash threads....... Which is normal but I thought I would try and get something going these last 3 weeks before camp starts that can bring some positivity. Feel free to add any y'all want to talk about.


QB backup spot
The Mike White and Cooper Rush battle will be very important this training camp. We will decide to keep 2 QBs or 3. Perhaps make a trade for a defender with the one that doesn't win the backup spot. We have seen what happens when our starting QB goes down with injury so having a QB that can win some games in that time will be crucial in this quest for 6....... Prediction Mike White wins the job and Rush is traded. Only keeping 2 QBs will allow us to go long at positions like WR, RB or TE.


RB back up spots
Zeke is starter with no questions asked. I believe Rod is the backup with no questions as well. That brings us to the guys behind those two. Will Austin be classified as a running back or receiver? You have Bo that was drafted with upside and Darius Jackson but how will he perform coming back from the season ending injury. I think we keep 4 backs so only 2 will make it from Bo, Jackson and maybe Austin. If Austin goes as a receiver than I'm predicting Bo and Jackson both make it.

TE all spots up for grabs
Now we come to the first position without a for sure starter. Swaim has the experience, Shultz and Jarwin will get a chance at starting as well. Rico I'm not sure will even make the team but has some upside especially as a receiving threat. David Wells has some potential but maybe he gets a look at FB with Jamize. My prediction that Shultz will win the job but Jarwin and Swaim will get plenty of playing time as well.

WR all spots
Receivers has a ton of numbers and many combinations could make the team. Hurns and Gallop are locks in my opinion which leaves 4 spots open. Some feel Beasley is a lock and it's possible but I don't feel that way. Wilson, Noah Brown, Cannon, Lenoir, Thompson, maybe Austin, Williams and Beasley will all be competing for those spots. It's possible we try and trade another receiver away but not a ton of value in these guys. I think Wilson will surprise a ton of people and will be a top 4 receiver on this team. Receiver cuts will be difficult and some fan favorites might be in the chopping block. If Austin isn't a receiver my 6 would be...... Hurns, Gallop, Wilson, Beasley, Thompson, Noah Brown.


OL.......
This group is pretty much set both starters and backups. Only thing will be decided is how many we keep 8-10. I think we go with 8 maybe 9 allowing us to go deep at other positions. Can Green redeem himself and beat our Martin or Looney......I don't think so.

DE backups and RE starter
Lawrence is starter at LE and really no question about it. Crawford on the other hand could be the starter at RE or go back to DT with Collins injury and Irving suspension. DE is really deep and the battles that happen behind Lawrence will be great to watch. Gregory will be back but will he make a push? Taco improved as the season went on so can he win that starting spot. Ealy is a veteran who has played in the Superbowl, can Tapper stay healthy. Armstrong is a guy we drafted and has some skill. Do we keep 4 or 5? Tons of talent do we try and trade one away? My prediction is Lawrence and Taco are starters but Gregory, Early and Armstrong will get plenty of game time. Tapper already had an injury so not a good start so far.

DT??????
Is clearly the weak spot on DL. Irving is suspended and Collins is injured. Ward might excel at DT and to be honest might be starter week 1. I think Crawford will play DT since we have issues there and a ton of talent at the end spots. You still have guys like Jones and Price and maybe even Neal that can make the team as backups giving the issues with Collins and Irving. I think we need to go high in the draft next year for a DT and from what I understand Dallas has wanted Donald and Vea in the past few drafts. Could you imagine the DL had we gotten both of them. Lawrence, Vea, Donald, Taco/Gregory........wow. We wouldn't have Leighton or Zack Martin though but maybe the OL would have been Tyron, Collins, Frederick, Williams, Fleming. Dominant DL and a very good OL.....I like

LB
I decided to put all 3 LB spots together. Lee is easily the only for sure starter. That leaves 2 starting spots and all backup spots for grabs. Leighton and Jaylon most likely will be the other 2 starters but who plays which spot. I think Leighton will take the middle and put Jaylon in the outside. Will Wilson step up or does guys like Thomas, Covington, Quiero and the guy we signed from Seattle push him off the roster. The backups will be wide open and will be interesting to watch battle it out.

CB.....3-6 open
With Byron moving to corner it's clear he is the starter. Awuzie will start on the other side. Brown has taken reps over Lewis but that will be a battle to watch for the 3rd and 4th spot. The next 2 spots will be open for Thomas, White and Kelly to battle out. With Kris Richards I think White will surprise people as his skill set fits well for what he likes. The secondary is young with a ton of upside.

Safety thin but set
Heath and Woods are the starters with Frazier as the backup. The undrafted guy, I think Robinson is his name, will have a chance to be the backup FS. Right now only 3 are no doubt making the roster, some want to see a trade for Earl Thomas and maybe we do that. If so the safety spots go from being thin to being a real strength.

Special teams guys are set and need no backups as L.P, Jones and Bailey are all 3 some of the best at their position.

Kick and punt return man
Austin is considered the punt returner and maybe Thompson as the kick returner. I think both returning spots are wide open and a battle I'm excited to watch play out in camp. Switzer was in the top 10 last season in both kick and punt returns but it's no longer in the team. That opens the door and hopefully we take a step forward and not a step backwards. Switzer took 1 to the house last season and gave us some big returns to help give our offense a short field. Austin can do that with punts but not kick offs. My prediction is Austin in punts and Thompson on kickoffs.




All in all I see a ton of battles that will go on in camp this season. We have starting jobs on the line and backup jobs on the line. Some fan favorites won't make the team and it's possible we make some trades or more signings before completing the final 53. I pray for a healthy camp and preseason and can't wait to see these guys battle it out for a chance to play on America's Team.
Click to expand...

Good post. I agree with most of it.

If White is #2, then no need to keep Rush.
I think we keep 4 backs so only 2 will make it from Bo, Jackson and maybe Austin.
Click to expand...

Awesome, Bo Jackson is the backup RB.

I'll be surprised if Shultz is the #1 TE to start the season. With some many new and young WRs, a rookie TE really pushes the lack of Cowboys scheme experience issue.

I would like to have the same list for WRs but TWill has a guaranteed salary and has scheme knowledge which they may value with some many new and/or young players. There is nobody I want to cut to keep TWill. I agree that Wilson will be better than fans expect; although his playing time might not come early in the season.

Fleming is #6 on the OL. Looney likely to stay but Marcus was a Center in college and has played OG in the NFL. He appears to be much more talented than Looney if he can just find consistency. If only 8, then 2 or 3 from Looney, M.Martin and Green. UDFA Jake Campos was a good player in college at LT. K. Edwards would be a functional backup at OG if needed.

At DE, DLaw and Taco are locks. They'll want to keep Armstong unless he just fails in training camp. Gregory likely makes the roster if eligible. Crawford is likey but Ealy has similarities (Big, good run defender) and costs 5M less. Crawford is reported to be at his lightest weight since being drafted. Playing him at DT seems less likely than in the past. Tapper already had a concussion in OTAs.

I don't concede that DT will definitely be a weakness. Collins has played through similar foot injuries in the past and is a quality 3-tech. Irving is only out 4 weeks. Datone Jones played quite well last season despite being thrown into action with no time in the scheme. Price looked solid at 1-tech but only played a couple of games after Paea "retired". Ward seems like a perfect fit in the Marinelli scheme. He definitely has talent but something was off with him in Oakland from a mental-makeup perspective. Marinelli's simplified DL scheme may be what he needs. Antwaun Woods might not make the team but looks like a player than can hold up against the run quite well. Woods would have looked like a stud back in the years of Nick Golden Cock Hayden being the starting 1-tech. Woods and all others mentioned look much more like NFL ready players than guys that played last season like Ash, Ross and Neal. If necessary during the Irving absence, any of Crawford, Ealy or Taco could play a few snaps at DT.

Lee is great when healthy. Last season Hitchens was the only legit back for Lee but Hitchens was the starting MLB when healthy. This season Thomas is a legit back for Lee in both base and especially Nickel/Dime. I assume Jaylon will get some reps at WLB in training camp unless he is clearly wins the MLB spot over Vander Esch. If Jaylon is the starting MLB then Vander Esch would likely get some reps at WLB in addition to MLB and possibly SLB. Assuming Vander Esch wins the MLB job, then Jaylon might be the SLB. Wilson's spot could be in jeopardy as Covington could be the backup there is Jaylon is the starter. Eric Pinkins has been out of college for 3 seasons and has only played 5 snaps on defense (Seahawks/Giants) He did play 75% of the ST snaps in the 5 games he played for the Giants in 2016. He was not on an NFL team in 2017. Justin March-Lillard seemed to be a star of OTAs.

At CB the Kris Richard scheme changes everything. It is much more unique than I realized. I can see why Richard wants Byron Jones at CB. Physically he is the prototype for this scheme. Awuzie is also a perfect fit. The coaches and other players put Brown in a bad position last year. They had him play outside leverage which requires a help defender on the inside but that help defender was rarely there or was late. It's good that Lewis has pracriced 2nd team because that means he is not pigeonholed at slot-only CB. With his short area quickness and quality play against the run, he is an ideal slot-CB. He is likely the best DB on the team to cover a Cole Beasley type WR.

At Safety, they can go light on numbers because Byron Jones could always play Safety to finish out a game because he has played both FS and SS in the past. Woods, Heath, Frazier. Marqueston Huff has started an NFL game and has played about 400 snaps on defense. There are two 6-2 udfa DBs that could push for a spot.

There are a few options at KR.

PR concerns me. They should not depend on Tavon Austin at PR. If he does not have problems fielding punts in the pre-season then give him a chance but they need a legit 2nd option. Cedrick Wilson was a steady PR in college.
 
xwalker said:
Good post. I agree with most of it.

If White is #2, then no need to keep Rush.


Awesome, Bo Jackson is the backup RB.

I'll be surprised if Shultz is the #1 TE to start the season. With some many new and young WRs, a rookie TE really pushes the lack of Cowboys scheme experience issue.

I would like to have the same list for WRs but TWill has a guaranteed salary and has scheme knowledge which they may value with some many new and/or young players. There is nobody I want to cut to keep TWill. I agree that Wilson will be better than fans expect; although his playing time might not come early in the season.

Fleming is #6 on the OL. Looney likely to stay but Marcus was a Center in college and has played OG in the NFL. He appears to be much more talented than Looney if he can just find consistency. If only 8, then 2 or 3 from Looney, M.Martin and Green. UDFA Jake Campos was a good player in college at LT. K. Edwards would be a functional backup at OG if needed.

At DE, DLaw and Taco are locks. They'll want to keep Armstong unless he just fails in training camp. Gregory likely makes the roster if eligible. Crawford is likey but Ealy has similarities (Big, good run defender) and costs 5M less. Crawford is reported to be at his lightest weight since being drafted. Playing him at DT seems less likely than in the past. Tapper already had a concussion in OTAs.

I don't concede that DT will definitely be a weakness. Collins has played through similar foot injuries in the past and is a quality 3-tech. Irving is only out 4 weeks. Datone Jones played quite well last season despite being thrown into action with no time in the scheme. Price looked solid at 1-tech but only played a couple of games after Paea "retired". Ward seems like a perfect fit in the Marinelli scheme. He definitely has talent but something was off with him in Oakland from a mental-makeup perspective. Marinelli's simplified DL scheme may be what he needs. Antwaun Woods might not make the team but looks like a player than can hold up against the run quite well. Woods would have looked like a stud back in the years of Nick Golden Cock Hayden being the starting 1-tech. Woods and all others mentioned look much more like NFL ready players than guys that played last season like Ash, Ross and Neal. If necessary during the Irving absence, any of Crawford, Ealy or Taco could play a few snaps at DT.

Lee is great when healthy. Last season Hitchens was the only legit back for Lee but Hitchens was the starting MLB when healthy. This season Thomas is a legit back for Lee in both base and especially Nickel/Dime. I assume Jaylon will get some reps at WLB in training camp unless he is clearly wins the MLB spot over Vander Esch. If Jaylon is the starting MLB then Vander Esch would likely get some reps at WLB in addition to MLB and possibly SLB. Assuming Vander Esch wins the MLB job, then Jaylon might be the SLB. Wilson's spot could be in jeopardy as Covington could be the backup there is Jaylon is the starter. Eric Pinkins has been out of college for 3 seasons and has only played 5 snaps on defense (Seahawks/Giants) He did play 75% of the ST snaps in the 5 games he played for the Giants in 2016. He was not on an NFL team in 2017. Justin March-Lillard seemed to be a star of OTAs.

At CB the Kris Richard scheme changes everything. It is much more unique than I realized. I can see why Richard wants Byron Jones at CB. Physically he is the prototype for this scheme. Awuzie is also a perfect fit. The coaches and other players put Brown in a bad position last year. They had him play outside leverage which requires a help defender on the inside but that help defender was rarely there or was late. It's good that Lewis has pracriced 2nd team because that means he is not pigeonholed at slot-only CB. With his short area quickness and quality play against the run, he is an ideal slot-CB. He is likely the best DB on the team to cover a Cole Beasley type WR.

At Safety, they can go light on numbers because Byron Jones could always play Safety to finish out a game because he has played both FS and SS in the past. Woods, Heath, Frazier. Marqueston Huff has started an NFL game and has played about 400 snaps on defense. There are two 6-2 udfa DBs that could push for a spot.

There are a few options at KR.

PR concerns me. They should not depend on Tavon Austin at PR. If he does not have problems fielding punts in the pre-season then give him a chance but they need a legit 2nd option. Cedrick Wilson was a steady PR in college.
Click to expand...
Great write up. I can agree with most everything you wrote. Point being, training camp will have tons of battles for spots. I like that we will have competition at almost every position. Fleming being the swing tackle is a huge upgrade.
 
Irvin88_4life said:
Great write up. I can agree with most everything you wrote. Point being, training camp will have tons of battles for spots. I like that we will have competition at almost every position. Fleming being the swing tackle is a huge upgrade.
Click to expand...

It's the most interesting part of NFL football to me. How players develop or don't is fun to follow. The roster cut/keep decisions can be as important as draft decisions or game day coaching decisions.

Example: Just signing/keeping 1 middle of the road backup LB would have been a huge asset last season when both Hitchens and Lee were out.

The 2017 version of Justin Durant was well below middle of the road. They desperately needed even a 2015 version of Durant.

It was a minimal issue until both Lee/Hitchens were out and Jaylon had to play way more snaps than he was prepared to play.
 
jobberone said:
DE:
  1. Dorance Armstrong-Probable
  2. Vidauntae Charlton-LOCK
  3. Tyrone Crawford-He'll get some snaps at DE but he's a DT on this team this year
  4. Kony Ealy-Tapper or Ealy
  5. James Hearns-outside
  6. Datone Jones-Probably competes DT
  7. Austin Larkin-outside
  8. Demarcus Lawrence-LOCK
  9. Charles Tapper-Tapper or Ealy
  10. Randy Gregory-LOCK
We will keep 5 maybe 6 but latter is pushing the envelope. 5 DE make for 5 DT.

DT:

1. Irving-LOCK
2. Crawford-LOCK
3. Collins-LOCK ??PUP
4. Jihad Ward-Competes
5. D Woods-outside
6. B Price-Competes
7. D Ross-outside
8. Neal-outside
9. Ash-outside
10. D Jones-Competes

But who knows?
Click to expand...
After Irving
Collins
Crawford
all else is the biggest I dont know in all the team
I like Ward,BPrice and want to see Woods do something
 
If this is such a great thread, why isnt the OP writing for the Cowboys.

Dont get excited, most people get the reference.
 
Irvin88_4life said:
RB back up spots
Zeke is starter....You have Bo that was drafted with upside and Darius Jackson but how will he perform coming back from the season ending injury. I think we keep 4 backs so only 2 will make it from Bo, Jackson and maybe Austin. If Austin goes as a receiver than I'm predicting Bo and Jackson both make it.
Click to expand...

Am I the only one that kept reading Bo Jackson’s name. Lol.., then I thought what what would our run game look like with Zeke and Bo Jackson running behind this line.. whoa. Ok, I need another beer.
 
LocimusPrime said:
  1. Dorance Armstrong
  2. Vidauntae Charlton
  3. Tyrone Crawford
  4. Kony Ealy
  5. James Hearns
  6. Datone Jones
  7. Austin Larkin
  8. Demarcus Lawrence
  9. Charles Tapper


Those are the DEs on our roster currently. Obviously Randy Gregory will be the 10th.
How many will we keep 6? I’m guessing 5,6 7 will be cut for sure plus either 9 or 4

Now if we only keep 5.......it gets complicated
Click to expand...

I think with Irving out, Jones will be counted as a DT. Crawford's ability to play both inside and out also adds to that position. My prediction is that we'll keep six DEs and four DTs. Of those DEs, I feel fairly certain about Lawrence, Charlton, Crawford and Armstrong. If Gregory is reinstated, I believe he'll make the roster as well, leading the last spot between Ealy and Tapper. My DTs are Collins, Price, Ward and Jones with Irving on suspension.

With 10 DL, I'm keeping 6 linebackers and 9 DBs to make up my 25 on defense. I'd go with fewer DBs because I think there could be a drop-off after the top seven, but I don't think Dallas will go with fewer than nine. The seven I believe are certain are Jones, Awuzie, Lewis and Brown at corner and Woods, Heath and Frazier at safety. I'll have to see it to believe it with White, Thomas, Kelly and Robinson.

The six linebackers I have are Lee, Vander Esch, Smith, Thomas, Wilson and Covington. So Lanning and Quiero will have to force the team to keep a seventh LB over a DE or DB.
 
jobberone said:
DT is as hard to predict as DE.
Click to expand...
Not really. The talent level there is so poor and the numbers are so scarce, you can already pencil in most of them.

Collins, Irving (post-suspension), shockingly Ward and unfortunately Price are all but locks.

There is no dark horse draft pick or unheralded UDFA to hang your hat on.

Datone Jones and Antwan Woods are about the only bets that could surprise the way things stand now.

This is the one position on the team where we are likely to point at going into 2019 as a massive miss by the front office.
 
Irvin88_4life said:
That's your opinion and I respect it but there isn't a back in the league better than Zeke. From running the ball to blocking to catching, Zeke is ahead and it's not close....... In my opinion
Click to expand...

I hear ya. Definitely better pass catchers out there. Definitely guys more mature and with a better attitude, better leaders. He is a bruiser and I love the guy. Gurley is a guy I would definitely take. Not many though.
 
xwalker said:
It's the most interesting part of NFL football to me. How players develop or don't is fun to follow. The roster cut/keep decisions can be as important as draft decisions or game day coaching decisions.

Example: Just signing/keeping 1 middle of the road backup LB would have been a huge asset last season when both Hitchens and Lee were out.

The 2017 version of Justin Durant was well below middle of the road. They desperately needed even a 2015 version of Durant.

It was a minimal issue until both Lee/Hitchens were out and Jaylon had to play way more snaps than he was prepared to play.
Click to expand...
I totally agree with this. I firmly believe the Superbowl is won in the off-season/training camp and preseason. Hate to say this but look at the eagles, they had almost the exact same injuries as we did but coaching and depth was able to overcome it. Sure some luck is involved but how many games do we win with better coaching? Or better depth at LB like you stated?

I think that's why Dallas went after Leighton in the draft and got Covington as well as brought in Thomas. OL was another, we drafted Connor and signed both Fleming and Martin.
 
Knotamus said:
Am I the only one that kept reading Bo Jackson’s name. Lol.., then I thought what what would our run game look like with Zeke and Bo Jackson running behind this line.. whoa. Ok, I need another beer.
Click to expand...
That's why I used the first game in Bo than the last name with Jackson. Seems better than it is haha
 
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