Truth is Relative ?

[Mike 1967]

If Truth were relative in relation to time then I need to go back and pull some of my college midterms.

A "C" in Calculus in 1987 could very well be an "A" today.

Damn...I wish someone had pointed this out to me sooner.

 

[Hoov]

well, i think there is an absolute truth, but a person cannot see that absolute truth completely. Everything we see is colored by past conditioning. It takes a lot to break through that conditioning layer by layer to reveal a vision that is closer and closer to the absolute truth. Like peeling an onion, that is why the lotus flower is used as a symbol of enlightenment or illumination.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

well, i think there is an absolute truth, but a person cannot see that absolute truth completely. Everything we see is colored by past conditioning. It takes a lot to break through that conditioning layer by layer to reveal a vision that is closer and closer to the absolute truth. Like peeling an onion, that is why the lotus flower is used as a symbol of enlightenment or illumination.

That aint all it's used for.

 

[Hoov]

That aint all it's used for.

your referring to tantra ??

If not then i must be slow today cause im not getting it

 

[Mike 1967]

well, i think there is an absolute truth, but a person cannot see that absolute truth completely. Everything we see is colored by past conditioning. It takes a lot to break through that conditioning layer by layer to reveal a vision that is closer and closer to the absolute truth. Like peeling an onion, that is why the lotus flower is used as a symbol of enlightenment or illumination.

I can go with that to an extent.

I also believe that there are certain Truths that are beyond our comprension. These Truths can only be grasped if they are revealed to us by a higher power.

 

[Hoov]

I can go with that to an extent.

I also believe that there are certain Truths that are beyond our comprension. These Truths can only be grasped if they are revealed to us by a higher power.

well yes, but even so.....even as a higher power reveals something to us, does it still get slightly colored by our own individuality in the process ??

Do we ever see something 100% totally as it is ? especially the higher mysterious workings of the universe ?

Also there must always be things even higher that just cannot be grasped because no human has the ability to grap it even if it is working around us all the time.

But when talking about levels of awareness, we should always start with ourself first, self awareness leads to awareness of higher things, but first we must realize how our mind works to be able to combat our own bias and conditioning.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

your referring to tantra ??

If not then i must be slow today cause im not getting it

Lotus in relation to Opiates but I digress.

 

[Hoov]

Lotus in relation to Opiates but I digress.

well opiates will definitely open the mind up to see things that went unnoticed before

 

[Mike 1967]

well yes, but even so.....even as a higher power reveals something to us, does it still get slightly colored by our own individuality in the process ??

Do we ever see something 100% totally as it is ? especially the higher mysterious workings of the universe ?

Also there must always be things even higher that just cannot be grasped because no human has the ability to grap it even if it is working around us all the time.

But when talking about levels of awareness, we should always start with ourself first, self awareness leads to awareness of higher things, but first we must realize how our mind works to be able to combat our own bias and conditioning.

I would agree that you would need to start with yourself first...if that is all you had to go with.

But, if you had a situation whereby the greater power provided you with a direct revelation....then I would start there.

I would also add...that if the higher power created you....then if you are starting with yourself ...your starting point is still in essense the higher power. And that this not to say that you are in essence the higher power. It is only to say that the higher power that created you gave you awareness of the higher power in the way that that power created you.

I would go further to say...that in our particular instance...the higher power went as far as to put the revelation of it's law in our heart and mind.

Specifically, laws of logic...morality...conscience.

In taking a self analyzation of our hearts....what we find is a direct revelation that is not of our own making.

 

[Mike 1967]

I especially like the way that Bono put it.

 

[Reality]

There is no "truth" .. there is only the perception of truth. What we claim as "fact" is simply our beliefs backed by some form of evidence. However, you can find evidence to prove or disprove just about anything if you dedicate enough time.

 

[Hoov]

There is no "truth" .. there is only the perception of truth. What we claim as "fact" is simply our beliefs backed by some form of evidence. However, you can find evidence to prove or disprove just about anything if you dedicate enough time.

well, i think that is accurate. Though i also think that there could be absolute truths, though i would say that those truths are veiled so that you really would never know if your perception of the truth was exactly 100% accurate.

But there is the phenomenon that occurs from time to time where you just know something, more in an instinctive, intuitive or what some would call psychic way of just knowing, then that thing that you knew was going to happen actually happened. or you knew someone was thinking something and you told them what they were thinking about and you were right. that is what i consider just being so in tune with the energies in your immediate surroundings, being so in tune with that part of the universe in that instance that you actually are in unison or harmony with things for a moment.

That is why i think there is some form of absolute truth. Maybe the way the universe is synchronized or something, that it is working off some truth that just is.

But, if i try to explain this to anyone, then it is me forming my perception of that truth based on my experiences and limited understanding.

 

[WV Cowboy]

There is no "truth" .. there is only the perception of truth. What we claim as "fact" is simply our beliefs backed by some form of evidence. However, you can find evidence to prove or disprove just about anything if you dedicate enough time.

You guys seem way more educated than me, but maybe there is such a thing as reading too much or reading the wrong books, I don't know.

But the sun rises and sets every day, and that is the truth.

I got more.

 

[Hoov]

You guys seem way more educated than me, but maybe there is such a thing as reading too much or reading the wrong books, I don't know.

But the sun rises and sets every day, and that is the truth.

I got more.

But it really doesnt rise, it just appears to as the earth spins on its axis

 

[WV Cowboy]

But it really doesnt rise, it just appears to as the earth spins on its axis

Right, but the truth is that it is there every day.

 

[Mike 1967]

There is no "truth" .. there is only the perception of truth. What we claim as "fact" is simply our beliefs backed by some form of evidence. However, you can find evidence to prove or disprove just about anything if you dedicate enough time.

That is hilarious

I exist right now. That is truth regardless of your or my perception.

If you step in front of a moving truck today.....then the truth is that the truck will continue to move and you will no longer be standing in the road. That "truth" will exist regardless of your "perception".

You should change your handle.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

That is hilarious

I exist right now. That is truth regardless of your or my perception.

If you step in front of a moving truck today.....then the truth is that the truck will continue to move and you will no longer be standing in the road. That "truth" will exist regardless of your "perception".

You should change your handle.

I fart...therefore I am.

 

[Mike 1967]

But it really doesnt rise, it just appears to as the earth spins on its axis

Yes..the truth is that the earth spins on an axis. Some men in the past believed this because his perception was dictated by his exerience. Specifically, in his perspective he saw the sun rising...so that is what he believed. But the truth was the phenomena he witnessed was caused by a spinning rotation of the earth itself.

In Reality's opinion, perception dictates truth. If this were the case....then the sun did rise. And the earth was once flat....because these were the primary perceptions of past generations.

But this is of cource ludicrous. The earth was round, and the earth rotated. This truth existed regardless of my our your or thier perception.

 

[Mike 1967]

I fart...therefore I am.

Exactly

It is an issue of Cause and Effect

The sound of the Fart was the effect. The effect required a Cause. You are that cause. In order to be a cause you must have some form of existence. Without existence, there is no cause. Hence...there is no fart.

 

[Mike 1967]

But it really doesnt rise, it just appears to as the earth spins on its axis

But we also know that the Earths rotation is constantly slowing down. Given enough time the Earth will discontinue it's rotation...unless some outside force comes along and effects that balance that is currently in play.

So..one could say that it is NOT an absolute Truth that the earth spins...because by all indications it will discontinue to spin at some point in the future.

So...the Earths rotation is not an absolute Truth.

But...on the other side of the coin.....it is an absolute Truth to say that the Earth is spinnning today. Whether it discontinues it rotation in the future or not...it will always be absolutely true that it was spinning in it's rotation on 11/3/5.

Mike 1967 will not be alive in 2145. But it is an absolute truth that Mike 1967 was alive on 11/2/5. Regardless of anyones perception.