USA Today CowboysWire: Two FAs Dallas should consider adding to the trenches

[cowboyschmps3]

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/lists/cowboys-free-agency-bakhtiari-mone-2024-training-camp/

The logic the author presents for adding Bakhtiari is solid.

That said, the somewhat greater need, by virtue of the thinness at the position, is at 1-Tech.

He makes the case for Mone from SEA, but I'd argue that you really need someone who may be a bit older yet has been a starter even last season and significantly more snaps, Lawrence Guy, ex-Patriot. Only reason for prioritizing a guy like Mone would be if you were looking for a longer term option (ie, since he's about 5 yrs younger), but that's almost never the case when DAL goes free agent shopping, and shouldn't be here either. It's been pointed out before that Guy wasn't NE's NG in their 3-4, but he has the body frame to fill the 1-tech role in the 4-3. Former Man of the Year on that roster, and has such a story, having overcome dyslexia... would, like Bakhtiari, be a super addition both on the field and in the locker room.

I’d be very happy if both of these guys come.

 

[_sturt_]

Think there's good reason to suspect Bakhitiari is angling toward a contract with the Super Bowl champs, talking like he does about desiring to be the LT of a future SB MVP. Of course, a less strict interpretation just sees it as eliminating teams like the Commanders from his radar. His insistence that he wants to be a more than a fill-in, wants to be some team's permanent answer at LT for awhile, that also doesn't bode well for a reunion with McCarthy.

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/green-bay-packers/david-bakhtiari-free-agent-rumors-update/

Wish there was stronger cause for optimism on that front. Guyton needs to earn that job, and there's exceptional reason to be skeptical that he'll be able to achieve that in one training camp.

 

[cowboyec]

mone.

 

[_sturt_]

mone.

1-tech is the somewhat more vivid issue, for sure.

I'm encouraged that they haven't signed a UFL guy in that vein... suggests they may be taking a more serious approach to filling out the roster at that position.

 

[gimmesix]

If it makes people feel better, think of it this way...

Edoga is currently the most likely default if Guyton hasn't earned the starting job yet in Oxnard.

And.

Bakhtiari represents a potential upgrade over Edoga.

Me, I've not forgotten that we were told before the draft, and then again after the draft that Guyton has a huge upside, but that he's not yet ready... he's got some learning to do, and it might be a lot to expect that he'd just need training camp to get there.

Seems that some, if not many, seem to have just tossed that earlier objective report aside, intent on imagining the best case scenario as a virtual lock.

Edoga took every snap in OTAs and minicamp... as expected. That's all I've got to say about that.

So sign Bakhitiari, go to Oxnard, and may the best man win the starting job... and may the best man win the backup.

If they view Edoga as the LT if Guyton fails, then I agree with you. I think we'll move Smith out to LT if Guyton fails and play Bass at LG.

However, what I would like for us to do right now instead of giving Edoga the snaps with the first team is split the snaps between Richards and Guyton to give both of them more work there. I would love for Richards to build on what he showed and be the player who can step in if Guyton isn't ready. We know Edoga is not the answer and I'd prefer not to move Smith unless absolutely necessary.

 

[gimmesix]

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/lists/cowboys-free-agency-bakhtiari-mone-2024-training-camp/

The logic the author presents for adding Bakhtiari is solid.

That said, the somewhat greater need, by virtue of the thinness at the position, is at 1-Tech.

He makes the case for Mone from SEA, but I'd argue that you really need someone who may be a bit older yet has been a starter even last season and significantly more snaps, Lawrence Guy, ex-Patriot. Only reason for prioritizing a guy like Mone would be if you were looking for a longer term option (ie, since he's about 5 yrs younger), but that's almost never the case when DAL goes free agent shopping, and shouldn't be here either. It's been pointed out before that Guy wasn't NE's NG in their 3-4, but he has the body frame to fill the 1-tech role in the 4-3. Former Man of the Year on that roster, and has such a story, having overcome dyslexia... would, like Bakhtiari, be a super addition both on the field and in the locker room.

I would be OK with guy filling the veteran role at NT. Some decline there, but I don't know if it is any different than Hankins', maybe even a little less.

 

[_sturt_]

Richards to build on what he showed

I'm not sure 39 snaps is enough to get me to think of Richards as a serious candidate to back up Guyton.

But that said, I do expect that Richards and Waletzko both will get significant preseason work to determine if either or both deserve consideration for the 53-man.

They brought Edoga back, of course, and that hints that they feel like he's a legitimate consideration.

I think we'll move Smith out to LT if Guyton fails and play Bass at LG.

I only buy that if it's decided that Guyton's really not nearly as ready as they'd thought. If they're going to move Smith, it's going to be with the intent to leave him there the entire season, not a stop gap until Guyton develops... not wanting to move Smith back and forth. And for all the love they may hold for Bass, I'm not sure they see him yet as anything significantly better than Edoga.

 

[gtb1943]

And Seahawks who now are a 3-4 signed Johnathan Hankins (6-3 320) to back up Jarran Reed (6-3 307) and released Mone.

the hags are working at saving money. so that might not be that significant. Hankins only cost them $2 million.
He is a real nose tackle and would be important stopping the run. If we can get him fairly cheap I say go for it

 

[Rockport]

1-tech is the somewhat more vivid issue, for sure.

I'm encouraged that they haven't signed a UFL guy in that vein... suggests they may be taking a more serious approach to filling out the roster at that position.

Nothing wrong with giving any player a chance no matter the pedigree when it costs you absolutely nothing.

 

[xwalker]

Bakhtiari would make sense if the team felt Gyton was nowhere close to being ready after watching him in training camp.

Always injured.

Pay him by the game...they did it with Greg Hardy...

 

[_sturt_]

Nothing wrong with giving any player a chance no matter the pedigree when it costs you absolutely nothing.

While true, my intended point was only that if you're signing a UFL player, you're almost certainly just looking to add a camp body.

At 1-tech, we have exactly zero proven NFL-quality players right now, of course. You've got to take that seriously enough to add a player who isn't just filling the back of the roster, but who legitimately could earn substantial snaps over the course of the season.

Always injured.

Pay him by the game...they did it with Greg Hardy...

I won't say no.

But he played about 10-ish years of relatively injury-free football until he got knocked out of the 2021 season, and then again, the 2023 season. I'd want to know what my doctors think about the risk of injury given his surgery and rehab, of course, but I suspect he's not expecting much salary in this comeback season anyhow. And at 32, that's not especially old for an O-lineman. Really like the upside if the medical people are encouraging.

 

[Rockport]

While true, my intended point was only that if you're signing a UFL player, you're almost certainly just looking to add a camp body.

At 1-tech, we have exactly zero proven NFL-quality players right now, of course. You've got to take that seriously enough to add a player who isn't just filling the back of the roster, but who legitimately could earn substantial snaps over the course of the season.


I won't say no.

But he played about 10-ish years of relatively injury-free football until he got knocked out of the 2021 season, and then again, the 2023 season. I'd want to know what my doctors think about the risk of injury given his surgery and rehab, of course, but I suspect he's not expecting much salary in this comeback season anyhow. And at 32, that's not especially old for an O-lineman. Really like the upside if the medical people are encouraging.

Camp bodies like Turpin and Aubrey? Don’t trash the UFL so easily.

 

[_sturt_]

Camp bodies like Turpin and Aubrey? Don’t trash the UFL so easily.

Not the same thing. You know this, c'mon.


Kicker first.

A kicker or a punter in the USFL/UFL has no opponent on the other side of the line fighting with him for advantage. The only difference between kicking a 53 yard FG at Legion Field versus doing so in AT&T is the possible intimidation factor of having such a larger audience. This is why I was quite possibly the very first poster on this board to ever mention the possibility that the Birmingham kicker known there as Aubrey-matic could be worth a look... why wouldn't you take seriously a kicker who was doing well there?


Now let's talk punt returner. Yes, it's more difficult than K or P to make an NFL team, but it's still something different than making an NFL team at an offensive or defensive position. While you can't say, as was said above, the PR has no opponent on the other side fighting with him for advantage, you can say that the skill set required to be a good punt returner more expeditiously translates because the punt play itself doesn't vary... you always have the same basic elements every time. And the speed of the game doesn't even change substantially, largely because it's so much more about timing, given the fact you can't even be hit (legally) until the ball falls out of the sky into your hands.

It is reasonable, then, to think that players who excel in those two roles are particularly well-postured to do well if they get a chance with an NFL team in need.


Not the case with the non-special teams positions. So much greater difficulty because you routinely are being challenged straight-up by at least one opposing player who might be faster or stronger or smarter than you, or sometimes all of the above, hence the fact that those are the players who tend to get drafted and, then, who tend to stick. The UFL success you may have had is so much more likely to be a function of the fact you weren't having to compete against NFL quality players snap after snap after snap.

I'm not being dismissive of the LB and CB we just signed out of some obstinate attitude, but out of simple, objective logic.

 

[Rockport]

Not the same thing. You know this, c'mon.


Kicker first.

A kicker or a punter in the USFL/UFL has no opponent on the other side of the line fighting with him for advantage. The only difference between kicking a 53 yard FG at Legion Field versus doing so in AT&T is the possible intimidation factor of having such a larger audience. This is why I was quite possibly the very first poster on this board to ever mention the possibility that the Birmingham kicker known there as Aubrey-matic could be worth a look... why wouldn't you take seriously a kicker who was doing well there?


Now let's talk punt returner. Yes, it's more difficult than K or P to make an NFL team, but it's still something different than making an NFL team at an offensive or defensive position. While you can't say, as was said above, the PR has no opponent on the other side fighting with him for advantage, you can say that the skill set required to be a good punt returner more expeditiously translates because the punt play itself doesn't vary... you always have the same basic elements every time. And the speed of the game doesn't even change substantially, largely because it's so much more about timing, given the fact you can't even be hit (legally) until the ball falls out of the sky into your hands.

It is reasonable, then, to think that players who excel in those two roles are particularly well-postured to do well if they get a chance with an NFL team in need.


Not the case with the non-special teams positions. So much greater difficulty because you routinely are being challenged straight-up by at least one opposing player who might be faster or stronger or smarter than you, or sometimes all of the above, hence the fact that those are the players who tend to get drafted and, then, who tend to stick. The UFL success you may have had is so much more likely to be a function of the fact you weren't having to compete against NFL quality players snap after snap after snap.

I'm not being dismissive of the LB and CB we just signed out of some obstinate attitude, but out of simple, objective logic.

It is the same thing. The Cowboys found gold with Aubrey and silver with Turpin no matter the position. That has nothing to do with finding talent where you can find talent. You know this so come on man.

 

[Rockport]

Not the same thing. You know this, c'mon.


Kicker first.

A kicker or a punter in the USFL/UFL has no opponent on the other side of the line fighting with him for advantage. The only difference between kicking a 53 yard FG at Legion Field versus doing so in AT&T is the possible intimidation factor of having such a larger audience. This is why I was quite possibly the very first poster on this board to ever mention the possibility that the Birmingham kicker known there as Aubrey-matic could be worth a look... why wouldn't you take seriously a kicker who was doing well there?


Now let's talk punt returner. Yes, it's more difficult than K or P to make an NFL team, but it's still something different than making an NFL team at an offensive or defensive position. While you can't say, as was said above, the PR has no opponent on the other side fighting with him for advantage, you can say that the skill set required to be a good punt returner more expeditiously translates because the punt play itself doesn't vary... you always have the same basic elements every time. And the speed of the game doesn't even change substantially, largely because it's so much more about timing, given the fact you can't even be hit (legally) until the ball falls out of the sky into your hands.

It is reasonable, then, to think that players who excel in those two roles are particularly well-postured to do well if they get a chance with an NFL team in need.


Not the case with the non-special teams positions. So much greater difficulty because you routinely are being challenged straight-up by at least one opposing player who might be faster or stronger or smarter than you, or sometimes all of the above, hence the fact that those are the players who tend to get drafted and, then, who tend to stick. The UFL success you may have had is so much more likely to be a function of the fact you weren't having to compete against NFL quality players snap after snap after snap.

I'm not being dismissive of the LB and CB we just signed out of some obstinate attitude, but out of simple, objective logic.

And why try to downplay them for trying to improve the team? Please explain that.

 

[_sturt_]

@Rockport just seeing this. Dismissiveness isn't a valid argument. It's not even an argument. You'd have had to give me some minimal attempt to debunk what was said if you wanted an actual dialogue here. You gave me nothing but some form of personal indignation. What I said is accurate/truthful. What I said is logical/reasonable. Should just not have responded at all rather than these sour nothings. I'll at least give you this much credit, though... you didn't just make stuff up and pretend it to be substantive, as sometimes can happen on internet sports forums.

Back to the original point of the thread... someone at Landry Hat appears to be on this same bandwagon, not that that should be reason for encouragement necessarily...

https://thelandryhat.com/posts/cowb...ckers-much-worse-stephon-gilmore-01j155k77tnh

 

[Rockport]

@Rockport just seeing this. Dismissiveness isn't a valid argument. It's not even an argument. You'd have had to give me some minimal attempt to debunk what was said if you wanted an actual dialogue here. You gave me nothing but some form of personal indignation. What I said is accurate/truthful. What I said is logical/reasonable. Should just not have responded at all rather than these sour nothings. I'll at least give you this much credit, though... you didn't just make stuff up and pretend it to be substantive, as sometimes can happen on internet sports forums.

Back to the original point of the thread... someone at Landry Hat appears to be on this same bandwagon, not that that should be reason for encouragement necessarily...

https://thelandryhat.com/posts/cowb...ckers-much-worse-stephon-gilmore-01j155k77tnh

I’m not refuting what you said. Just pointing out you took a positive and felt the need to poo poo on it to turn it negative.