Voch Lombardi film session on LB Leighton Vander Esch

[America's Cowboy]

 

[reddyuta]

I think right now he is a mixed bag who is not ready to start for you,I will be ok with this but it will be another Taco situation where we expect too much from a raw player.

 

[America's Cowboy]

I think right now he is a mixed bag who is not ready to start for you,I will be ok with this but it will be another Taco situation where we expect too much from a raw player.

Agreed for the most part. My issue is with drafting players in the 1st round that are years away from starting in the NFL. 1st round picks should be Day 1 starters. Anything less is setting your team back that season or the next while your competition is drafting starters.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

He focused in a little too much on the negative snaps. I actually think he does a good job of working through traffic especially when blockers go low. That said, he could use his hands more effectively. His best football is ahead of him. Sean Lee seems like he'd be a perfect mentor to him.

 

[bleachedwheat]

dudes a hater, you can find bad plays for every player there is. He focuses on him getting held up at the line of scrimmage, you are supposed to hold the point of attack as a MLB he is doing exactly what he was coached to do; I don't get this guys criticism at all. His game tape early in the year wasn't as good but every single game moving forward in the season he was exponentially better, every game.

 

[DanA]

dudes a hater, you can find bad plays for every player there is. He focuses on him getting held up at the line of scrimmage, you are supposed to hold the point of attack as a MLB he is doing exactly what he was coached to do; I don't get this guys criticism at all. His game tape early in the year wasn't as good but every single game moving forward in the season he was exponentially better, every game.

There's holding the point of attack....but that isn't it.



Watch this video of Myles Jack and tell me what Vander Esch is doing is the same. Watch the Guards head snap back as he tries to block Jack, look at Jack's posture, look at him sink his hips, watch him disengage and make tackles. Then watch Vander Esch, he's bigger, got 34-inch arms so should be good, but he doesn't sink his hips, he doesn't place his hands and he's washed out falling to the ground rather than making tackles. That's the difference between a good point of attack blocker and VDE......it's a world apart.

 

[Longboysfan]

Bobby Carpenter.

 

[CATCH17]

There's holding the point of attack....but that isn't it.



Watch this video of Myles Jack and tell me what Vander Esch is doing is the same. Watch the Guards head snap back as he tries to block Jack, look at Jack's posture, look at him sink his hips, watch him disengage and make tackles. Then watch Vander Esch, he's bigger, got 34-inch arms so should be good, but he doesn't sink his hips, he doesn't place his hands and he's washed out falling to the ground rather than making tackles. That's the difference between a good point of attack blocker and VDE......it's a world apart.

These things can be learned.

The upside with Vander Esch is why he is liked.

You got a 6’4 256 pound linebacker with incredible vert and 40 that was also productive but still raw.

 

[DanA]

These things can be learned.

The upside with Vander Esch is why he is liked.

You got a 6’4 256 pound linebacker with incredible vert and 40 that was also productive but still raw.

Isn't that exactly what the guy is saying though. I think the quote he made was "he's a couple of lessons away from being a good NFL linebacker". That's my take as well, but I don't want to wait for a guy to develop and use pick 19. Are we getting value from a 2-3 year starter at LB or a plug and play OG that gives us 5 years? I get why you'd do it for a QB, maybe even a LT or DE. But a LB.....those guys aren't expensive enough to waste starting years while they develop IMO.

 

[CATCH17]

Isn't that exactly what the guy is saying though. I think the quote he made was "he's a couple of lessons away from being a good NFL linebacker". That's my take as well, but I don't want to wait for a guy to develop and use pick 19. Are we getting value from a 2-3 year starter at LB or a plug and play OG that gives us 5 years? I get why you'd do it for a QB, maybe even a LT or DE. But a LB.....those guys aren't expensive enough to waste starting years while they develop IMO.

I understand but who knows how long it will take for someone to learn and be productive.


Everyone was saying that Carson Wentz was going to take time to develop and in only year 2 he was looking like the league MVP before injury.


I don't know what this guys work ethic is but if it's high then just take him and forget about it. We're picking 19 so we won't be getting the most polished players anyways.

 

[Klingo3034]

If he's just a few lessons away I still take him in 2nd round. He can learn a lot with Cowboys coaches and under Sean Lee how to use his hands more and shred tackles or avoid them.

 

[PUSHfold]

If we want this kid he'll have to be grabbed at 19. He will be gone by 30 more than likely. So even trading back to 25+ is risky...hell he could even be gone before our pick. Both of the MLBs who appear to have super star potential in this draft are raw.

 

[Sydla]

There's holding the point of attack....but that isn't it.



Watch this video of Myles Jack and tell me what Vander Esch is doing is the same. Watch the Guards head snap back as he tries to block Jack, look at Jack's posture, look at him sink his hips, watch him disengage and make tackles. Then watch Vander Esch, he's bigger, got 34-inch arms so should be good, but he doesn't sink his hips, he doesn't place his hands and he's washed out falling to the ground rather than making tackles. That's the difference between a good point of attack blocker and VDE......it's a world apart.

And should be noted that the Jags tried Jack at MIKE and eventually had to move him to SAM and put Pozluzny back at MIKE.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

If we want this kid he'll have to be grabbed at 19. He will be gone by 30 more than likely. So even trading back to 25+ is risky...hell he could even be gone before our pick. Both of the MLBs who appear to have super star potential in this draft are raw.

Agreed...if we don't take him I can see the Steelers or the Patriots all over this kid.

 

[McKDaddy]

I have actually watched his footage several times as he gained popularity trying to see what i was missing. One of the thoughts that sticks in my head about him dropping into coverage is "yeah, if you were tracking his assignments per play he "technically" did what he was supposed to do but man so much of it seemed very labored." It's like you could see the wheels turning and the body churning but nothing seemed natural or fluid. Couple of times, when he had dropped to his depth in his zone his head started going side to side like he was watching a furious tennis rally. If he had any read of the offense he would have known that the receiver outside of him had worked well deeper than his zone. At the most, one quick peek outside to verify. Indicated to me he was following a script rather than having any feel for the situation.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

I have actually watched his footage several times as he gained popularity trying to see what i was missing. One of the thoughts that sticks in my head about him dropping into coverage is "yeah, if you were tracking his assignments per play he "technically" did what he was supposed to do but man so much of it seemed very labored." It's like you could see the wheels turning and the body churning but nothing seemed natural or fluid. Couple of times, when he had dropped to his depth in his zone his head started going side to side like he was watching a furious tennis rally. If he had any read of the offense he would have known that the receiver outside of him had worked well deeper than his zone. At the most, one quick peek outside to verify. Indicated to me he was following a script rather than having any feel for the situation.

It is no secret that he is raw.
He is really just learning.
He had a graduating class of 11 in his High School...Not 111...11
They played two way iron football.
He did not start at Boisie State until this season.

He is still raw and you can see the talent and many feel he is nowhere near his ceiling yet.

Now will it pan out...time will tell.

 

[McKDaddy]

It is no secret that he is raw.
He is really just learning.
He had a graduating class of 11 in his High School...Not 111...11
They played two way iron football.
He did not start at Boisie State until this season.

He is still raw and you can see the talent and many feel he is nowhere near his ceiling yet.

Now will it pan out...time will tell.

Wouldn't you agree that should equal 3rd or later round pick, not 1st round though? Don't mind taking some risk on upside but I can't take that much. Maybe he will be a beast but we've got a supposed top 5 LB that hasn't shown himself to be a beast yet.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Wouldn't you agree that should equal 3rd or later round pick, not 1st round though? Don't mind taking some risk on upside but I can't take that much. Maybe he will be a beast but we've got a supposed top 5 LB that hasn't shown himself to be a beast yet.

I think the LBs will be over drafted in this draft because this is a weaker draft of LBs in the top half.

I think LVE will not make it out of the first round.

I think if we pass on him the Steelers or Patriots will jump all over that pick.

But..that is just what I think.

Part of the draft is what you envision a player can turn into.

Some Like Ridley at WR because he is the most pro ready WR in the draft...he is close to his ceiling imo
others like DJ Moore or other WRs...they are not at their ceilings yet imo and teams project them to be better even though it may take some time.

 

[Klingo3034]

It is no secret that he is raw.
He is really just learning.
He had a graduating class of 11 in his High School...Not 111...11
They played two way iron football.
He did not start at Boisie State until this season.

He is still raw and you can see the talent and many feel he is nowhere near his ceiling yet.

Now will it pan out...time will tell.

Only one season is not enough. That shows he's learning and adjusting. Not developed yet. Very concerning.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Only one season is not enough. That shows he's learning and adjusting. Not developed yet. Very concerning.

I think it means he has a higher ceiling and when he gets it down he is going to be a beast.

But...it's the draft and a crap shoot.

Would rather trade down some and take him, would rather the draft fall better for us so that there is another player there we would rather have (james or r.smith).