Was going back to the 4-3 Defense a huge mistake?

[Aven8]

Parcells made the switch as he said it was easier to find players for the 34 then then the 43. What he meant was pass rushing DE's. I mean if you actually kook at it today how many are elite out there? Quinn, Ansah (maybe), Mario (maybe), who else?

34 OLB's now? The list is long. Think about it this way, as great as Von miller is he would get swallowed up in the 43 due to his weight.

Bid bad DE's don't grow on trees, but the tweeners do.

 

[rockj7]

Lee is small? Lee is arguably one of the best LBers in the league when he's healthy. He's worth that risk. Lee is not even remotely needed mentioning in your post as a downer on the defense.

3 small words that are so BIG when talking about Lee " When he's healthy"

 

[phildadon86]

If Hardy goes, I think you're strengthening one spot (1-tech), while greatly weakening another (defensive end).

So you fix one and break another.

Hardy will know his fate after the draft. No one really wants him it seems. Rosenhaus can say whatever he wants, doesn't mean there is interest anywhere.

 

[Redball Express]

It's harder to find 34 ends and DT on top of a DC that can call it.

The biggest problem was what was accomplished under Rob Ryan.

We drafted and signed so many bodies to help his schemes that are either no longer on the team or have just failed to meet expectations vs. their salary..

that has been the problem.

We are overhauling that old 3-4 defense continuously.

And the marginal success under Romo has also masked the defensive problems.

All those 8-8 seasons lead many to think the defense was adequate and just missing a player or two when that was not the case.

The scheme and DC needed to be changed..which is what happened.

But we are now in the backwash of that conundrum.

It's going to take more time and more drafts but now we see weaknesses in the offense and need to address that.

Say whatever you want..this is a critical time for this team.

I think the offense is falling apart and the pressure to have Romo succeed as our only hope is going to meet with failure again.

Whenever we have had to depend on Romo..he fails.

We need to fix the offense with a replacement for Romo and we need a top RB to be sure we can run the ball and protect Romo better.

Romo is only effective if we throw the ball 20 or less a game and keep the pass rush off him.

That was what 2014 was all about.

We have to return to that if there is any hope to win with Romo.

Don't and we won't.

 

[DC Cowboy]

Parcells made the switch as he said it was easier to find players for the 34 then then the 43. What he meant was pass rushing DE's. I mean if you actually kook at it today how many are elite out there? Quinn, Ansah (maybe), Mario (maybe), who else?

34 OLB's now? The list is long. Think about it this way, as great as Von miller is he would get swallowed up in the 43 due to his weight.

Bid bad DE's don't grow on trees, but the tweeners do.

this is not 100 % true considering how often teams are in nickel or dime defenses. Even 3-4 defenses are in a 4 man front 50% of the time.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

When we switched to the 3-4 some people said it was a mistake. When we switched back people said it was a mistake.

When the team plays crappy defense...anyone can use that to justify whether they think moving to the 3-4 or 4-3 was a mistake or not.

Too bad they just can't admit that is is bad players (when was the last time we drafted a defensive LINEMAN in the first round) and how many defensive players have we drafted in the first round since switching back to the 4-3...would help the team if we invested more top round picks in the Defense. Which why it is so ironic that we might have the option of drafting the best DB, best LB or best DE and I would say best DT in the mix as well...but most people want to Draft a QB or Zeke at RB.

Just something to keep in the back of your mind.

The offensive line did not get better until we invested top draft picks in it and I AM including Collins. The Defense is not going to get better until we invest top picks in it as well....makes no difference if we are going with a 3-4 or a 4-3.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

We invested 3 picks on a pass rushing OLB...ONE turned out to be what we wanted...one turned out to be nothing and the other turned out to be a better run stopper but never did live up to being a great pass rusher and could not stay healthy.

I am not sure the old adage that it is easier to find pass rushers in the 3-4 turned out to be correct.

If you get good players for either system it will work, if you don't it will not.

 

[chicago JK]

Both defenses have their advantages and negatives. The key is picking a strategy and sticking with it for a period of time. The biggest issue is our front office inability to find talent that fits these schemes. For example, Wade Phillips was an excellent coordinator. Marinelli is an excellent coordinator. Mike Zimmer was a very good coordinator. All three had a mixed bag here. It is not like they forgot the game while in Dallas. You just have to find good talent that fits their schemes. Dallas has been pretty poor at this.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You're right, but he's qualifying Lee's height as a weakness or disqualifying attribute as to why the 4-3 doesn't work or to why a shift to the 3-4 wouldn't work either. Absurd!

In a 34, it is a weakness. Lee would be on the shelf more in a 34 then he is now. Doesn't matter how good a player he is, if he isn't on the field then you can't take advantage of his abilities.

I agree with Vinnie there.

 

[Doomsday101]

It's harder to find 34 ends and DT on top of a DC that can call it. Besides that we really haven't invest quality picks towards this D yet.

Last 2 drafts saw Dallas get DE in 2nd rd with Gregory and Lawrence and of course 1st rd pick last year in Byron Jones.

 

[CyberB0b]

The 4-3 is the defense that should be played if you smartly draft. Especially now that cut blocks have been rendered all but illegal.

The 3-4 is too vulnerable to read options.

Who runs the read option on a regular basis? 2 NFL teams? Either way, most teams don't even run their base alignment the majority of the time.

 

[erod]

Who runs the read option on a regular basis? 2 NFL teams? Either way, most teams don't even run their base alignment the majority of the time.

Seattle and Carolina.

Yeah, they're kind of a big deal if you want to get to the Super Bowl.

 

[Redball Express]

We invested 3 picks on a pass rushing OLB...ONE turned out to be what we wanted...one turned out to be nothing and the other turned out to be a better run stopper but never did live up to being a great pass rusher and could not stay healthy.

I am not sure the old adage that it is easier to find pass rushers in the 3-4 turned out to be correct.

If you get good players for either system it will work, if you don't it will not.

You have to factor in the 3#1s to the OL prior to last year as part of the problem.

Each of those years DL was said to be the goal in the draft but we did 180s to take OL.

This was shocking to most of us becuz OL was never drafted that high before since John Niland.

So when we overreact to the situation now..

we really need to be careful.

With the reversal of the offense last year.it seems clear we stil have more work here and need new talent at RB and QB as well.

Injuries and suspensions on the defense greatly handicapped what should hv happened there.

So is it players or attrician or both?

Not sure.

Part of it is scheme, too.

Marinelli doesn't blitz much and doesn't mask it well.

That is also part of the issue.

Marinnelli needs to raise his game. He did well in 2014 with what he had but never recovered from Hardy's and Rolandos suspensions.

And we are going to have to deal with another 4 game suspension coming in 2016.

So planning for it doesn't mean taking our top draft picks and going defense.

Part of it is scheme changes, part of it is drafting offense to control the ball, protect the key positions like RB and backup QB with improved players..

then draft defense.

That is the only way we ride out Romo now and protect the entire team..not just a portion of it.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

You have to factor in the 3#1s to the OL prior to last year as part of the problem.

Each of those years DL was said to be the goal in the draft but we did 180s to take OL.

T. Smith was the pick all along.
Fred Beard was not the pick all along but they were going after an OG or an OC and after they traded down and he was the last one on their list left they drafted him.

Z.Martin was going to be a defensive pick. They wanted Donald...he was gone, next they were on the phone with LB (LB not DL) Shazier but the Steelers took him so it came down to Johnny Football and Z.Martin..thankfully they chose Martin.

So...No...DL was not the goal each of those three years...it was the goal at the very best of one year.

 

[Redball Express]

T. Smith was the pick all along.
Fred Beard was not the pick all along but they were going after an OG or an OC and after they traded down and he was the last one on their list left they drafted him.

Z.Martin was going to be a defensive pick. They wanted Donald...he was gone, next they were on the phone with LB (LB not DL) Shazier but the Steelers took him so it came down to Johnny Football and Z.Martin..thankfully they chose Martin.

So...No...DL was not the goal each of those three years...it was the goal at the very best of one year.

Ok..

Don't know where you are getting some of your info from about what was intended or who they passed over for what reason..

makes little difference now really.

But I belive I recall DL especially always being a need position..

seems most of the beat writers said as much but because we were always picking middle of the draft or end of the 1st..

those DL were out of reach..so they took OL high.

My point being..

if you decide you are going to sell out to be Romo Friendly..

which I think we all know is true..

it would seem that if a Top QB was available after what happened to Romo the last 3 years..you would be wise to take him.

And if a top RB were available with your 2nd Rd pick..you would take him.

Alfred Morris might be great but then again..he maybe another Eddie George.

We just don't know. There had to be a reason he was not highly sought after.

I'm wondering why the team would gamble with our Achilles Heel at RB for the second straight year post Murray.

But I've seen us do crazier.

 

[Direwolf63]

Nope. It all boils down to accountability, coaching, chemistry, and staying healthy. Either scheme can get the job done.

Yes. Either scheme can work. But it's pretty hard to succeed when you are bouncing from one to the other and back again. Pick a system. Stick to it and find the players who can play it.

That's why I was against going back to the 4-3. Sticking you head out the window to figure out which way the wind is blowing is no way to decide how to build a defense.....or anything else for that matter.

 

[dfense]

It seems as though the fear that some of us had about going back to the 4-3 was well founded in that 4-3 defensive ends are very hard to come by. Here we are, several years into the process, and low and behold, we are having a hard time finding stud 4-3 defensive ends.

Moreover, our defense has been bad overall, and has been bad against the run. 3-4 defensive ends are much easier to find, and cheaper. This draft is chuck full of defensive linemen, mostly interior guys at the top end, and could easily be used to fill the interior of the DL, or do a complete overhaul and go back to a 3-4 if we chose to go that route.

Are we handicapping ourselves with the 4-3, and could this be the year we quietly decide we made a mistake and go the other direction? Even if we aren't doing that ..... SHOULD we be going back to the 3-4?

Parcells ruined this defense when he went to a 3-4. They never were able to get better than the 4-3 there when he took over. He knew they wouldn't after a couple years and bailed on the team. His hand picked 3-4 personel was so bad, even bringing in the 3-4 guru Wade Philips couldn't fix it.

 

[AbeBeta]

I don't think so. Ware left. Hatchet left. Spencer had micro surgery. Lee is Small.. Spread Offenses taking off..

We switched before Ware left

 

[lostar2009]

Last 2 drafts saw Dallas get DE in 2nd rd with Gregory and Lawrence and of course 1st rd pick last year in Byron Jones.

Gregory and Lawrence was both day two picks. Jones isn't scheme specific just a cb/s.

 

[Fletch]

3 small words that are so BIG when talking about Lee " When he's healthy"

Another three words.... "Worth the risk."