We need to stop trading up for now

[Galian Beast]

Trading up has really not worked out for us, and if you look at it, it has really hurt us.

We have way too many holes (especially on defense) to take the risk of combining draft picks towards players who may or may not work out.

It may make more sense to trade up to a player who has slipped like Dez, but trading up to get guys like Claiborne... just a disaster.

If anything, trading down has proven much more successful for us.

 

[guag]

co-sign.

 

[Blackspider214]

Won't happen. Jerry loves making moves to try and show us he has a football brain and to make his stamp on the draft. He can't help himself. There is no logical reasoning why this team in our state should be forfeiting 2nd and 3rd round picks. But we do.

And no, trading down was equally as bad all those years. Stay put.

 

[jazzcat22]

I'm not a fan of trading up or down. Well, trading down a few spots is ok at times. But overall, I think they just need to stay where they are, stick to their board.
They always claim, well, it's a snowball effect, a few players go and it changes things on the board.

I say, they need to rethink the way they do the draft board then.

 

[Denim Chicken]

And no, trading down was equally as bad all those years. Stay put.

You got a problem with our Starting Center and #2 WR?

 

[xwalker]

Trading up has really not worked out for us, and if you look at it, it has really hurt us.

We have way too many holes (especially on defense) to take the risk of combining draft picks towards players who may or may not work out.

It may make more sense to trade up to a player who has slipped like Dez, but trading up to get guys like Claiborne... just a disaster.

If anything, trading down has proven much more successful for us.

The real football season is here. Time to quit worrying about the draft.

 

[CATCH17]

We've needed bodies in those middle rounds more than we have needed the "quality".

A couple of trade downs last year instead of drafting Escobar could have our defense looking a lot better this year.

 

[Sinister]

Trading up has really not worked out for us, and if you look at it, it has really hurt us.

We have way too many holes (especially on defense) to take the risk of combining draft picks towards players who may or may not work out.

It may make more sense to trade up to a player who has slipped like Dez, but trading up to get guys like Claiborne... just a disaster.

If anything, trading down has proven much more successful for us.

I don't think you can make that determination without knowing what you're getting into. I think on draft day you have to be as flexible as possible saying we 'shouldn't do something' or even 'we should do something' is painting yourself in a corner and I don't think that is a very good strategy.

Having said that I do think the Cowboys have been over-aggressive in their drafting strategy, no only giving up picks, but it feels like the Cowboys are trying to make a big splash and not drafting their board much of the time.

I think when they dropped down and passed on Shariff Floyd last year, I had a hard time understanding the Cowboys strategy. If Floyd was a top 5 pick on your board why don't you draft him? I'm not saying that Fredbeard was a bad pick, but there were indications that the Cowboys could have gotten him at their second round pick.

Even so, it is the strategy that I have issues with not necessarily the players.

 

[Galian Beast]

Won't happen. Jerry loves making moves to try and show us he has a football brain and to make his stamp on the draft. He can't help himself. There is no logical reasoning why this team in our state should be forfeiting 2nd and 3rd round picks. But we do.

And no, trading down was equally as bad all those years. Stay put.

Trading down allowed us to get Frederick and Williams, which may be a pivotal move for our offense for some time.

Trading down in 2004 was disastrous was we had the ability to draft Steven Jackson and instead got Julius Jones and Marcus Spears...

I think the Brady Quinn trade has mixed results, but at the time had a lot of potential. The team misread running backs a bit, though I think Jones had a lot of potential that was wasted. We really shouldn't have drafted a running back in the first in the first place at that point.

 

[Bowdown27]

I'm not against trading up in the Hight scenario. I was happy w the trade up for dlaw. Needed pass rushing and we got it. Just a shame he is hurt.

 

[conner01]

we traded up for dez
it's not so much about trading up as being right when you trade up. the risk is much higher so you better be right when you give up picks. this teams has been hurt more by trades like roy williams than trade ups

 

[Galian Beast]

I don't think you can make that determination without knowing what you're getting into. I think on draft day you have to be as flexible as possible saying we 'shouldn't do something' or even 'we should do something' is painting yourself in a corner and I don't think that is a very good strategy.

Having said that I do think the Cowboys have been over-aggressive in their drafting strategy, no only giving up picks, but it feels like the Cowboys are trying to make a big splash and not drafting their board much of the time.

I think when they dropped down and passed on Shariff Floyd last year, I had a hard time understanding the Cowboys strategy. If Floyd was a top 5 pick on your board why don't you draft him? I'm not saying that Fredbeard was a bad pick, but there were indications that the Cowboys could have gotten him at their second round pick.

Even so, it is the strategy that I have issues with not necessarily the players.

I can't agree with you. I think Floyd didn't fit the system and would have been entirely too high for the system we have here. I also think Frederick would have been gone as evidenced by the run on offensive linemen.

I do think you need to play to the draft, which would suggest not having steadfast rules, however as a general rule, I don't think you should overplay the draft by trying to trade up into the top 10. The risk/value there is just way too much for a team like this.

 

[xwalker]

I don't think you can make that determination without knowing what you're getting into. I think on draft day you have to be as flexible as possible saying we 'shouldn't do something' or even 'we should do something' is painting yourself in a corner and I don't think that is a very good strategy.

Having said that I do think the Cowboys have been over-aggressive in their drafting strategy, no only giving up picks, but it feels like the Cowboys are trying to make a big splash and not drafting their board much of the time.

I think when they dropped down and passed on Shariff Floyd last year, I had a hard time understanding the Cowboys strategy. If Floyd was a top 5 pick on your board why don't you draft him? I'm not saying that Fredbeard was a bad pick, but there were indications that the Cowboys could have gotten him at their second round pick.

Even so, it is the strategy that I have issues with not necessarily the players.

Well they did demote the guy that put the board together that had Floyd as #5. We only have 1 year with McClay being at the top of the scouting dept. and being the guy that puts together the draft board. His grade is obviously incomplete and he can't be blamed for D-Law's injury because D-Law was not an injury risk type of player. In fact, McClay pushed to avoid injury risk players according to Broaddus and the only one the took was 7th round pick Ben Gardner.

 

[Galian Beast]

We've needed bodies in those middle rounds more than we have needed the "quality".

A couple of trade downs last year instead of drafting Escobar could have our defense looking a lot better this year.

As much as I like Escobar, it made little sense to draft him in the 2nd when we already had Hanna who we were trying to develop.

Definitely could have helped our defense, with that being said, there wasn't a whole lot to be had on defense at that point.

 

[Gadfly22]

Parcells once said it was his job to accumulate talent. Trading up can squander the ability to accumulate that talent.

 

[DFWJC]

It does bother me every time I watch Seattle and one of the two players we gave up to get Claiborne is their stud linebacker Bobby Wagner.

The other player (so that is Wagner PLUS one of these) could have been Brockers, DeCastro, Chandler Jones, Alshon Jeffery...etc.

Could you imagine? And the that would a have affected the last two drafts as well.
It shouldn't keep depressing me, but it does.

Like xw said above...time for real football!

 

[big dog cowboy]

I've been advocating for years that we shouldn't trade up and if we do not more than a few spots like we did for Dez.

 

[Sinister]

I can't agree with you. I think Floyd didn't fit the system and would have been entirely too high for the system we have here. I also think Frederick would have been gone as evidenced by the run on offensive linemen.

I do think you need to play to the draft, which would suggest not having steadfast rules, however as a general rule, I don't think you should overplay the draft by trying to trade up into the top 10. The risk/value there is just way too much for a team like this.

Just the passing on Floyd issue, I know that the coaches didn't feel that he fit the system, but then you have to question why was he a top five player on their board? From what I understood it was the coaches that nixed the idea of Floyd, which is fine unless they did it on draft day. There seems to be some confusion on what happened and I just believe that, confusion on draft day of this magnitude is inexcusable.

I saw several threads on the days following the draft, my main point is that strategy, especially on draft day has to be worked out beforehand and I don't get the feeling that the Cowboys are working on every possible scenario. Maybe, I'm wrong on this, that is just the impression that I am getting.

 

[jterrell]

we traded up for Emmitt when we terribad and that worked out OK.
we traded up for Dez and that worked out OK.

the biggest hits in the franchises history have been trading up.

we did a lot of trading down or sitting tight in 2009....

you make the move that makes the most sense at the time.
sometimes you get it right, sometimes you don't.

 

[jterrell]

Just the passing on Floyd issue, I know that the coaches didn't feel that he fit the system, but then you have to question why was he a top five player on their board? From what I understood it was the coaches that nixed the idea of Floyd, which is fine unless they did it on draft day. There seems to be some confusion on what happened and I just believe that, confusion on draft day of this magnitude is inexcusable.

I saw several threads on the days following the draft, my main point is that strategy, especially on draft day has to be worked out beforehand and I don't get the feeling that the Cowboys are working on every possible scenario. Maybe, I'm wrong on this, that is just the impression that I am getting.

The Cowboys brought in a new defensive staff and system half way through scouting that class.
The staff upon hire spent all their time evaluating what we had in house. And looking at a DL of Ware, Spencer, Hatcher, Ratliff, Crawford and others, that was never a target in the draft.
Dallas simply wasn't going to go DL high unless it was a great value and the guy was an explosive pass rusher who could replace Ware or Ratliff.
Floyd wasn't judged to be that guy. But he might have been the top 3-4 DE in that draft. No one suspected he'd last that long.

Floyd became a vegetarian in the off-season and dropped 30 pounds. He still weighs ~300. That's just not elite pass rusher stuff.
He is going to start this year as a replacement for Kevin Williams, the run stuffer.
So while it may seem Dallas was confused or conflicted in the end it looks like they made the right call IMO.
They traded down and added TFred who looks like a Pro Bowl center fixture and a WR who is starting opposite Dez allowing us to move on from expensive and always injured Miles.

The Mo thing hurts us because we had scouted well there and Brockers and Wagner are just really friggin good players we'd love to have
Even more those are the two weakest positions on the team.
--tho if we didn't have Mo CB would be the weakest position on the team for the next 4 weeks.