We screwed up the Spencer Tag

[Idgit]

i agree also. i would just let him play on the one year deal. that way it keeps him motivated to have a great year. if you give him a big contract spencer probaly will play well at a high level the first two years then just slack off after that.

He's been a steady contributor for years, and people--not just fans, but our own defensive coaches, his teammates, and other teams' offensive coaches--have said that all along. Those are actual facts.

Fans want to get mad when the team gives big contracts to players, and then they want to get mad when the team holds out for a better deal. That ought to tell you all you need to know about the opinions of fans. They're unreliable because most of them don't know what they're talking about, and the rest of them have agendas that get in the way of what actually goes on on the field.

 

[Frosty]

He's been a steady contributor for years, and people--not just fans, but our own defensive coaches, his teammates, and other teams' offensive coaches--have said that all along. Those are actual facts.

Fans want to get mad when the team gives big contracts to players, and then they want to get mad when the team holds out for a better deal. That ought to tell you all you need to know about the opinions of fans. They're unreliable because most of them don't know what they're talking about, and the rest of them have agendas that get in the way of what actually goes on on the field.

When do let a player go? At what point is the bang for the buck not worth the price anymore. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys are horrible at trading players for picks and holding on to aging players way to long resulting major salary cap problems....

Love Jerry Jones loyalty to the players but I wish he had the same Loyalty to putting a CHAMPIONSHIP Caliber team on the field.

 

[Idgit]

When do let a player go? At what point is the bang for the buck not worth the price anymore. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys are horrible at trading players for picks and holding on to aging players way to long resulting major salary cap problems....

Love Jerry Jones loyalty to the players but I wish he had the same Loyalty to putting a CHAMPIONSHIP Caliber team on the field.

It all depends on the money and the production and the length of the deal.

I've said earlier this offseason that I think extending Spencer was probably going to end up being too costly this season. But not because he's 29, and not because he hasn't consistently been a very good player. That's not even convincingly debatable.

He's just been wanting a better deal than the team was willing to give, and after his sack totals went up last season, I expected that number to go up significantly instead of down.

Now, though, we're seeing some smaller deals for available pass rushers; it's looking like the market might not be overheated, after all. So I've got some hope we'll work something reasonable out. If not, keeping him another year and then letting him walk is not the worst possible outcome.

The problem on this team has been the turnovers, not the roster, though.

 

[1LoyalCowboyFan]

The thing is, Spencer is better than all of those guys. He'd get more money than Kruger from pretty much everywhere.

This. Strongly believe this. Both sides want to work out a deal and now Cowboys have leverage looking at all these deals by other ends. Worst case we keep him one more year.

 

[mmillman]

some of you guys have about as much sense managing the cap as jerry does

Dallas should have never overpaid for Spencer or anyone. It is why Dallas always lacks depth and has so many holes on the team.

 

[jnday]

He's been a steady contributor for years, and people--not just fans, but our own defensive coaches, his teammates, and other teams' offensive coaches--have said that all along. Those are actual facts.

Fans want to get mad when the team gives big contracts to players, and then they want to get mad when the team holds out for a better deal. That ought to tell you all you need to know about the opinions of fans. They're unreliable because most of them don't know what they're talking about, and the rest of them have agendas that get in the way of what actually goes on on the field.

There are many fans that I trust more than our current GM . Do you think for one second that Risen Star would field low quality players in the trenches? How many fans would have made the Roy Williams trade? Despite some posters calling our fans dumb, there are many on this board that could do the job better than our GM. Some fans do let emotions cloud their judgement, but give them a copy of Kiper's draft prospect rating, and this team would never miss a beat. It would improve if anything.

This "agenda" thing is overblown. If anything, most posters have an agenda of wanting to see this team win. If posters go against the status quo, they are labeled as having an agenda by the fans that support the team's current direction and decision making. Have a little faith in our fanbase. It is not accurate to assume that all of them don't know what they are talking about. I think many of the negative posters became that way due to watching this team make dumb decisions that even a fan knows that it is a mistake. Considering the team's track record, fans should question the moves that the GMs makes. If any of our fans are dumb, it is the ones that don't question the GM and support him blindly.

 

[CyberB0b]

He's been a steady contributor for years, and people--not just fans, but our own defensive coaches, his teammates, and other teams' offensive coaches--have said that all along. Those are actual facts.

If we don't get a long term deal with him, then this was a mistake. That is a fact, as well. With so many holes on this team, we couldn't afford to blow our load on 1 guy.

 

[jjktkk]

There are many fans that I trust more than our current GM . Do you think for one second that Risen Star would field low quality players in the trenches? How many fans would have made the Roy Williams trade? Despite some posters calling our fans dumb, there are many on this board that could do the job better than our GM. Some fans do let emotions cloud their judgement, but give them a copy of Kiper's draft prospect rating, and this team would never miss a beat. It would improve if anything.

This "agenda" thing is overblown. If anything, most posters have an agenda of wanting to see this team win. If posters go against the status quo, they are labeled as having an agenda by the fans that support the team's current direction and decision making. Have a little faith in our fanbase. It is not accurate to assume that all of them don't know what they are talking about. I think many of the negative posters became that way due to watching this team make dumb decisions that even a fan knows that it is a mistake. Considering the team's track record, fans should question the moves that the GMs makes. If any of our fans are dumb, it is the ones that don't question the GM and support him blindly.

OMG, thats classic! And no, I don't see Risen star as GM material.

 

[visionary]

When do let a player go? At what point is the bang for the buck not worth the price anymore. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys are horrible at trading players for picks and holding on to aging players way to long resulting major salary cap problems....

Love Jerry Jones loyalty to the players but I wish he had the same Loyalty to putting a CHAMPIONSHIP Caliber team on the field.

By now it should be abundantly clear to you (and any other cowboy fan with a functioning brain) that Jerry jones does not care about winning anything unless he gets ALL of the credit

Jerry jones priorities are

Money
Ego
Money
Ego

Rinse and repeat

 

[YosemiteSam]

Spencer will excel at DE. He will also get more rushes on the passer than he had before. That should improve his numbers over last years. Especially, if they can get decent pressure up the middle forcing teams where they can't double him.

Spencer would be a fool to not take a long term extension. If you think he truly wants to keep a one year deal because it's at slightly more money, you would be a fool. Guaranteed $10 million or guaranteed $20+ million. You tell me.

 

[jnday]

OMG, thats classic! And no, I don't see Risen star as GM material.

I figured that would get a few laughs. I will give him credit, he said the the CB lust was a mistake and he was right. He is right on most issues, but the pro-Jerry crowd doesn't like to hear it. The teams record over the last few years hasn't done a lot to hurt his credibility.

 

[jjktkk]

I figured that would get a few laughs. I will give him credit, he said the the CB lust was a mistake and he was right. He is right on most issues, but the pro-Jerry crowd doesn't like to hear it. The teams record over the last few years hasn't done a lot to hurt his credibility.

The problem is thinking that the OLine was/is the only problem. The secondary was a priority as well. And it seems the Cowboy's braintrust were correct in acquiring Carr and Claiborne, , conidering they released Neuman and knew in advance that they were not going to resign Jenkins the following year.

 

[jobberone]

This team has been overall talent deficient for some time but I think we're starting to catch up. Right now it's the OL and S positions that appear to be relatively lacking. That can change quickly over a season though.

This is the reason you don't overreach for need.

 

[jnday]

The problem is thinking that the OLine was/is the only problem. The secondary was a priority as well. And it seems the Cowboy's braintrust were correct in acquiring Carr and Claiborne, , conidering they released Neuman and knew in advance that they were not going to resign Jenkins the following year.

I carefully worded my post to say trenches. I agree with Risen in that both lines has to be upgraded. Until they are, expect more 8-8 seasons. A football team should be built from the inside out, not outside in. Of course the CB position needed addressed, but the path that was taken was overkill. Safety needed upgrades just as much as the trenches. The Cowboys put all their eggs in one basket and the end result was the same 8-8 record. Now they have changed defenses to the Tampa Two that doesn't require these high dollar man coverage corners, but the investment has done been made. They can't get the two high picks back and the fifty million dollar contract will still eat up too much salary cap space. Poor planning, very poor. Oh, I almost forgot the big contract that Scandrick signed.

 

[Nightman]

Spencer will excel at DE. He will also get more rushes on the passer than he had before. That should improve his numbers over last years. Especially, if they can get decent pressure up the middle forcing teams where they can't double him.

Spencer would be a fool to not take a long term extension. If you think he truly wants to keep a one year deal because it's at slightly more money, you would be a fool. Guaranteed $10 million or guaranteed $20+ million. You tell me.

He is one injury or one down year away from losing a lot of value. I agree, if he turns down 19-20m guaranteed with a good chance to earn 8-10m more at his age, it's on him.

 

[DeaconBlues]

There are many fans that I trust more than our current GM . Do you think for one second that Risen Star would field low quality players in the trenches? How many fans would have made the Roy Williams trade? Despite some posters calling our fans dumb, there are many on this board that could do the job better than our GM. Some fans do let emotions cloud their judgement, but give them a copy of Kiper's draft prospect rating, and this team would never miss a beat. It would improve if anything.

This "agenda" thing is overblown. If anything, most posters have an agenda of wanting to see this team win. If posters go against the status quo, they are labeled as having an agenda by the fans that support the team's current direction and decision making. Have a little faith in our fanbase. It is not accurate to assume that all of them don't know what they are talking about. I think many of the negative posters became that way due to watching this team make dumb decisions that even a fan knows that it is a mistake. Considering the team's track record, fans should question the moves that the GMs makes. If any of our fans are dumb, it is the ones that don't question the GM and support him blindly.

Risen would have 5 guards and four tackles in the lineup. With Alan Ball and Jaques Reeves as the starting CBs.

 

[Eskimo]

The problem is thinking that the OLine was/is the only problem. The secondary was a priority as well. And it seems the Cowboy's braintrust were correct in acquiring Carr and Claiborne, , conidering they released Neuman and knew in advance that they were not going to resign Jenkins the following year.

I'm not convinced that it worked out all that great. I really don't think Carr is that much better than Jenkins in coverage. Jenkins turned out to be reasonably healthy but was miscast as a slot CB last year when OScan went down. He probably could have been signed for a pittance compared to what Carr ended up getting. So we probably could have rolled forward with Jenkins, Mo and OScan at a much smaller cost. We probably would have then had the cap space to go out and solidify the Safety spot in FA or a vet OL. Having said that you can't know the future in advance and getting Mo could not have been predicted at the start of last year's FA period.

I would rate the players whose salary is most inflated compared to level of play last year as Free > Ratliff > Sensy > Carr > Austin. We definitely overrated Carr who is far from a shutdown CB yet is netting around $10M/yr. This error was then compounded by the error of trading up for a #1 CB consuming our top 2 picks even though we had just signed a CB to an 8-figure deal. This error was then compounded even further by not getting our CBs to challenge WRs all year because the Safety play wasn't good enough to cover any mistakes made.

This is the problem with a GM at the helm who got the job because he got the job instead of on merit at judging talent.

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

He's coming off of a career year so people are anointing him.

The fact remains he's been an underachieving player most of his career. No way would I give him a huge deal as he enters his 30's. This has bad contract written all over it.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I guess its fun to think that any other team could have signed them for that price.

 

[Cowboy Brian]

I'm pretty bummed about how badly we mis-read the market for pass rushers. We tagged Spencer so as to not risk losing him on the open market, and the result is a 1-year, 10.6M contract.

Kruger- 5 years, 40M = 8M/year
Avril- 2 years, 15M = 7.5M/year
Bennett- 1 year, 5M = 5M/year (obviously)

This combined with all the other short deals for reasonable money means one thing... it was such a buyer's market that guys took short, inexpensive deals so as to try the market again in the next year or two. If we simply let #93 hit the market, we'd have either been able to get him back on a cheaper 1-year deal (in the 6-8M range), are got him on a reasonable 3-5 year deal for significantly less than I thought.

Now, there's no way he'll sign an extension! He's getting more $ this year than all these other FA pass rushers by far, and will be able to re-try the market next year when the financial landscape may be more beneficial from the players' perspective.

We messed up... and it's going to cost us significant money, whether we intended to keep him for 1 year or for the long run.

I could see him accepting a high guarantee, frontloaded $8.5m a year contract.