Well, where do we rank?

[sonnyboy]

A lot of threads covering good topics, but I cant remember the last one where we simply ranked the team units against the competition.

Only reasonable way to evaluate were we stand.

QB- Romo and Kitna have to rank high. How many teams have a probowl QB backed up by a veteran starter of Kitna's quality. TOP 5

RB- Barber, Jones and Choice. Tough call because we really don't know what we have in Jones. 2008 was just too small a sample. But I like us as much as anyone. No one true superstar of Peterson caliber, but you have to like the fact that we can lose our starter to a season ending injury without much effect on our chances. TOP 5

Receiver - Few reasons why I'm ranking WRs and TEs together. One is it just makes sense and gives the group a similar weighting as RB or OL. Another is that the play of each directly impacts the other. Some teams routinely play more than one TE at a time while other almost always have 3 WR on the field. Grouping them together makes or fairer comparisons between teams that run different type sets. TOP 5

Offensive Line - This is surely where we're going to have the largest disparity amoung rankings. Our starting 5 is quality certainly close to top 5. But the fact we only have one quality reserve drags the unit down big time.
TOP 10

Defensive Front Seven - Tough to compare LBs and DLs separetly between 3-4 and 4-3 teams. Their roles are so different and since the play of LBs and DL have such and impact on the other in any scheme, it just makes sense to rank them as a unit.
60 sacks is 60 sacks and I can't remember the last time we viewed our run defense as even close to a liability.
Ware and Ratliff are two of the best players in the NFL. I also see James as one of the very best MLBs playing.
Sure there's a few front sevens out their that will outplay us this year, but I can't think of one I'd absolutely trade ours for. TOP 5

Defensive Secondary - Like the OL, I can see the biggest discrepency in opinions. I love this secondary's potential. I'm excited more about this unit than any other. It's what I believe will put us over the top this year. If we win the SB, everyone will point to how much we improved here as the #1 reason. I believe by years end this will be the #1 ranked unit in the NFL. But to be objective I have to make a few consessions. We have 3 new starters. That has to create some continuity issues and I'm sure we're going to have more than enough blown assisgnments. Jenkins and Scandrick are 2nd yr guys. Sensabaugh is an unknown. I like what I'm hearing and I love the comments Wade has made about his speed and coverage ability. We're just going to have to see it on the field. I love Newman and don't believe he's injury prone. But he has missed time these past 2 seasons with injury.You can't just assume he'll give us 16 games or that the chance he will is as good as any other player. His durability is a minor question mark and knocks us down a few slots. TOP 10 with the potential to rank #1

Coaching - Again huge hot botton here. I'm not nearly as down on our staff as most are. My opinion of our staff varies the most from the general consenus on this board and amoung the talking heads.
I admitt it has to be what differs in my view of this team overall and the majority of views I'm seeing.
Wade Phillips. Good head coach, great defensive coordinator. I don't see Wade opporating as our HC/DC as a liabilty in any way. This isn't exactly a prescedent we're setting here. Many successful HCs have operated this way and had their OC pretty much run the offensive show. There's a ton of guys like Andy Ried who operate as OC and let their DC run the show completely on the defensive side of the ball. What's the diference? Really think about it. What is the difference?
I'd argue that Wade's job is easier than most HCs operating as OC. Most o the key HC decisions tend to have to be made when your on offense. Well when we're on offense our HC isn't busy running the offense, he's more free to make those decisions.
After seeing the difference in our defense with Wade running it, can any of you argue the value he brings to the table. Amongst other coaches like Belicheck and Reid, he is very very well thought of as a DC.
My only regret is that we didn't operate this way from day one.

My only coaching question mark is Garreett. I still believe in him. But he took his hits in 2008. He needs to get back to boy geinus guru status he had in 2007.
TOP 15 at this point. Garrettt should put us back in the top 10.


Really want to read your opinions here on the unit rankings.

I'd also like an answer to this question: Assuming my ranking are valid, wouldn't this make us a top 5 team?

 

[jday]

As crazy as this may sound coming from me, the homer of all homer's, this might be just a tad bit optimistic.

QB - I'll say top 10, just for argument sake.

RB - I'll agree with top 5.

I'm going to split receiver and TE.

WR - Top 15

TE - Top 5, if not #1.

OL - Healthy, Top 10. Even 1 injury, Top 25.

DL - Top 15

LB - Top 10

Secondary - Top 10

I'm supremely confident in this year's team, but the fact of the matter is, there are too many question marks on certain players to give high marks at this point.

 

[sonnyboy]

As crazy as this may sound coming from me, the homer of all homer's, this might be just a tad bit optimistic.

QB - I'll say top 10, just for argument sake.

RB - I'll agree with top 5.

I'm going to split receiver and TE.

WR - Top 15

TE - Top 5, if not #1.

OL - Healthy, Top 10. Even 1 injury, Top 25.

DL - Top 15

LB - Top 10

Secondary - Top 10

I'm supremely confident in this year's team, but the fact of the matter is, there are too many question marks on certain players to give high marks at this point.

First post and you're already screwing me up. Can't brake up the recievers and defensive front. It kills the debate.

Do you wan to list the Defensive Fronts, Receiving Cores and QB Units you'd rank over us?

You really think there's nine teams with a better one two punch than Romo Kitna?

 

[firehawk350]

First post and you're already screwing me up. Can't brake up the recievers and defensive front. It kills the debate.

Do you wan to list the Defensive Fronts, Receiving Cores and QB Units you'd rank over us?

You really think there's nine teams with a better one two punch than Romo Kitna?

I don't know that is the way you should approach it. Peyton and Eli Manning have never missed a game in their careers. Their back-ups aren't as important as Carson Palmer's or McNabb's, both of whom can't stay on the field.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

OL and coaching should be top 25 each

 

[liltrick]

You really think there'snine teams with a better one two punch than Romo Kitna?

I disagree there, because with qb's, you don't have a "one two punch" like with rb's...You only have one in for at least 3 quarters unless there is an injury, etc.

 

[sonnyboy]

I don't know that is the way you should approach it. Peyton and Eli Manning have never missed a game in their careers. Their back-ups aren't as important as Carson Palmer's or McNabb's, both of whom can't stay on the field.

I absolutely take that into consideration. And those are good examples. I rank us over Philly for that reason alone. I'll take Romo over McNabb but conceed the debate.
There's no debating the likelyhood of McNabb missing games and how much better our backup is.

Call me a home but I don't rank 9 starters ahead of Romo. I certainly don't see 9 teams with a better QB situation than ours.

 

[lcharles]

GM- top 40

 

[Apollo Creed]

Our Special Teams went from an F to a C+ and they haven't even stepped on the field yet.

 

[Monster Heel]

This OL...top 10? The OL that cannot run block, cannot protect Romo and has no depth is top 10?

Linebackers Top 10? Please. Keith Brooking is a has been, Anthony Spencer is a never was until proven otherwise. Ware and James are top notch players, but last time I checked we'll be using 4 linebackers in the base set. Backups are highly questionable as well.

And top 10 secondary is a horrific stretch. Terence Newman's pretty good, but he's a porcelain doll. What do the Cowboys have behind him? A bunch of inexperienced players. At safety, Ken Hamlin was average in the best case scenario you want to paint for him last year and there's no way to know what exactly Sensabaugh is.

This is the kind of gross overestimation that got this team way overrated last year.

 

[Doomsday101]

We rank #1 in my heart. :laugh2:

We will play the season and see where we rank overall, hopefully #1 in the NFC

 

[dallasfaniac]

This is the kind of gross overestimation that got this team way overrated last year.

Yeah, it couldn't have been the fact that they came off a 13-3 season and jumped out of the blocks to start the season, with injuries ultimately doing them in...

 

[Apollo Creed]

Yeah, it couldn't have been the fact that they came off a 13-3 season and jumped out of the blocks to start the season, with injuries ultimately doing them in...

Every team has injuries. I blame our team not being mentally tough enough to handle it. Stop making excuses.

 

[Monster Heel]

Yeah, it couldn't have been the fact that they came off a 13-3 season and jumped out of the blocks to start the season, with injuries ultimately doing them in...

13-3 couldn't have possibly been the exception, but the true indicator of the talent level. Pretty sure this team has gone 9-7, 3 of the past 4 years.

Look at who they beat in those first three games. The Browns, pretty sure they ended up with a top 5 pick. The Packers picked in the top 10 as well. And the Cowboys allowed 37 points against the Eagles (if nothing else, that was a RINGING endorsement of this GREAT defense particularly the TOP 10 secondary. )

The Cowboys had an average number of injuries, but if you want to blame the team's struggles on that, go right ahead.

 

[TwoDeep3]

QB - Unknown. First season without a real threat at WR. Did Romo make T.O. or did T.O. make Romo.

RB - Top 15 until the coaches show they can scheme these guys to success.

WR - Absolutely nothing to base any ranking on. Health and skills of people behind RW11 suggest this could be fair to famine.

TE - I'm inclined to say with Bennett and then the best TE in the biz, this is #1.

OL - Somewhere in the bottom 40% of the league's OL

DL - Top 15

LB - Ware elevates this group. What will Spencer do? James is not that great. Unknowns everywhere else. And if Carpenter has a shot at anything but being cut, this really throws up a red flag. - Top 15 only because of Ware.

Secondary - Will Newman have a full season without injury? How will the second year corners do? What will Mickens add - he has the skills from college, but can he assimilate the defense and be a contributor?

Between 15 and 20.

 

[Apollo Creed]

13-3 couldn't have possibly been the exception, but the true indicator of the talent level. Pretty sure this team has gone 9-7, 3 of the past 4 years.

Look at who they beat in those first three games. The Browns, pretty sure they ended up with a top 5 pick. The Packers picked in the top 10 as well. And the Cowboys allowed 37 points against the Eagles (if nothing else, that was a RINGING endorsement of this GREAT defense particularly the TOP 10 secondary. )

The Cowboys had an average number of injuries, but if you want to blame the team's struggles on that, go right ahead.

Since this team was 11-1 after the Packers game. We've gone 11-11.

 

[dallasfaniac]

13-3 couldn't have possibly been the exception, but the true indicator of the talent level. Pretty sure this team has gone 9-7, 3 of the past 4 years.

Look at who they beat in those first three games. The Browns, pretty sure they ended up with a top 5 pick. The Packers picked in the top 10 as well. And the Cowboys allowed 37 points against the Eagles (if nothing else, that was a RINGING endorsement of this GREAT defense particularly the TOP 10 secondary. )

The Cowboys had an average number of injuries, but if you want to blame the team's struggles on that, go right ahead.

First off, I didn't say that 13-3 and a fast start was the true indicator of the talent, I was suggesting that THAT and our final 9-7 record were the reason we were overrated, not how some guy on a forum rated every position on our team as you suggested.

Are you suggesting that injuries have no blame in a teams struggles? Do you believe the Cowboys would still have missed the playoffs if Romo doesn't get hurt? Would New England still miss the playoffs if Brady doesn't get hurt?

 

[Monster Heel]

Excuse me for misinterpreting you.

We could've still easily missed the playoffs though. The defense was horrific against the Rams. Brad Johnson certainly did his part in blowing that one, but he wasn't on the field getting run over by Steven Jackson or letting the Rams complete bombs down the field. I won't even get into the Giants.

New England went 11-5 without Brady, in nearly any other year that would've been enough for them to get in. To do that well without him was a testament to how well that organization is run and how good that team really is.

 

[sonnyboy]

Linebackers Top 10? Please. Keith Brooking is a has been, Anthony Spencer is a never was until proven otherwise. Ware and James are top notch players, but last time I checked we'll be using 4 linebackers in the base set. Backups are highly questionable as well.

And top 10 secondary is a horrific stretch. Terence Newman's pretty good, but he's a porcelain doll. What do the Cowboys have behind him? A bunch of inexperienced players. At safety, Ken Hamlin was average in the best case scenario you want to paint for him last year and there's no way to know what exactly Sensabaugh is.

This is the kind of gross overestimation that got this team way overrated last year.

Thanks for the response. Question for you and other responders. How are you ranking our LB's and DL against other teams that run a 4-3.

I grouped team units they way I did for a reason. Makes for easier and more accurate comparisons.

Your comment on our OL was a prime example of why I nearly balked at starting this thread.

It's beyond rediculous. Reads like our OL play
of week 17 in Philly. Did you watch the other 15 games?

Care to name the other teams with a better OL than us?

How about those more talented front sevens(including depth)?
We lead the league with 60 sacks and finish 12th in rushing yards allowed.
Considering our mediocre secondary play (8INTs), I'm thinking some of these guys must be pretty good.

The 2009 secondary projection is a stretch and I admitted that. The fact that were running with 3 or 4 new starters is a concern, but it also makes for great opportunity for improvement.
Now if we had the same top 5 or 6 guys looking to log all the playing time this year, than any prediction of significant improvement would make no sense.

Two things I believe most of you guys are missing in your responses.
1) You're looking at these units at their worst
2) You're not actually considering the other teams.

You're frustrated with a unit such as our receivers and label them average without considering the 14 or so teams with a better group.

We do have the best Receiving Core in the NFC East.
How many teams do you actually think have better receivers?

 

[Monster Heel]

The OL was pretty bad in a number of games, so it's not just the Philly game that has people getting reservations about them. When you look around the league, 2 teams in this very division have better OLs than the Cowboys.

As far as the front 7 goes, I think the stats are a little inflated, so it's hard to judge them on that. Wade's very aggressive and high sack totals have followed him everywhere he's gone. I judge them more on how they came up in spots. They didn't force enough turnovers. You can argue that they would've had more turnovers if not for the sacks, but you can create turnovers with sacks. Maybe the coaches need to emphasize stripping the ball more. The stats don't really reflect the run defense either. Without any advanced statistics, I feel like the Cowboys were really weak towards the left edge of the defense.