Whispers from around the NFL

[Thick 'N Hearty]

It's got to be Crotchery of the Jets. With that last name ...

 

[TDH]

I think he'd still be a DE in a 3-4.

They will franchise tag him. He will hold out if they do. They'd ask for a mint in a trade. I'd still love to have him in Big D. He was the only player I liked more than Roy in that Draft.

Ed Reed went 24 in that draft. If you would rather have ROY BLEEPING WILLIAMS than Ed Reed, then i think you are an idiot. (no offense)

I think Bob & Dan said it best today on the ticket...your marquee great "pro bowl" type players (your Dirk's, your Peytons, LTs, etc.) they make those around them better. They hide the warts. You shouldnt have to scheme to hide your "best" players defeciencies. We have a great cb in newman, a pretty good one in henry, and yet we are gonna have to draft a high rd FS (depending on your opinion on Hamlin, but regardless, something had to be done to help the secondary at safety again b/c Roys unit isnt getting it done) in order to "hide" our supposed franchise defensive player??? Thats just not right. Roy is not a leader, and frankly he isnt a great football player. He's not terrible, but he is no Ed Reed. Give me Ed Reed everyday of the week and I'll give you Roy Williams and I gaurantee you I will beat ya 9 times outta 10.

 

[Hostile]

Ed Reed went 24 in that draft. If you would rather have ROY BLEEPING WILLIAMS than Ed Reed, then i think you are an idiot. (no offense)

I think Bob & Dan said it best today on the ticket...your marquee great "pro bowl" type players (your Dirk's, your Peytons, LTs, etc.) they make those around them better. They hide the warts. You shouldnt have to scheme to hide your "best" players defeciencies. We have a great cb in newman, a pretty good one in henry, and yet we are gonna have to draft a high rd FS (depending on your opinion on Hamlin, but regardless, something had to be done to help the secondary at safety again b/c Roys unit isnt getting it done) in order to "hide" our supposed franchise defensive player??? Thats just not right. Roy is not a leader, and frankly he isnt a great football player. He's not terrible, but he is no Ed Reed. Give me Ed Reed everyday of the week and I'll give you Roy Williams and I gaurantee you I will beat ya 9 times outta 10.

I am anything but an idiot, but thanks for your opinion.

 

[TDH]

I am anything but an idiot, but thanks for your opinion.

sorry, wasnt trying to be rude, but honestly...would you rather have roy than ed reed? (and forget about any personal loyalty you may understandbly feel for roy, think about which player would make the enitre defense better)

 

[Hostile]

sorry, wasnt trying to be rude, but honestly...would you rather have roy than ed reed? (and forget about any personal loyalty you may understandbly feel for roy, think about which player would make the enitre defense better)

Yes, I would, especially if he is in a defense that uses him correctly. Roy Williams is a difference maker when allowed to make plays.

He picks off balls, he forces fumbles, is strong against the run, can make a WR pay for coming across the middle, and can create havoc on blitzes.

Ed Reed is a better cover Safety. That's it.

IMO Roy has not been used correctly since his rookie year, and no one is going to tell me that in 2002 they had Ed Reed above Roy in that draft. But if someone did want to try and claim that I could discuss it without calling that person an idiot.

Ed Reed is a ball hawk, Roy is a play maker.

Oh and the greatest Safety to ever play the game (Ronnie Lott in case you weren't sure who) would agree with me because he has said Roy Williams is his favorite player to watch in the whole game. I will put more value on Lott's opinions of Safety than all of Roy's detractors put together.

By season's end in Phillips' 3-4 system where Roy is used in blitzes that are disguised a lot of the premature evaluation of him is going to taste bitter to a lot of people. IMO.

 

[TDH]

Yes, I would, especially if he is in a defense that uses him correctly. Roy Williams is a difference maker when allowed to make plays.

He picks off balls, he forces fumbles, is strong against the run, can make a WR pay for coming across the middle, and can create havoc on blitzes.

Ed Reed is a better cover Safety. That's it.

IMO Roy has not been used correctly since his rookie year, and no one is going to tell me that in 2002 they had Ed Reed above Roy in that draft. But if someone did want to try and claim that I could discuss it without calling that person an idiot.

Ed Reed is a ball hawk, Roy is a play maker.

Oh and the greatest Safety to ever play the game (Ronnie Lott in case you weren't sure who) would agree with me because he has said Roy Williams is his favorite player to watch in the whole game. I will put more value on Lott's opinions of Safety than all of Roy's detractors put together.

By season's end in Phillips' 3-4 system where Roy is used in blitzes that are disguised a lot of the premature evaluation of him is going to taste bitter to a lot of people. IMO.

Yeah, Roy is a playmaker...15yds past the line of scrimmage. And Ronnie Lott likes watching him play b/c he lights people up. Hey, everyone likes to see the big hit, esp. THE Ronnie Lott. But on this, we will just have to disagree.

Roy Williams is not a playmaker. He had 0 (let me repeat 0) forced fumbles last year. (Ed Reed had 1) Roy had 0 Touchdowns. (Ed Reed had 1) Roy had 52 tackles. (Ed Reed had 59) Roy (somehow) had 5 INT last year, 17 in his career. (Ed Reed, 5 last year too, and 27 in his career).

So.....??????

 

[Hostile]

Yeah, Roy is a playmaker...15yds past the line of scrimmage. And Ronnie Lott likes watching him play b/c he lights people up. Hey, everyone likes to see the big hit, esp. THE Ronnie Lott. But on this, we will just have to disagree.

Roy Williams is not a playmaker. He had 0 (let me repeat 0) forced fumbles last year. (Ed Reed had 1) Roy had 0 Touchdowns. (Ed Reed had 1) Roy had 52 tackles. (Ed Reed had 59) Roy (somehow) had 5 INT last year, 17 in his career. (Ed Reed, 5 last year too, and 27 in his career).

So.....??????

Ed Reed has been utilized correctly, Roy hasn't...

So?

 

[TDH]

Ed Reed has been utilized correctly, Roy hasn't...

So?

Reference my original post on Bob & Dan's points on the ticket today. ( not going to keep repeating myself)

 

[Hostile]

Reference my original post on Bob & Dan's points on the ticket today. ( not going to keep repeating myself)

Oh brother. You're the one challenging me, not the other way around.

I will take Lott's opinion over theirs too, but that's beside the point.


Let's look at them both and what each of us claimed.

1. You claim Roy doesn't score TDs.

Williams in his career has scored 3 TDs.
Reed has scored 3 TDs.

Where's the big advantage for Reed I should be seeing?



2. I said Roy is a better tackler.

Williams has 384 career tackles, 326 solo, 58 assists.
Reed has 325 career tackles, 282 solo, 43 assists.

This would tend to support my claim.



3. I said Roy forces more fumbles.

Williams has 8 career forced fumbles.
Reed has 5.

This would also support my claim.



4. I said Roy is better in pass rush.

Williams has 6.5 sacks.
Reed has 4.

I'm sensing a theme here.



5. I said Reed is a better cover safety, or ball hawk.

Williams has 17 INTs.
Reed has 27.

Wasn't even wrong on that.



6. I said Roy is better in run support.

The tackles stats where he is higher in every category supports that.


7. I said Roy was disruptive for WRs over the middle.

Denying this would be silly.



So basically, I believe you and I maintained 7 things between us about these 2 players. Roy holds an advantage in 6 of the 8 categories and I was correct on all 7 of the claims because I did admit Reed is a ball hawk.

You said we can agree to disagree, yet you keep plugging for an opinion you can't sell.

In fact Roy leads in all but 2 statistical categories except 2. INTs and Pass Defenses. The second one shouldn't be surprising but this might be...

In 2005 Reed had 9 Passes Defensed and 9 more in 2006.

Roy Williams who supposedly is a liabilty in Pass Defense has 14 and 14 in the same two years.

Oh, and I repeat, Reed has not been mismanaged, Roy Has been.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

Carolina would be real foolish to let that guy go without offering him HUGE money!

 

[Tristan]

I agree with Hostile, who's original statement was that Peppers was the only player he liked more than Roy AT THE TIME OF THAT DRAFT. Even an Idiot could get that, right.

If Roy Williams is ever used to his full abilities, and put in a position to flourish, then this topic will seem rediculous IMO. Roy let loose could Impact a game like no other defensive back in the NFl.

 

[jay cee]

Like Hos said, Reed has been allowed to do the things that he does best in the Ravens defense. Williams has not been utilized to maximize his strengths.

For what the Cowboys have asked Williams to do, they probably would have been better off with a player like Reed.

But IMO, Williams can be a dynamic player if used to his strengths, and I look forward to seeing that happen this year.

 

[Hostile]

I agree with Hostile, who's original statement was that Peppers was the only player he liked more than Roy AT THE TIME OF THAT DRAFT. Even an Idiot could get that, right.

If Roy Williams is ever used to his full abilities, and put in a position to flourish, then this topic will seem rediculous IMO. Roy let loose could Impact a game like no other defensive back in the NFl.

Like Hos said, Reed has been allowed to do the things that he does best in the Ravens defense. Williams has not been utilized to maximize his strengths.

For what the Cowboys have asked Williams to do, they probably would have been better off with a player like Reed.

But IMO, Williams can be a dynamic player if used to his strengths, and I look forward to seeing that happen this year.

You know what gets me about the Roy Williams detractors club? Other players in the NFL at the Pro Bowl are coming up to Roy Williams and telling him how he is going to flourish in Phillips' version of the 3-4, yet they still can't see how he has been handcuffed for 4 years and still outperformed just about every Safety on the planet. It honestly is just ridiculous and I find it hard to even take these people seriously.

 

[notherbob]

Yeah, I think Wade is going to make a big difference in the Boys defense this year. Parcells brought in some good people but then shackled them with his personal insecurities and wouldn't let them go to make plays. His morbid personality suffocated the excellent team he built and now that he's gone, I think Wade is going to open things up and the D is going to have a memorable year.

 

[jay cee]

You know what gets me about the Roy Williams detractors club? Other players in the NFL at the Pro Bowl are coming up to Roy Williams and telling him how he is going to flourish in Phillips' version of the 3-4, yet they still can't see how he has been handcuffed for 4 years and still outperformed just about every Safety on the planet. It honestly is just ridiculous and I find it hard to even take these people seriously.

I would like to see Polamalu spend most of his time in cover 2 and still have the same impact on the game.

Different players have different strengths and weaknesses. I don't see why that is so hard figure out.

 

[Hostile]

I would like to see Polamalu spend most of his time in cover 2 and still have the same impact on the game.

Different players have different strengths and weaknesses. I don't see why that is so hard figure out.

If anybody thinks there is a perfect SS or FS playing the game then they are simply deluded. Or any other position for that matter. Roy's assets far outweigh his weaknesses. IMO more than any other player at his position.