Who are the starters? (center edition)

[gimmesix]

As I wrote in my first thread in this series, Dallas likes to fill absolute needs in the draft so it isn't forced into taking a player at a certain position. Did the retirement of Travis Frederic catch the Cowboys off guard or do they feel they are already covered at the position? This thread is based on who I believe might start if they feel they have the position covered in-house.

IMO, the candidates for the job are Joe Looney, Connor McGovern and Adam Redmond. And I think the starter will be ...

Connor McGovern

McGovern was a bit of a surprise choice in last year's draft. We essentially had our starting five with Smith, Williams, Frederick, Martin and Collins; however, the reason given for drafting McGovern in the third round was he was the highest-rated player on Dallas' board.

There were definitely some questions about the starting left guard position after Connor Williams' rookie season, and there was even mentions that Williams might be moved to right tackle since Collins was on the last year of his deal. Collins signed a new deal, though, which meant that only Williams' spot on the line was uncertain. However, we didn't get to see if Dallas was going to let McGovern compete with Williams for that spot because McGoven got hurt.

Williams beefed up some and his play at left guard improved in his second season. For the year, he committed six penalties and gave up one sack. Still, it made sense to have him and McGovern compete for the left guard spot until Frederick announced his decision. Suddenly, drafting McGovern looked like a good job by Dallas preparing for this possibility. He was the starting center at Penn State his sophomore year. McGovern has plenty of strength and power for either spot, but has some holes in his pass protection that could make working at the most protected position along the line ideal.

The primary question for me with any center candidate is recognition skills. You need a smart player at the spot to point out what the defense is doing and make sure everyone along the line knows their assignments. This was the main problem with Joe Looney starting in 2018. Looney showed good movement skills, especially when pulling, and adequate power when he started in place of Frederick. However, there was all kinds of confusion and it seemed that Looney often would help-block with Martin and leave the rookie one-on-one against a superior DT. The physical skills are there for him to do the job, but I'm not sure the mental ones are.

Redmond might be the opposite of Looney. He seems to have a great technical understanding but lacks the physical skills needed to be the starter. He was getting driven back a whole lot last preseason. McGovern, to me, seems like he could be the best combination of both the physical and mental.

What say you?

 

[LifetimeBoysFan]

I think for now it is Looney’s job to lose. McGovern makes a lot of sense as a possibility too though. He just seems like he might be a little too raw after missing a year. Especially since even when he was participating it was at guard. Even with his college background at center it seems like a bit too soon to think he is the leading candidate to me.

 

[Oz-of-Cowboy-Country]

I think it'll be better if they move Connor Williams to center and let Connor McGovern play left guard. But I really think it's best to draft a C/G early in the draft.

 

[cowboyec]

Connor McGovern.
they had a 2nd Rd grade on him and got him in the 3rd.
they need to trust their evaluations.

 

[xwalker]

As I wrote in my first thread in this series, Dallas likes to fill absolute needs in the draft so it isn't forced into taking a player at a certain position. Did the retirement of Travis Frederic catch the Cowboys off guard or do they feel they are already covered at the position? This thread is based on who I believe might start if they feel they have the position covered in-house.

IMO, the candidates for the job are Joe Looney, Connor McGovern and Adam Redmond. And I think the starter will be ...

Connor McGovern

McGovern was a bit of a surprise choice in last year's draft. We essentially had our starting five with Smith, Williams, Frederick, Martin and Collins; however, the reason given for drafting McGovern in the third round was he was the highest-rated player on Dallas' board.

There were definitely some questions about the starting left guard position after Connor Williams' rookie season, and there was even mentions that Williams might be moved to right tackle since Collins was on the last year of his deal. Collins signed a new deal, though, which meant that only Williams' spot on the line was uncertain. However, we didn't get to see if Dallas was going to let McGovern compete with Williams for that spot because McGoven got hurt.

Williams beefed up some and his play at left guard improved in his second season. For the year, he committed six penalties and gave up one sack. Still, it made sense to have him and McGovern compete for the left guard spot until Frederick announced his decision. Suddenly, drafting McGovern looked like a good job by Dallas preparing for this possibility. He was the starting center at Penn State his sophomore year. McGovern has plenty of strength and power for either spot, but has some holes in his pass protection that could make working at the most protected position along the line ideal.

The primary question for me with any center candidate is recognition skills. You need a smart player at the spot to point out what the defense is doing and make sure everyone along the line knows their assignments. This was the main problem with Joe Looney starting in 2018. Looney showed good movement skills, especially when pulling, and adequate power when he started in place of Frederick. However, there was all kinds of confusion and it seemed that Looney often would help-block with Martin and leave the rookie one-on-one against a superior DT. The physical skills are there for him to do the job, but I'm not sure the mental ones are.

Redmond might be the opposite of Looney. He seems to have a great technical understanding but lacks the physical skills needed to be the starter. He was getting driven back a whole lot last preseason. McGovern, to me, seems like he could be the best combination of both the physical and mental.

What say you?

If Connor Williams is healthy:
OC McGovern
LG CW
Game Day interior backup Looney

If Connor Williams is not 100% healthy:
OC Looney
LG McGovern

Only issue with McGovern is how he holds and snaps the ball. He holds it at basically at a 90 degree angle from the way Frederick did.

 

[buybuydandavis]

As I wrote in my first thread in this series, Dallas likes to fill absolute needs in the draft so it isn't forced into taking a player at a certain position. Did the retirement of Travis Frederic catch the Cowboys off guard or do they feel they are already covered at the position? This thread is based on who I believe might start if they feel they have the position covered in-house.

IMO, the candidates for the job are Joe Looney, Connor McGovern and Adam Redmond. And I think the starter will be ...

Connor McGovern

McGovern was a bit of a surprise choice in last year's draft. We essentially had our starting five with Smith, Williams, Frederick, Martin and Collins; however, the reason given for drafting McGovern in the third round was he was the highest-rated player on Dallas' board.

There were definitely some questions about the starting left guard position after Connor Williams' rookie season, and there was even mentions that Williams might be moved to right tackle since Collins was on the last year of his deal. Collins signed a new deal, though, which meant that only Williams' spot on the line was uncertain. However, we didn't get to see if Dallas was going to let McGovern compete with Williams for that spot because McGoven got hurt.

Williams beefed up some and his play at left guard improved in his second season. For the year, he committed six penalties and gave up one sack. Still, it made sense to have him and McGovern compete for the left guard spot until Frederick announced his decision. Suddenly, drafting McGovern looked like a good job by Dallas preparing for this possibility. He was the starting center at Penn State his sophomore year. McGovern has plenty of strength and power for either spot, but has some holes in his pass protection that could make working at the most protected position along the line ideal.

The primary question for me with any center candidate is recognition skills. You need a smart player at the spot to point out what the defense is doing and make sure everyone along the line knows their assignments. This was the main problem with Joe Looney starting in 2018. Looney showed good movement skills, especially when pulling, and adequate power when he started in place of Frederick. However, there was all kinds of confusion and it seemed that Looney often would help-block with Martin and leave the rookie one-on-one against a superior DT. The physical skills are there for him to do the job, but I'm not sure the mental ones are.

Redmond might be the opposite of Looney. He seems to have a great technical understanding but lacks the physical skills needed to be the starter. He was getting driven back a whole lot last preseason. McGovern, to me, seems like he could be the best combination of both the physical and mental.

What say you?

Most likely they've penciled in McGovern at C, Williams at LG.

I think we let Looney walk in 2018, SF picked him up, SF cut him, and we picked him back up. We weren't enamored.

And then last year he didn't get on the field at LG until everyone else broke. Was never considered in the competition at LG despite starting at C all of 2018.

Williams is an outside possibility at C. I could see them taking a look.

Possible we take a starting quality C in the draft if one presents as a real value pick in the 2nd or 3rd. Then McGovern competes at LG.

We're getting Looney at a cap discount this year by some new rule for discounting the cap hit of 1 long time vet on your team.

We're going to want to go younger on the oline. For all we know, they picked McGovern in the first place as a potential replacement for Frederick.

 

[Redball Express]

As I wrote in my first thread in this series, Dallas likes to fill absolute needs in the draft so it isn't forced into taking a player at a certain position. Did the retirement of Travis Frederic catch the Cowboys off guard or do they feel they are already covered at the position? This thread is based on who I believe might start if they feel they have the position covered in-house.

IMO, the candidates for the job are Joe Looney, Connor McGovern and Adam Redmond. And I think the starter will be ...

Connor McGovern

McGovern was a bit of a surprise choice in last year's draft. We essentially had our starting five with Smith, Williams, Frederick, Martin and Collins; however, the reason given for drafting McGovern in the third round was he was the highest-rated player on Dallas' board.

There were definitely some questions about the starting left guard position after Connor Williams' rookie season, and there was even mentions that Williams might be moved to right tackle since Collins was on the last year of his deal. Collins signed a new deal, though, which meant that only Williams' spot on the line was uncertain. However, we didn't get to see if Dallas was going to let McGovern compete with Williams for that spot because McGoven got hurt.

Williams beefed up some and his play at left guard improved in his second season. For the year, he committed six penalties and gave up one sack. Still, it made sense to have him and McGovern compete for the left guard spot until Frederick announced his decision. Suddenly, drafting McGovern looked like a good job by Dallas preparing for this possibility. He was the starting center at Penn State his sophomore year. McGovern has plenty of strength and power for either spot, but has some holes in his pass protection that could make working at the most protected position along the line ideal.

The primary question for me with any center candidate is recognition skills. You need a smart player at the spot to point out what the defense is doing and make sure everyone along the line knows their assignments. This was the main problem with Joe Looney starting in 2018. Looney showed good movement skills, especially when pulling, and adequate power when he started in place of Frederick. However, there was all kinds of confusion and it seemed that Looney often would help-block with Martin and leave the rookie one-on-one against a superior DT. The physical skills are there for him to do the job, but I'm not sure the mental ones are.

Redmond might be the opposite of Looney. He seems to have a great technical understanding but lacks the physical skills needed to be the starter. He was getting driven back a whole lot last preseason. McGovern, to me, seems like he could be the best combination of both the physical and mental.

What say you?

I say this team will be lulled into false security like we always are.

We always think we are better than we are.

Remember WR by Committee?

That crap lasted 8 games into 2018 before we yelled 'Uncle' and traded for Cooper at a damned high price including his new contract.

We could have just drafted Ridley when we had the chance. He was better than Amari in 2018.

Yes, we drafted these other guys you mentioned but mostly as occasional backups. Not 17+ game starters protecting almost $60 million a year in players like Dak and Zeke.

I think and have said since Beard retired..get ready to draft his replacement now. Do not wait and play a cute game of cobble a center from the backups.

Posted threads on this already.

We may have to use a 2nd Rd pick on one. But take the best one and don't screw this up. It's too important to this team.

Over to you.

 

[fivetwos]

I say this team will be lulled into false security like we always are.

We always think we are better than we are.

Remember WR by Committee?

That crap lasted 8 games into 2018 before we yelled 'Uncle' and traded for Cooper at a damned high price including his new contract.

We could have just drafted Ridley when we had the chance. He was better than Amari in 2018.

Yes, we drafted these other guys you mentioned but mostly as occasional backups. Not 17+ game starters protecting almost $60 million a year in players like Dak and Zeke.

I think and have said since Beard retired..get ready to draft his replacement now. Do not wait and play a cute game of cobble a center from the backups.

Posted threads on this already.

We may have to use a 2nd Rd pick on one. But take the best one and don't screw this up. It's too important to this team.

Over to you.

So because McGovern hasn't proven he can play, use another premium pick on someone else we dont know can play?

We have a high pick and a veteran...and Redmond at the position for now.

Not enough?

 

[quickccc]

As I wrote in my first thread in this series, Dallas likes to fill absolute needs in the draft so it isn't forced into taking a player at a certain position. Did the retirement of Travis Frederic catch the Cowboys off guard or do they feel they are already covered at the position? This thread is based on who I believe might start if they feel they have the position covered in-house.

IMO, the candidates for the job are Joe Looney, Connor McGovern and Adam Redmond. And I think the starter will be ...

Connor McGovern

McGovern was a bit of a surprise choice in last year's draft. We essentially had our starting five with Smith, Williams, Frederick, Martin and Collins; however, the reason given for drafting McGovern in the third round was he was the highest-rated player on Dallas' board.

There were definitely some questions about the starting left guard position after Connor Williams' rookie season, and there was even mentions that Williams might be moved to right tackle since Collins was on the last year of his deal. Collins signed a new deal, though, which meant that only Williams' spot on the line was uncertain. However, we didn't get to see if Dallas was going to let McGovern compete with Williams for that spot because McGoven got hurt.

Williams beefed up some and his play at left guard improved in his second season. For the year, he committed six penalties and gave up one sack. Still, it made sense to have him and McGovern compete for the left guard spot until Frederick announced his decision. Suddenly, drafting McGovern looked like a good job by Dallas preparing for this possibility. He was the starting center at Penn State his sophomore year. McGovern has plenty of strength and power for either spot, but has some holes in his pass protection that could make working at the most protected position along the line ideal.

The primary question for me with any center candidate is recognition skills. You need a smart player at the spot to point out what the defense is doing and make sure everyone along the line knows their assignments. This was the main problem with Joe Looney starting in 2018. Looney showed good movement skills, especially when pulling, and adequate power when he started in place of Frederick. However, there was all kinds of confusion and it seemed that Looney often would help-block with Martin and leave the rookie one-on-one against a superior DT. The physical skills are there for him to do the job, but I'm not sure the mental ones are.

Redmond might be the opposite of Looney. He seems to have a great technical understanding but lacks the physical skills needed to be the starter. He was getting driven back a whole lot last preseason. McGovern, to me, seems like he could be the best combination of both the physical and mental.

What say you?

Thanks for posting and sharing.
Not sure if this is a copy-pasted posted article from elsewhere or your own originality, but it's pretty much spot on with terrific player analysis and predicted evaluations from the drafting of McGovern;
-to the wide assumption that Williams would be moved to RT while Collins departed in soon FA.
-To the non- foreseen sudden retirement of Fredrick.

i still maintain that we don't see players picked within first 3 rounds as quality backups. As Jerry says during draft -related press conferences interviews, they are normally targeted and slated as immediate contributors.
Or as in the case of Chaz Green who was drafted in 3rd round, as a player being groomed as a soon heir apparent. (via Doug Free)
Unfortunately we know how that turned out. Thus prompting Collins permanent move to RT.

Best Player Available per draft board ? i don't buy into it.
Davin Cook was also on Cowboys board as BPA in 2017 draft class and seen as a 1st round worthiness, but did we really think Cook was gonna be drafted by us via BPA, when we already invested in a proven, productive high impact, best RB in NFL in Zeke ?

When we drafted McGovern, that was BPA, but it had to be somewhere planned where he was to start and have the biggest impact.
- either that was immediate competition vs C Williams at LG spot
- either that was gonna spell Williams moving to RT, with Collins departing (which was immediately dispelled
with LC re-signing)
- could drafting McGov's versatility to play center, actually have also been a insurance protection move with
the concern with Fredrick's medical condition ?
However what led to the decision to draft McGovern, i have to believe this team still believes in Williams, despite the
outcry of criticism from several fans insisting he is a bust, when he's actually played solid overall.
Williams has more plus than minus plays and when he does miscue it's always a mental lapse mistake vs him being out manned and physical by his defender.

 

[Redball Express]

So because McGovern hasn't proven he can play, use another premium pick on someone else we dont know can play?

We have a high pick and a veteran...and Redmond at the position for now.

Not enough?

If the center has the qualities already you want..then it's a. No Brainier.

Being able to physically play is only part of the check list. Can he call the OL calls? Does he understand the other positions to better know what is going on and to react.

Does the QB and center develop the needed chemistry to play as a unit?

I just have no idea if guys that are primarily Gs and Ts can be all that.

I just think it's better to go back to square one and repeat what you did with Beard.

Not re-invent the wheel and risk screwing things up.

If necessary, let Beard help decide how to look at things.

He should know.

 

[quickccc]

Most likely they've penciled in McGovern at C, Williams at LG.

I think we let Looney walk in 2018, SF picked him up, SF cut him, and we picked him back up. We weren't enamored.

And then last year he didn't get on the field at LG until everyone else broke. Was never considered in the competition at LG despite starting at C all of 2018.

Williams is an outside possibility at C. I could see them taking a look.

Possible we take a starting quality C in the draft if one presents as a real value pick in the 2nd or 3rd. Then McGovern competes at LG.

We're getting Looney at a cap discount this year by some new rule for discounting the cap hit of 1 long time vet on your team.

We're going to want to go younger on the oline. For all we know, they picked McGovern in the first place as a potential replacement for Frederick.

yeh, they are likely to go with that McGovern to center plan NOW , since Fredrick has retired.
But at the time McGovern was drafted in the 3rd round, was the immediate thinking then ? Starting center or starting LG ?

- i'm not understanding at all with what you're talking about with us letting Looney depart to Niners in 201, and they picking him upon cutting him.. and us picking him
back up again .
Looney has been with this team since we signed him on as a FA in 2016, when he left Tennessee Titans.

 

[JoeKing]

Who are the starters? LOL, we don't even know who all the guys are on the team yet. It seems to be a way premature question to be asking.

 

[big dog cowboy]

McGovern at center.

The only question is with Williams. The plan was to make him the swing OT and put McGovern at LG. But now the Cowboys have a decision to make. Stay with the plan and draft a interior OL or change the plan and leave Williams at LG and draft a swing OT.

I wouldn't mind seeing another steal like McGovern this year on day 2 unless the Cowboys sign a FA before the draft.

 

[Bobhaze]

I know Joe Looney was competent in 2018. But he’s really just a high end OL backup. He cannot be considered anything more than a decent stopgap. IMO he’s a temporary starter at best.

I believe Connor McGreagor is a better long term answer. We will have to see once camp starts (whenever that may be) if he can learn the position and develop. We are a long way from knowing the answer to that.

 

[quickccc]

I know Joe Looney was competent in 2018. But he’s really just a high end OL backup. He cannot be considered anything more than a decent stopgap. IMO he’s a temporary starter at best.

I believe Connor McGreagor is a better long term answer. We will have to see once camp starts (whenever that may be) if he can learn the position and develop. We are a long way from knowing the answer to that.

Totally agree on that. and that will be the biggest key to finding out.
it's one thing to be able to be versatile enough play another position ,,, it's another thing to be able to excel at it.

Fredrick was already a very highly regarded center prospect coming into the NFL draft.

But i would have to think the Cowboys would love to have BOTH of their two highly invested, early round OL Conner picks
in that starting lineup.. and will give it every bit of chance of succeeding.
That's why i i believe they will have McGovern exclusively at center at start of camp and end of preseason, and willing to
absorb the bumps and learning curve of center position at the NFL level.

 

[buybuydandavis]

yeh, they are likely to go with that McGovern to center plan NOW , since Fredrick has retired.
But at the time McGovern was drafted in the 3rd round, was the immediate thinking then ? Starting center or starting LG ?

- i'm not understanding at all with what you're talking about with us letting Looney depart to Niners in 201, and they picking him upon cutting him.. and us picking him
back up again .
Looney has been with this team since we signed him on as a FA in 2016, when he left Tennessee Titans.

Supposedly there had always been some suspicion that Frederick might shorten his career, even before his GB illness. Someone on The Break mentioned that. Did that play into the decision to select McGovern? No one has said so, but granting the assumption that they had another reason to hedge their bet on Frederick, that would likely play into any decision on drafting an olineman.

On Looney, I think he's been with the team for years, but I thought that one season we didn't resign him to a new contract, he got signed elsewhere, got cut, and we brought him back. Pretty sure that happened with someone on the oline. Thought it was Looney.

Maybe I was thinking of Cooper? We did let him go, and he signed with SF, though we didn't sign him back. Just another hallucation. Carry on.

 

[buybuydandavis]

I know Joe Looney was competent in 2018. But he’s really just a high end OL backup. He cannot be considered anything more than a decent stopgap. IMO he’s a temporary starter at best.

I believe Connor McGreagor is a better long term answer. We will have to see once camp starts (whenever that may be) if he can learn the position and develop. We are a long way from knowing the answer to that.

That's where I am too.

I think Looney sticks this year given that we have him at a cap discount. I like that new rule that reduces cap hit a little on cheap vets who have been with the team a vew years.

 

[gjkoeppen]

Most likely they've penciled in McGovern at C, Williams at LG.

I think we let Looney walk in 2018, SF picked him up, SF cut him, and we picked him back up. We weren't enamored.

And then last year he didn't get on the field at LG until everyone else broke. Was never considered in the competition at LG despite starting at C all of 2018.

Williams is an outside possibility at C. I could see them taking a look.

Possible we take a starting quality C in the draft if one presents as a real value pick in the 2nd or 3rd. Then McGovern competes at LG.

We're getting Looney at a cap discount this year by some new rule for discounting the cap hit of 1 long time vet on your team.

We're going to want to go younger on the oline. For all we know, they picked McGovern in the first place as a potential replacement for Frederick.

I think you have some things mixed up. Looney was the 49ers 4th round pick in 2012 did play for the 49ers until 2014wem he was released and then was signed by the titans to a 1 years contract in 2015 and then in 2016 signed a 2 year contract with the Cowboys and then in march of 2018 he signed another 2 year contract with the Cowboys and NEVER spent ANY time with the 49ers in 2018. Right after Frederick announced he had Guillain–Barré syndrome in training camp on Aug. 23, 2018 Looney was named the starting center. According to the Cowboys who said after drafting McGovern they talked about the guard they just drafted so suggesting the Cowboys really didn't draft him as a guard as they said but as a possible center is just guessing by you.
.

 

[Bullflop]

I think OL Coach, Joe Philbin and Mike McCarthy will test Connor Williams and Connor McGovern for the LG position, with the winner becoming the starter at that position. In college, McGovern's coaches thought he was better suited to perform at LG than center.

In the end, I think McGovern will beat out Williams for the LG spot. Williams and Looney may then compete for the center spot with Looney winning there. It should be an interesting process, in any event. May the most capable ones win the battle for their respective spots.

 

[Flamma]

Or, they could draft one in the 2nd round. Couple good ones in there.