Why I think Darren McFadden will work out

Status
Not open for further replies.

jterrell

Penguinite
Messages
35,234
Reaction score
17,444
I think Dallas fans worried about RB are tilting at windmills in a way only Don Quixote could appreciate.
I could be wrong but I'd bet quite a lot on this one.

RB has quickly become one of the least valuable positions in the league. In part because the difference between good and average is so small. And even when talking great versus below average there's little correlation to actually winning games.

That's not to say running the ball effectively is worthless. It is to say running success is an equation where RB talent is only a small part. TEAMS run the ball well. VERY few players move around carrying success with them. There are simply too many components. And the rare few who are truly special, like Adrian Peterson, are not tied with overall success or winning. As good as AD is or LT was, it didn't equate to rings. I still recall Emmitt Smith being the first ever league's leading rusher to win a SB. Think of how crazy that is given the league's history as a smash mouth contest of wills? And there's a reason Emmitt says adding Murray doesn't make the Eagles favorites. Emmitt remembers being a "diamond surrounded by boo boo".

So I think INDIVIDUAL RB play is being insanely overrated here. Especially DeMarco Murrays. The reality is Murray is almost certainly not a top 5 back. Injury concerns, fumbling, lack of break away speed. All those are very real things. Just as real as Murray being the most effective RUSHING back in football in 2014.

What the numbers say.
Murray ran 392 times for 1845 yards in 2014. That's historically impressive.
But the truth is the 2014 Cowboys were EVEN MORE impressive as a rushing team.
All players other than Murray averaged 4.34 yard per carry. That's DOWN from Murray's 4.7 yards per carry but that total is also misleading. Because that counts sacks and QB sneaks against Dallas rushing totals.

All non-QBs rushing ypc? 5.35.
This is largely because Joseph Randle as the back up ran for 6.7 yards per carry.

I am not suggesting Randle could average 6.7 yard per carry through 400 carries. But how much drop off would he have for 200? He could be 2 yards per carry less and average what Murray did in 2014.

But that leaves 200 more carries and gets us to Darren McFadden.
He sucks, he's a bum, he lost his job....
OK. All those are pretty fair.
But keep in kind he was in Oakland, in a historically awful period for that franchise.

Why do the Cowboys like McFadden given his rushing totals and average are terrible?
Because Will McClay doesn't go to espn dot com or pro football reference to identify talent.
He looks for guys on film who have talent and could excel given the right set of circumstances.
Guys like Laurent Robinson, Rolando McClain. Guys who flash ability on tape. Guys who are likely to out-produce contracts.

McFadden study:
If you look at DMC you see a guy who was drafted by a truly awful team in 2008. He found much success (over 5.0 yards per carry two years in a row) in 2010 and 2011 on mediocre OAK teams and was considered that team's best talent in 2010. But he fell off the face of the earth with terrible averages after that and has never been a workhorse or 16 game guy. From the stat-sheet he looks a bit soft. ((So did Murray before 2014.)) Part of the reason is likely due to the situation in Oakland. He played a couple seasons with a pass happy Carson Palmer but he mostly had Jason Campbell, el busto himself JaMarcus Russell and other vagabond QBs. At WR he had... Heyward-Bey and Louis Murphy.
PFR uses a stat called offensive simple rating system. OSRS. Oakland has been below average every year of DMC;s career except 2010 and 2011. In fact in the other seasons of DMC's career they were ranked bottom 5 for offense. When the offense was at least average, DMC ran for a cumulative 5.3 yards per carry.

Add in the Oakland win totals and you can see why comparing Oakland to this current Dallas team is apples and oranges. Why Oakland tried to save DMC a bit then why they moved on when another rebuilding job was in front of them.

So why can DMC succeed?

The biggest thing is talent. McFadden is one of the fastest RBs to ever start an NFL Game. He could lose a few steps and still outrun Murray or any other Cowboys back. He's also 6'2" and 210. So he's basically a slasher like Murray. But one with breakaway speed. He certainly showed vision and quickness and physicality coming out of the SEC as perhaps the highest rated RB since AD.

He's obviously no longer on a star contract and for a RB he is probably only one bad year away from retirement. He's playing for a contender for the first time in his career and it is the team he rooted for growing up in Arkansas. Not sure what other motivations one could have except maybe to prove all the people who say he sucks wrong.

I expect DMC to prove he is the most talented RB in Dallas this year and the stable of backs to prove Murray was just the guy in the right place at the right time last year. I don;t expect Dallas to rush it quite as many times as they did last year but I do expect them to remain a top 5 rushing team and an absolutely scary offense to deal with. With 4 RB all severely motivated to get Murray money and all that ESPN love, I think this team averages even more yards per carry.
 
But who will get the Dirty Yards® for us? :rolleyes:

but... the guy at my local 7-11 said DMC is done. How do you explain that?

Ah_+Uh___+by+enjoymydownvote.jpg
 
I'm not as interested in whether a single RB can succeed or not as I am in whether the offense can succeed. Last year, defenses spent the first part of the season defending against the cowboys in the same way they have for years. Play cover two, sit on the pass and let romo throw into the secondary while sending pressure here and there. Don't worry about the run game because they will abandon it.

Except, we didn't abandon it - even down by three TDs against Tennessee, they didn't abandon it. And they ran it down the field.

As the season went on, teams adjusted and started loading 8 into the box to stop the run. Romo went INSANE and started really lighting it up.

So long as we can threaten both ways, we'll be fine.
 
As an added note things I would be concerned with more than RB:
1) Keeping Romo healthy. --top concern for basically every team.
2) Special Teams. --we lost our top special teams guys and aren't loaded with obvious replacement options.
3) Putting all those new pieces together on defense. --we should be improved at every level but a lot of change brings some unknown too.
4) Being the target. Repeating as a division champ against a first place schedule is always tough. Gameplan pretty well known now.
5) Pretty lousy home field advantage.
6) Suspensions and number of guys in the program who could miss major time with a minor slip.
7) Cold weather playoff games.
 
To me Dmac has the talent to get the job done, if he can stay healthy
I've watched rver college game he played and he will do fine, if he can stay healthy
He isn't the power guy Murray was but he will get you some big plays and has equal ability in the pass game, if not better. You get him in space and he can be dangerous, if he can stay healthy
To me Dmac and what he can do is all about one thing, staying healthy
I also think randle can be a good RB if he grows up and can stay out of the dumb mistakes off the field and devote his full attention to being the best player he can be
I think all 4 rb's have ability if they can stay healthy and out of trouble
I think most of the fear with our rb's is more about availability than ability
 
At this point, I just want to see what happens. No one is going to sell me on McFadden except McFadden, and I hope he can do it because my team will greatly benefit from it ... just like it will if the other RBs form a committee that at least gives us the tyep of running threat that we had last year.
 
4) Being the target. Repeating as a division champ against a first place schedule is always tough.

Especially in this division, where that hasn't happened in like 7 years now.

5) Pretty lousy home field advantage.

I think we're going to see a more amped atmosphere at the stadium this year. The hype is going to be bigger than it's been in years and I'll bet the crowd noise is going to reflect that, at least as long as we keep giving them something to cheer about.
 
I'm not as interested in whether a single RB can succeed or not as I am in whether the offense can succeed. Last year, defenses spent the first part of the season defending against the cowboys in the same way they have for years. Play cover two, sit on the pass and let romo throw into the secondary while sending pressure here and there. Don't worry about the run game because they will abandon it.

Except, we didn't abandon it - even down by three TDs against Tennessee, they didn't abandon it. And they ran it down the field.

As the season went on, teams adjusted and started loading 8 into the box to stop the run. Romo went INSANE and started really lighting it up.

So long as we can threaten both ways, we'll be fine.

:huh:
 
I think Dallas fans worried about RB are tilting at windmills in a way only Don Quixote could appreciate.
I could be wrong but I'd bet quite a lot on this one.

RB has quickly become one of the least valuable positions in the league. In part because the difference between good and average is so small. And even when talking great versus below average there's little correlation to actually winning games.

That's not to say running the ball effectively is worthless. It is to say running success is an equation where RB talent is only a small part. TEAMS run the ball well. VERY few players move around carrying success with them. There are simply too many components. And the rare few who are truly special, like Adrian Peterson, are not tied with overall success or winning. As good as AD is or LT was, it didn't equate to rings. I still recall Emmitt Smith being the first ever league's leading rusher to win a SB. Think of how crazy that is given the league's history as a smash mouth contest of wills? And there's a reason Emmitt says adding Murray doesn't make the Eagles favorites. Emmitt remembers being a "diamond surrounded by boo boo".

So I think INDIVIDUAL RB play is being insanely overrated here. Especially DeMarco Murrays. The reality is Murray is almost certainly not a top 5 back. Injury concerns, fumbling, lack of break away speed. All those are very real things. Just as real as Murray being the most effective RUSHING back in football in 2014.

What the numbers say.
Murray ran 392 times for 1845 yards in 2014. That's historically impressive.
But the truth is the 2014 Cowboys were EVEN MORE impressive as a rushing team.
All players other than Murray averaged 4.34 yard per carry. That's DOWN from Murray's 4.7 yards per carry but that total is also misleading. Because that counts sacks and QB sneaks against Dallas rushing totals.

All non-QBs rushing ypc? 5.35.
This is largely because Joseph Randle as the back up ran for 6.7 yards per carry.

I am not suggesting Randle could average 6.7 yard per carry through 400 carries. But how much drop off would he have for 200? He could be 2 yards per carry less and average what Murray did in 2014.

But that leaves 200 more carries and gets us to Darren McFadden.
He sucks, he's a bum, he lost his job....
OK. All those are pretty fair.
But keep in kind he was in Oakland, in a historically awful period for that franchise.

Why do the Cowboys like McFadden given his rushing totals and average are terrible?
Because Will McClay doesn't go to espn dot com or pro football reference to identify talent.
He looks for guys on film who have talent and could excel given the right set of circumstances.
Guys like Laurent Robinson, Rolando McClain. Guys who flash ability on tape. Guys who are likely to out-produce contracts.

McFadden study:
If you look at DMC you see a guy who was drafted by a truly awful team in 2008. He found much success (over 5.0 yards per carry two years in a row) in 2010 and 2011 on mediocre OAK teams and was considered that team's best talent in 2010. But he fell off the face of the earth with terrible averages after that and has never been a workhorse or 16 game guy. From the stat-sheet he looks a bit soft. ((So did Murray before 2014.)) Part of the reason is likely due to the situation in Oakland. He played a couple seasons with a pass happy Carson Palmer but he mostly had Jason Campbell, el busto himself JaMarcus Russell and other vagabond QBs. At WR he had... Heyward-Bey and Louis Murphy.
PFR uses a stat called offensive simple rating system. OSRS. Oakland has been below average every year of DMC;s career except 2010 and 2011. In fact in the other seasons of DMC's career they were ranked bottom 5 for offense. When the offense was at least average, DMC ran for a cumulative 5.3 yards per carry.

Add in the Oakland win totals and you can see why comparing Oakland to this current Dallas team is apples and oranges. Why Oakland tried to save DMC a bit then why they moved on when another rebuilding job was in front of them.

So why can DMC succeed?

The biggest thing is talent. McFadden is one of the fastest RBs to ever start an NFL Game. He could lose a few steps and still outrun Murray or any other Cowboys back. He's also 6'2" and 210. So he's basically a slasher like Murray. But one with breakaway speed. He certainly showed vision and quickness and physicality coming out of the SEC as perhaps the highest rated RB since AD.

He's obviously no longer on a star contract and for a RB he is probably only one bad year away from retirement. He's playing for a contender for the first time in his career and it is the team he rooted for growing up in Arkansas. Not sure what other motivations one could have except maybe to prove all the people who say he sucks wrong.

I expect DMC to prove he is the most talented RB in Dallas this year and the stable of backs to prove Murray was just the guy in the right place at the right time last year. I don;t expect Dallas to rush it quite as many times as they did last year but I do expect them to remain a top 5 rushing team and an absolutely scary offense to deal with. With 4 RB all severely motivated to get Murray money and all that ESPN love, I think this team averages even more yards per carry.

The two big issues with MCfadden are:

1. He doenst make anyone miss. Now there will be some big holes, and his breakaway speed will create some nice plays. But I dont think he has the stones to supplant Randle.

2. He is big time injury prone. Randle has better vision, instincts, and is durable.
 
At this point, I just want to see what happens. No one is going to sell me on McFadden except McFadden, and I hope he can do it because my team will greatly benefit from it ... just like it will if the other RBs form a committee that at least gives us the tyep of running threat that we had last year.

This is just where I'm at. As a Cowboys fan, of course I want to see McFadden do well. That means that by extension the Cowboys team will do well. But given his track record of disappointment, I'm not giving him any benefit of the doubt.

And his missing time during OTA's only further reinforced by skepticism.

McFadden will have to show me he can be a solid contributor before I'm believing it to be true.
 
To me Dmac has the talent to get the job done, if he can stay healthy
I've watched rver college game he played and he will do fine, if he can stay healthy
He isn't the power guy Murray was but he will get you some big plays and has equal ability in the pass game, if not better. You get him in space and he can be dangerous, if he can stay healthy
To me Dmac and what he can do is all about one thing, staying healthy
I also think randle can be a good RB if he grows up and can stay out of the dumb mistakes off the field and devote his full attention to being the best player he can be
I think all 4 rb's have ability if they can stay healthy and out of trouble
I think most of the fear with our rb's is more about availability than ability

McFadden will have his big plays, but he is not consistent enough of a RB to take the lion share of the carries. And compared to Randle, he is way too injury prone. Then you throw in the fact that Randle has been here 3 years in this offense and my call is that Randle is the lead back.

Heck, Mcfadden is already having hamstring issues and training camp hasnt even started yet.
 
I think Dallas fans worried about RB are tilting at windmills in a way only Don Quixote could appreciate.
I could be wrong but I'd bet quite a lot on this one.

RB has quickly become one of the least valuable positions in the league. In part because the difference between good and average is so small. And even when talking great versus below average there's little correlation to actually winning games.

That's not to say running the ball effectively is worthless. It is to say running success is an equation where RB talent is only a small part. TEAMS run the ball well. VERY few players move around carrying success with them. There are simply too many components. And the rare few who are truly special, like Adrian Peterson, are not tied with overall success or winning. As good as AD is or LT was, it didn't equate to rings. I still recall Emmitt Smith being the first ever league's leading rusher to win a SB. Think of how crazy that is given the league's history as a smash mouth contest of wills? And there's a reason Emmitt says adding Murray doesn't make the Eagles favorites. Emmitt remembers being a "diamond surrounded by boo boo".

So I think INDIVIDUAL RB play is being insanely overrated here. Especially DeMarco Murrays. The reality is Murray is almost certainly not a top 5 back. Injury concerns, fumbling, lack of break away speed. All those are very real things. Just as real as Murray being the most effective RUSHING back in football in 2014.

What the numbers say.
Murray ran 392 times for 1845 yards in 2014. That's historically impressive.
But the truth is the 2014 Cowboys were EVEN MORE impressive as a rushing team.
All players other than Murray averaged 4.34 yard per carry. That's DOWN from Murray's 4.7 yards per carry but that total is also misleading. Because that counts sacks and QB sneaks against Dallas rushing totals.

All non-QBs rushing ypc? 5.35.
This is largely because Joseph Randle as the back up ran for 6.7 yards per carry.

I am not suggesting Randle could average 6.7 yard per carry through 400 carries. But how much drop off would he have for 200? He could be 2 yards per carry less and average what Murray did in 2014.

But that leaves 200 more carries and gets us to Darren McFadden.
He sucks, he's a bum, he lost his job....
OK. All those are pretty fair.
But keep in kind he was in Oakland, in a historically awful period for that franchise.

Why do the Cowboys like McFadden given his rushing totals and average are terrible?
Because Will McClay doesn't go to espn dot com or pro football reference to identify talent.
He looks for guys on film who have talent and could excel given the right set of circumstances.
Guys like Laurent Robinson, Rolando McClain. Guys who flash ability on tape. Guys who are likely to out-produce contracts.

McFadden study:
If you look at DMC you see a guy who was drafted by a truly awful team in 2008. He found much success (over 5.0 yards per carry two years in a row) in 2010 and 2011 on mediocre OAK teams and was considered that team's best talent in 2010. But he fell off the face of the earth with terrible averages after that and has never been a workhorse or 16 game guy. From the stat-sheet he looks a bit soft. ((So did Murray before 2014.)) Part of the reason is likely due to the situation in Oakland. He played a couple seasons with a pass happy Carson Palmer but he mostly had Jason Campbell, el busto himself JaMarcus Russell and other vagabond QBs. At WR he had... Heyward-Bey and Louis Murphy.
PFR uses a stat called offensive simple rating system. OSRS. Oakland has been below average every year of DMC;s career except 2010 and 2011. In fact in the other seasons of DMC's career they were ranked bottom 5 for offense. When the offense was at least average, DMC ran for a cumulative 5.3 yards per carry.

Add in the Oakland win totals and you can see why comparing Oakland to this current Dallas team is apples and oranges. Why Oakland tried to save DMC a bit then why they moved on when another rebuilding job was in front of them.

So why can DMC succeed?

The biggest thing is talent. McFadden is one of the fastest RBs to ever start an NFL Game. He could lose a few steps and still outrun Murray or any other Cowboys back. He's also 6'2" and 210. So he's basically a slasher like Murray. But one with breakaway speed. He certainly showed vision and quickness and physicality coming out of the SEC as perhaps the highest rated RB since AD.

He's obviously no longer on a star contract and for a RB he is probably only one bad year away from retirement. He's playing for a contender for the first time in his career and it is the team he rooted for growing up in Arkansas. Not sure what other motivations one could have except maybe to prove all the people who say he sucks wrong.

I expect DMC to prove he is the most talented RB in Dallas this year and the stable of backs to prove Murray was just the guy in the right place at the right time last year. I don;t expect Dallas to rush it quite as many times as they did last year but I do expect them to remain a top 5 rushing team and an absolutely scary offense to deal with. With 4 RB all severely motivated to get Murray money and all that ESPN love, I think this team averages even more yards per carry.

Thanks for a well thought out and written piece!
 
The battle each week over who ran well, who didn't run well, and how much better/equal/worse DeMarco would have been is going to be entertaining,,, for a little while.
 
I prefer clean yards to dirty yards. Clean yards implies good vision and breakaway speed in open space.

If it means less turnovers, count me in. Murray had an outstanding season but a lot of people seem to forget how turnover prone he become. I would trade in a quarter of his production if it means less turnovers in critical times of the game.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
474,003
Messages
14,505,691
Members
24,207
Latest member
TomGiantsfan
Back
Top