Wonderlic Scores are in

[meadco]

uhh, I don't think the Wonderlic is supposed to test a person's judgment, just their mental quickness. Those are two very different things. I don't have any evidence for this, but I suspect that Pacman Jones had a pretty good Wonderlic, because byall accounts he's a sharp guy. But he has the judgment of a poorly-trained Border Collie.

Now, whether or not the test is a very good indicator of "football intelligence" or even intelligence at all is another question. My hunch is that it's only ok at measuring those things. But I don't think a high score will make you less prone to getting into trouble at the local "scrip club."

So there's no correlation between mental quickness and making the correct judgment in a given situation?

Ok. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

 

[ndanger]

haha, I (might) stand corrected, then. Out of curiosity, I tried to find a source to corroborate this, and I found a bunch of numbers (6, 7, 9) but the number that popped up the most was 13. Here's one blog entry that has a complete list of his draft class that mentions him as a 13:
http://www.clanram.com/forums/f85/wonderlic-scores-combine-8152/

I suspect your source was wrong, because on lists of all-time lowest scores, a 7 would put Pac in the Top 10, but I haven't found him on such a list. I guess it's hard to find the official numbers because they're not supposed to be public, so people can "leak" whatever number they want. Anyway, 13 is still pretty low, but it's not that low.

I do, however, stand by my initial assertion that the test isn't supposed to test a player's judgment, just his mental acuity. If there is some correlation between low literacy (which is supposedly the reason anyone scores super-low) and poor judgment, I wouldn't be surprised, but they're still not testing judgment on the test.

It's been my experience that stupid people are prone to doing stupid things. Ron White will tell ya', you can't fix stupid..........He's right.

 

[EPL0c0]

Pro Bowler with a great record and QB rating scored high on the test....
Yeah...good point...
Will you even be happy if he kicks *** next year?
Unbelievable.

I'll be happy when he quits fartin' around and finally realizes his potential and figures out how to finish a season strong by winning.

December/January: 5-10, 16TDs, 20INTs, 72.4QBRating (+5 fumbles)

 

[GalvestonCowboyFan]

So there's no correlation between mental quickness and making the correct judgment in a given situation?

Ok. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

Hmmm. I'd actually sleep better if I thought that criminal behavior was a sign of stupidity, because then I'd have better odds if I ever had to confront a criminal.

And you might notice that I did mention that a correlation probably does exist...

I do think, however, that any correlation between the two things is probably due to psychosocial factors (such as the fact that children with poor parenting probably tend to study less, the fact that children who can't control themselves end up suspended at school a lot, etc.). To keep him as an example, I don't think that Pacman gets into trouble because he is unintelligent (maybe he is, maybe he isn't)--he gets into trouble because he is UNWISE. Monumentally unwise. Those are different things. If you don't know the difference, I don't guess there's anything I can do to teach you, so we'll have to agree to disagree, I guess.

An aside:
I think part of the reason this is hard to explain is the fact that the words we use for this sort of thing are a little vague. When someone can't perform simple arithmetic and when someone can't stop getting in legal trouble, we use the same words to describe them: stupid. dumb.

If we were to be precise, the arithmetic problem is a sign of either being uneducated, unintelligent, or both. The legal problem is a sign of being foolish (unwise). There are plenty of examples of people with brilliant minds who are very unwise, and there are also plenty of examples of people who are very unintelligent and live wisely. They are different factors... the Wonderlic is supposed to test the former (although of course, it isn't even all that great at that). The latter... has nothing to do with it except for the possibility of a (weak) correlation betweenthe two variables.

 

[BIGDen]

I'll be happy when he quits fartin' around and finally realizes his potential and figures out how to finish a season strong by winning.

December/January: 5-10, 16TDs, 20INTs, 72.4QBRating (+5 fumbles)

You're a broken record dude. Look at the whole picture and not just your incomplete stats. "Fartin' around"? Did you even watch his two playoff performances? He played pretty well in those games, but other players came up small (which affected his numbers). Our team would have been a lot worse with most other QBs at the helm the past 3 years. Your negativity about Romo is ridiculous. The guy is better than most QBs in this league and he's accomplished quite a bit in less than 3 full seasons as a starter. Your Wonderlic point made no sense - much like many of your Anti-Romo posts.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

Wonderlic smunderlic, when I turn on the tape, can they play the game? That's the biggest question!

 

[pgreptom]

This is like one of those riduculous personality test that some sales jobs make you take. When I've been in the market for a new job in the past and they said they needed me to take the test, I said I'm not interested in your job! If somebody can't make a determintation by meeting you, then what's the point!

BTW...didn't Quincy have one of the highest scores on that test?????? That says a lot!

Because personality tests show a lot about you, and your character. Especially the ones that ask you the same question 15 different ways. If you're honest, and you fit the bill - you'll pass.

If you lie, chances are sometime during the test and answering the same question worded 5 different ways.. you'll choose an answer that doesn't resemble the other 4.

It's just a good way to test whether you're fit for the job, or not. There are a lot of good liars, and businesses are looking to avoid costs on all avenues.

 

[Wrangler87]

This is like one of those riduculous personality test that some sales jobs make you take. When I've been in the market for a new job in the past and they said they needed me to take the test, I said I'm not interested in your job! If somebody can't make a determintation by meeting you, then what's the point!

BTW...didn't Quincy have one of the highest scores on that test?????? That says a lot!

No. Not even close. That was Henson.

 

[Spectre]

I think what's more telling about this test is that these are all graduates/students of very big and respected universities... but obviously the world has long-accepted that it's okay to be a complete idiot if you're good at sports so the athletis scholarship debate is a dead issue.

 

[Wrangler87]

I'll be happy when he quits fartin' around and finally realizes his potential and figures out how to finish a season strong by winning.

December/January: 5-10, 16TDs, 20INTs, 72.4QBRating (+5 fumbles)

Yeah, he didn't take the field by himself in Dec and Jan.

 

[DanTanna]

"A score of 10 is literacy -- that's about all we can say," Wonderlic, Inc. president Charlie Wonderlic Jr. told ESPN."

http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/042502/jag_9237946.html

Ugly people always say beauty is skin deep.

 

[Texan_Eph89]

Delmas had a 12?

 

[ArmyCowboy]

Just like any other Combine test, the 40, bench press reps, etc., the Wonderlic will not tell the whole story about a prospect.

It's just another tool for teams to evaluate talent before the draft, no more, no less.

As an aside, it is kind of funny to see that some of these guys are as dumb as they are.

 

[AbeBeta]

Just like any other Combine test, the 40, bench press reps, etc., the Wonderlic will not tell the whole story about a prospect.

It's just another tool for teams to evaluate talent before the draft, no more, no less.

That's the best way to use it. I doubt many teams use that and nothing else. However, if you've heard rumors that a guy has a hard time learning plays AND he comes in with a really low Wonderlic score that does suggest he's a dummy.

I doubt teams use it for anything other than a very rough indicate of smarts -- for example, if a QB scores below 10 it might mean he's going to have a rough time and you should avoid him (oops.... sorry Titans!). A QB with a high score might be better able to grasp the offensive but of course, the test doesn't tell you anything about effort or even football related smart. But overall that high scorer is smarter than the low scorer.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

As an aside, it is kind of funny to see that some of these guys are as dumb as they are.

Its amazing that some of these guys are as stupid as they are.

I understand most go to college just to play ball, but the Wonderlic is comprised of pretty simplistic questions.

I just took it, got interupted by a quick phone call, and still scored a 35. And I'd say I'm of average intelligence. I have no idea how these guys can only score a 7, or 12. If I were a GM, I wouldn't touch those cavemen with a 12 foot poll.

 

[ArmyCowboy]

Its amazing that some of these guys are as stupid as they are.

I understand most go to college just to play ball, but the Wonderlic is comprised of pretty simplistic questions.

I just took it, got interupted by a quick phone call, and still scored a 35. And I'd say I'm of average intelligence. I have no idea how these guys can only score a 7, or 12. If I were a GM, I wouldn't touch those cavemen with a 12 foot poll.

I agree with that.

It would be interesting to see a study of how the single didget guys did, career-wise. I believe many folks, who tend to dismiss the Wonderlic, would be somewhat surprised to see that there is a correlation there between a low score and a high bust rate.

While I don't think you need to be a genius to play football, you do need to be able to understand a playbook and your role in the schemes you are running.

Here are the averages for each position:

Though used in a wide variety of institutions, the Wonderlic test has become best known for its use in the NFL pre-draft assessments of prospective football players.
This assessment roughly corresponds to examples from Paul Zimmerman's The New Thinking Man's Guide to Pro Football. According to Zimmerman, examples of average scores for each position are:

• Offensive tackle - 26
• Center - 25
• Quarterback - 24
• Guard - 23
• Tight end - 22
• Safety - 19
• Linebacker - 19
• Cornerback - 18
• Wide receiver - 17
• Fullback - 17
• Halfback - 16

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_Test

 

[Aven8]

Because personality tests show a lot about you, and your character. Especially the ones that ask you the same question 15 different ways. If you're honest, and you fit the bill - you'll pass.

If you lie, chances are sometime during the test and answering the same question worded 5 different ways.. you'll choose an answer that doesn't resemble the other 4.

It's just a good way to test whether you're fit for the job, or not. There are a lot of good liars, and businesses are looking to avoid costs on all avenues.

You must give these test at your work???? And then think they can weed out candidates when you haven't even spoken with them??? That says a lot!

 

[DFWJC]

i dont know why so many people put so much stock into this.

It's so devalued that many players don't even finish the test.

 

[Chief]

I think the "brain type" testing also is beneficial.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

fascinating

Indeed.