World Cup Final: USA vs Japan

[peplaw06]

A THOUGHT ABOUT THE GAME:

I had never watched an entire soccer game in my life other than ones my very young kids played in. I watched this one, and was glued to the TV the entire match. Games like this, and the conversion of (or eventual death of) hard headed old farts like me who never gave soccer a chance will help change sports culture in the US so that kids (males in particular) will be more likely to choose soccer as a primary sport at an early age with their parents blessing.

:bravo:

Now you just gotta convert Hos... good luck.

 

[MC KAos]

Guys, other sports have NOTHING to do with our soccer team. We have over 300 million people in our country! It's all about our soccer heads hiring safe coaches like Bradley because if they fail and get fired, we don't have to lose much money on a contract settlement. We need a smarter association that can talk guys into playing for us instead of Italy or other countries their parents were born in or whatever the case may be like Rossi. We also need a coach that knows what they are doing, not one from the MLS or NCAA, that's a joke. They should have hired klinsmann after the world cup but they are too cheap and kept Bradley instead.

Point is, we have plenty of people here to suit a good team, we just need better development and coaching.

 

[Stautner]

:bravo:

Now you just gotta convert Hos... good luck.

Well, I hate to even call myself a convert. I certainly don't expect to be watching soccer regularly, but I probably will at least watch it during the Olympics and World Cup, which is a step up for me.

Guys, other sports have NOTHING to do with our soccer team. We have over 300 million people in our country! It's all about our soccer heads hiring safe coaches like Bradley because if they fail and get fired, we don't have to lose much money on a contract settlement. We need a smarter association that can talk guys into playing for us instead of Italy or other countries their parents were born in or whatever the case may be like Rossi. We also need a coach that knows what they are doing, not one from the MLS or NCAA, that's a joke. They should have hired klinsmann after the world cup but they are too cheap and kept Bradley instead.

Point is, we have plenty of people here to suit a good team, we just need better development and coaching.

It's ridiculous to suggest that other sports have nothing to do with our soccer team. Anything that draws top athletes away from soccer has something to do with it. Hell, other sports have something to do with the talent pool available ofr baseball or basketball or hockey too, but that is probably much more the case with soccer since soccer is so much less established as an American sport.

Of course we have plenty of people, but that only matters if plenty of those people focus on soccer. It's not the number of available athletes that is the problem, it's getting the available athletes divided up among the sports in a manner that all sports get their fair share. You have to remember that decisions on what sport to play are generally made peretty early on, and though there might still be a very fine pool of athletes available even aside from the ones that end up playing football, baseball and basketball, many of those remaining athletes banked their athletic careers on football, baseball or basketball, so they were never even in the pool of those available for soccer.

I can give you the personal experience from my town - I grew up here and raised my own kids here. When I was a kid, there was no organized soccer. Accordingly, the parents of my generation raised their kids on football, basketball and baseball, so while there may have been plenty of good athletes to play those 3 sports and soccer as well, the good athletes just weren't being pointed in that direction. Moving forward to my kids generation, by the time my oldest was 5 years old, soccer had become big in youth sports, although it still hadn't become a high school sport. Kids were not growing up dreaming of being high school soccer players because there was no groundwork for it. I can only think of 1 kid out of my son's age group iin the entire city that was both among the better athletes and ended up focusing on soccer as he got older. Only one - every other of the better athletes from that age group in the city migrated toward football, baseball or basketball. Again, sure there were enough good athletes to go around to fill a soccer team with the better athletes, but what good does that do if they aren't playing soccer?

 

[Cythim]

You don't need an athlete to play soccer. Does Messi look like an athlete? Does Xavi? They are not the better athletes from their age groups but they both have developed a brilliant technique and mind to play soccer. If America's best athletes played soccer we would look like England instead of America, and what are they doing in the World Cup? Since winning in '66 they have only finished in the top 4 once and they have never won the Euro Championship.

 

[Bigdog]

:bravo:

Now you just gotta convert Hos... good luck.

Hos was secretly watching the final of the world cup. He gets up early every Saturday morning to watch the Premiership on ESPN with his cup of coffee.

I don't even know if God could convert Hos into liken soccer. Maybe Garrett could.

 

[joseephuss]

You don't need an athlete to play soccer. Does Messi look like an athlete? Does Xavi? They are not the better athletes from their age groups but they both have developed a brilliant technique and mind to play soccer. If America's best athletes played soccer we would look like England instead of America, and what are they doing in the World Cup? Since winning in '66 they have only finished in the top 4 once and they have never won the Euro Championship.

You don't need athlete's, but it helps. If you just improved the athleticism of the U.S. men's team you would have a better team; however, that is only one part of the equation. You also have to improve the technical aspects of the players and the team.

 

[joseephuss]

Guys, other sports have NOTHING to do with our soccer team. We have over 300 million people in our country! It's all about our soccer heads hiring safe coaches like Bradley because if they fail and get fired, we don't have to lose much money on a contract settlement. We need a smarter association that can talk guys into playing for us instead of Italy or other countries their parents were born in or whatever the case may be like Rossi. We also need a coach that knows what they are doing, not one from the MLS or NCAA, that's a joke. They should have hired klinsmann after the world cup but they are too cheap and kept Bradley instead.

Point is, we have plenty of people here to suit a good team, we just need better development and coaching.

I don't like Bradley as a coach, but the development of players does not start with him. Development goes far beyond who is coaching the men's national team.

 

[daschoo]

You don't need an athlete to play soccer. Does Messi look like an athlete? Does Xavi? They are not the better athletes from their age groups but they both have developed a brilliant technique and mind to play soccer. If America's best athletes played soccer we would look like England instead of America, and what are they doing in the World Cup? Since winning in '66 they have only finished in the top 4 once and they have never won the Euro Championship.

yes.
does a defensive end or a left tackle look like an athlete? does a middle distance runner? different skill sets need different body types and abilities, just because they don't have the body to play wide receiver doesn't mean they're not athletes. try playing a pass, then run for twenty minutes - sprint for 60 yards and try making the same pass. factor in guys trying to get the ball off you and then decide whether or not you need to be an athlete to be a player.

 

[CATCH17]

At least ESPN has been showing much more soccer lately than normal so they are helping do their part.


I can't believe how amazing the sport is and somehow it has not caught on here throughout time.

 

[Doomsday101]

At least ESPN has been showing much more soccer lately than normal so they are helping do their part.


I can't believe how amazing the sport is and somehow it has not caught on here throughout time.

Outside of world cup many are not interested in the sport.

 

[MC KAos]

another big problem with the MLS is that they think they have to compete with the nfl, nba and whatever other league is here, thats the wrong mentality. they are competing with other soccer leagues, not other sports, therefore they should have their season from september through may like the rest of the world. otherwise all we will ever get is washed up players like henry. if the MLS ever hopes to be a top league in the world, or at least second tier they need to change the season

 

[MC KAos]

I don't like Bradley as a coach, but the development of players does not start with him. Development goes far beyond who is coaching the men's national team.

and thats a big problem, coaches are usually at least somewhat involved in the developing of young talent and keeping players that could play for multiple countries. Klinsmann has a whole group (business) devoted to the development of clubs from the ground up, starting with youth programs. if someone like that were to become the head coach you would start seeing young talent develop much like mexico has in the last 6 years. and they are starting to see the rewards of it.

 

[Stautner]

You don't need an athlete to play soccer. Does Messi look like an athlete? Does Xavi? They are not the better athletes from their age groups but they both have developed a brilliant technique and mind to play soccer. If America's best athletes played soccer we would look like England instead of America, and what are they doing in the World Cup? Since winning in '66 they have only finished in the top 4 once and they have never won the Euro Championship.

This is one of the oddest statements I've ever heard. I can't imagine anyone suggesting that better athletes aren't important when competing in an athletic competition. Athletic competitiions require athletic skills.

Of course it's true that lesser athletes can increase their ability to compete by learning technique and learning all the ins and outs of the game, and that sometimes a person can become a top player without having elite athleticism, but that doesn't change the fact that the better the athlete that is learning the techniques and the ins an outs of the game, the better the player. It absolutely makes a difference if a player can run faster, switch directions more quickly, jump higher attempting to head the ball, out manuever the opponent and has the natural dexterity to handle the ball - if the athlete has superior athletic ability AND learns the techniques and the ins and outs of the game, that's going to be the better player.

An example from another sport might be John Stockton and Michael Jordan - both top notch NBA players. Both had great instincts for the game, had a great understanding of the game, learned the techniques and tools of the game, and of the two Stockton may well have been superior in all those areas - but Jordon had elite athletic ability and Stockton did not, therefore Jordon was clearly the better player.

The reality is that there are several elements to being a great athlete in any sport - obiously learning the techniques and learning the ins and outs of the game is one element, being dedicated is another, and athletic ability is another. The better a player is in all those areas the better player he will be. The first two elements can be learned or practiced if a person will put in the time and effort, but the 3rd is something a person either has or does not have.

 

[joseephuss]

another big problem with the MLS is that they think they have to compete with the nfl, nba and whatever other league is here, thats the wrong mentality. they are competing with other soccer leagues, not other sports, therefore they should have their season from september through may like the rest of the world. otherwise all we will ever get is washed up players like henry. if the MLS ever hopes to be a top league in the world, or at least second tier they need to change the season

I don't agree with that. The MLS is just competing to survive and grow. They don't view or at least should not view themselves as competing with the NFL, NBA, MLB or any premier soccer leagues at this point. They are just trying to get a small piece of the pie and their current schedule provides them the best opportunity for that.

If they did move their season, then they would put themselves in direct competition with the great soccer leagues of the world and they know they would lose. That would cost them lots of money, which they can't afford to do. That would be a bad move. You don't do that just for the hope of eventually becoming a top level league. You become a top level league first or at least get well on the way to becoming a top level league and then change seasons. Not the other way around.

In a certain sense you will always be competing with other sports because there will always be some overlap in seasons between the MLS and the big 3 sports. That is just unavoidable. I don't think the MLS wants to go head to head with the NFL every single weekend and that is what would happen if you moved the MLS to September through May. It would also impact scheduling since some teams share facilities with NFL teams. That is becoming less of a problem since more and more MLS franchises are getting their own soccer only stadiums.

Their current schedule works for what they are right now. Sure if they do eventually become a top league then they would probably change the season, but you don't do it until you are getting close to becoming a top level league.

 

[ethiostar]

You don't need an athlete to play soccer. Does Messi look like an athlete? Does Xavi? They are not the better athletes from their age groups but they both have developed a brilliant technique and mind to play soccer. If America's best athletes played soccer we would look like England instead of America, and what are they doing in the World Cup? Since winning in '66 they have only finished in the top 4 once and they have never won the Euro Championship.

If this is what you envision when you think of the word athlete then, no, Messi is not an athlete.



However, the word athlete has very little to do with body build.

Dictionary.com

–noun a person trained or gifted in exercises or contests involving physical agility, stamina, or strength; a participant in a sport, exercise, or game requiring physical skill.

Merriam-Webster.com

: a person who is trained or skilled in exercises, sports, or games requiring physical strength, agility, or stamina

 

[Cythim]

yes.
does a defensive end or a left tackle look like an athlete? does a middle distance runner? different skill sets need different body types and abilities, just because they don't have the body to play wide receiver doesn't mean they're not athletes. try playing a pass, then run for twenty minutes - sprint for 60 yards and try making the same pass. factor in guys trying to get the ball off you and then decide whether or not you need to be an athlete to be a player.

I was specifically talking about their physical appearance. Soccer players look more like middle distance runners than the prototypical American athlete. I'm not asking are they or aren't they, I am asking if they have the physical appearance that is coveted in American sports.

 

[Cythim]

This is one of the oddest statements I've ever heard. I can't imagine anyone suggesting that better athletes aren't important when competing in an athletic competition. Athletic competitiions require athletic skills.

Of course it's true that lesser athletes can increase their ability to compete by learning technique and learning all the ins and outs of the game, and that sometimes a person can become a top player without having elite athleticism, but that doesn't change the fact that the better the athlete that is learning the techniques and the ins an outs of the game, the better the player. It absolutely makes a difference if a player can run faster, switch directions more quickly, jump higher attempting to head the ball, out manuever the opponent and has the natural dexterity to handle the ball - if the athlete has superior athletic ability AND learns the techniques and the ins and outs of the game, that's going to be the better player.

An example from another sport might be John Stockton and Michael Jordan - both top notch NBA players. Both had great instincts for the game, had a great understanding of the game, learned the techniques and tools of the game, and of the two Stockton may well have been superior in all those areas - but Jordon had elite athletic ability and Stockton did not, therefore Jordon was clearly the better player.

The reality is that there are several elements to being a great athlete in any sport - obiously learning the techniques and learning the ins and outs of the game is one element, being dedicated is another, and athletic ability is another. The better a player is in all those areas the better player he will be. The first two elements can be learned or practiced if a person will put in the time and effort, but the 3rd is something a person either has or does not have.

Put a ball at each of their feet and who do you think would become the better soccer player between Stockton and Jordan? Would Jordan's strength and speed beat Stockton's technical ability and understanding of the game?

 

[Cythim]

If this is what you envision when you think of the word athlete then, no, Messi is not an athlete.



However, the word athlete has very little to do with body build.

Dictionary.com

–noun a person trained or gifted in exercises or contests involving physical agility, stamina, or strength; a participant in a sport, exercise, or game requiring physical skill.

Merriam-Webster.com

: a person who is trained or skilled in exercises, sports, or games requiring physical strength, agility, or stamina

Yes, lets take a literal meaning of my statement instead of actually reading what I've written. They are all athletes, and so are the guys who throw stones done the ice in the winter Olympics. If Messi and Xavi are at the NFL combine they won't be impressing anyone in most of the drills.

 

[Stautner]

Put a ball at each of their feet and who do you think would become the better soccer player between Stockton and Jordan? Would Jordan's strength and speed beat Stockton's technical ability and understanding of the game?

You are missing the point.

Are you somehow under the impression that the only people that can develop technical skills and understanding are those that are somewhat deficient athletically?

What I'm saying is that you are going to have better soccer players if you have players who are BOTH great atheltes who also develop the technical ability and the understanding of the game.

In other words, the combination of great athleticism and great technique & understanding is going to produce a better soccer player than one who only has moderate athleticism to go with great technique and understanding.

That really doesn't seem debateable. Obviously soccer, like other sports, requires technique and understanding, and the better developed those things are the better the player. But soccer is also, like other sports, a physical contest, and the more capable the player is physically the better he will be as well.

 

[CATCH17]

A THOUGHT ABOUT THE GAME:

I had never watched an entire soccer game in my life other than ones my very young kids played in. I watched this one, and was glued to the TV the entire match. Games like this, and the conversion of (or eventual death of) hard headed old farts like me who never gave soccer a chance will help change sports culture in the US so that kids (males in particular) will be more likely to choose soccer as a primary sport at an early age with their parents blessing.

Thank you!

I was the exact same way except for the old part.


I despised the sport but never gave it a chance.

Well I started giving it a chance and now I love it.


The sport is so easy on the eye.