WRs & TEs: 2017 vs 2018

xwalker

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They have upgraded at WR.
  • Hurns is better than the 2017 version of Dez.
  • Obviously Hurns is not better than Dez at his peak.
  • Hurns has similar stats to Dez over the past 3 years despite significantly less targets.
  • Better fit with Dak due to better route running awareness.
  • No force feeding of the ball required.
  • Not a distraction.
  • More variety of routes and has played from the slot.

Dez 2017
132 targets
69 catches
838 yards
12.1 average
6 TDs
52% catch rate

Hurns in highest target year
105 targets
64 catches
1031 yards
16.1 average
10 TDs
69% catch rate

More yards and more TDs on 27 less targets.



WR Comparisons 2017 vs 2018:

Dez (2017 version) vs Hurns

Advantage: 2018
Hurns with significant 3 year stat advantage when adjusted for same number of targets.

#2 and #3 WRs
TWill and Beasley remain.
Advantage: Break Even
Possible Upgrade in 2018

Young Outside WRs
Brown vs Gallup
College catches 33 vs 176
Advantage: 2018

Second slot WR
Switzer vs Austin
Advantage: 2018

Deep Threat
Butler vs Thompson
4.37 vs 4.31
Advantage: Break Even

Other:
Cedrick Wilson was really good in college. He was a QB in High School which delayed his development in college. Way more developed as a WR than Noah Brown was when drafted.


Tight End

Witten at his peak is what we tend to remember but he was not that player anymore in 2017.

The biggest change in 2018 is that there will be less predictibility due to Witten playing 100% of the snaps.

They can run some 4 WR, 1 RB sets.

In 2 TE sets, defenses have to consider that either TE might be targeted.

The young TEs will add a little speed back to the position.


Witten (2017)
Became just a short area receiving option. Lack of YAC became a bigger issue as he tended to catch more passes short of the 1st down marker.

The Cowboys blocking scheme often requires quickness from the TEs for reach blocks, move TE (H-Back) type blocking and leading on many outside runs.

Going back to early 2016 Witten started struggling with some of the blocks that required quickness. They have a play where the TE pulls around behind the OL and blocks the DE on the opposite side. This play made it very obvious that Witten was getting too slow to consistently make this block. They eventually started using the 2nd TE to make the block.

Hanna
He became a good blocker in the Cowboys scheme; however, it took him a couple of years in the NFL to develop the blocking fundamentals that Dalton Schultz displayed in college.

Swaim
No problem in 9 games during 2016 as the 2nd TE when Hanna was out for the season. Swaim only played 9 that season due to injury.

Dalton Schultz
Advanced blocking fundamentals in college. Showed good route running ability/awareness in limited opportunities.

Blake Jarwin

Ulility blocker (FB, H-Back, TE) in college. Cowboys kept him on the 53 as an inactive player. Eagles wanted him. Cowboys like his pass catching ability in practice.

Geoff Swaim

Solid blocker.

Rico Gathers
Boom or bust. Physically similar to MartyB. Terrific physical ability as both a blocker and receiver. Ability to learn the fundamentals/nuances/scheme is unknown.
 
IMO the TEs are Jarwin starting with Dalton as the backup and Gathers in a specialty role. You can't replace the overall impact of Jason Witten but I think the unit as a whole is just as good as last year.

I agree the WRs are significantly improved over last year. Not only is there more talent and more ways to attack, but the whole group will be a lot more Dak friendly. Our biggest problem last year was a lack of speed and defenders keying on the run/short game. We will have multiple ways to defeat that in 2018, not only from the WRs but from Austin in speciality sets and Gathers at TE.
 
I'm predicting a true open competition with it coming down to Jarwin and Shultz based on their ability to block effectively and how their potential in the passing game combined. I think if we can get anything out of Rico it is a win....I believe he has the potential to be a very good weapon in the passing game.
 
I dont believe we have a #1 WR just yet. Hopefully Gallup will give Hurns a run for his money. #competition
 
Sell yourselves however you want.

This WR and TE group is nothing special.

That’s fine if the coaches decide to step up. If they keep calling games like they have been then big plays will be few and far between.
 
Sell yourselves however you want.

This WR and TE group is nothing special.

That’s fine if the coaches decide to step up. If they keep calling games like they have been then big plays will be few and far between.

Fair to say as they have done nothing special, but the point here was to compare 2018 to 2017 and I really like our 2018 group over the 2017 group...

No more dez drama

Focus on route running ability

Youth movement

More speed

It's going to be exciting watching them develop and connect with dak!
 
Yeah I think it'll be a net improvement. I don't think TWILL is the #2 though. I thought he'd have to fight to keep it already, now with his arrest he probably misses some games on suspension.
 
Fair to say as they have done nothing special, but the point here was to compare 2018 to 2017 and I really like our 2018 group over the 2017 group...

No more dez drama

Focus on route running ability

Youth movement

More speed

It's going to be exciting watching them develop and connect with dak!


No more Dez drama.. There barely was any.. Just something the team tries to sell. There isn’t a WR on this roster that’s as good as Dez.

Our TE group looks to be the worst in football.



It’s a blah group. If they do well it will be because Dak and the coaches step up. I can see it from Dak but I don’t see these coaches becoming more dynamic.
 
Sell yourselves however you want.

This WR and TE group is nothing special.

That’s fine if the coaches decide to step up. If they keep calling games like they have been then big plays will be few and far between.

I don't think the OP is arguing that this is a special group. Just a better group than last year.
 
Sell yourselves however you want.

This WR and TE group is nothing special.

That’s fine if the coaches decide to step up. If they keep calling games like they have been then big plays will be few and far between.
Until we see them in action we really don't know if they are special. And quite honestly depending on how we actually play they may not have to be special. When you think about it does your WR group have to be special to win a Superbowl in the NFL? The past Superbowl says you only have to have WRs that are capable of executing the designed plays call for said WR. Now TE is a different story so hopefully we have a true starter come out the bunch.
 
Sell yourselves however you want.

This WR and TE group is nothing special.

That’s fine if the coaches decide to step up. If they keep calling games like they have been then big plays will be few and far between.

We have to see what is in practice and preseason 1st. The new wr's we added can at least run routes and get separation, more than Dez/Witten could.
 
They have upgraded at WR.
  • Hurns is better than the 2017 version of Dez.
  • Obviously Hurns is not better than Dez at his peak.
  • Hurns has similar stats to Dez over the past 3 years despite significantly less targets.
  • Better fit with Dak due to better route running awareness.
  • No force feeding of the ball required.
  • Not a distraction.
  • More variety of routes and has played from the slot.

Dez 2017
132 targets
69 catches
838 yards
12.1 average
6 TDs
52% catch rate

Hurns in highest target year
105 targets
64 catches
1031 yards
16.1 average
10 TDs
69% catch rate

More yards and more TDs on 27 less targets.



WR Comparisons 2017 vs 2018:

Dez (2017 version) vs Hurns

Advantage: 2018
Hurns with significant 3 year stat advantage when adjusted for same number of targets.

#2 and #3 WRs
TWill and Beasley remain.
Advantage: Break Even
Possible Upgrade in 2018

Young Outside WRs
Brown vs Gallup
College catches 33 vs 176
Advantage: 2018

Second slot WR
Switzer vs Austin
Advantage: 2018

Deep Threat
Butler vs Thompson
4.37 vs 4.31
Advantage: Break Even

Other:
Cedrick Wilson was really good in college. He was a QB in High School which delayed his development in college. Way more developed as a WR than Noah Brown was when drafted.


Tight End

Witten at his peak is what we tend to remember but he was not that player anymore in 2017.

The biggest change in 2018 is that there will be less predictibility due to Witten playing 100% of the snaps.

They can run some 4 WR, 1 RB sets.

In 2 TE sets, defenses have to consider that either TE might be targeted.

The young TEs will add a little speed back to the position.


Witten (2017)
Became just a short area receiving option. Lack of YAC became a bigger issue as he tended to catch more passes short of the 1st down marker.

The Cowboys blocking scheme often requires quickness from the TEs for reach blocks, move TE (H-Back) type blocking and leading on many outside runs.

Going back to early 2016 Witten started struggling with some of the blocks that required quickness. They have a play where the TE pulls around behind the OL and blocks the DE on the opposite side. This play made it very obvious that Witten was getting too slow to consistently make this block. They eventually started using the 2nd TE to make the block.

Hanna
He became a good blocker in the Cowboys scheme; however, it took him a couple of years in the NFL to develop the blocking fundamentals that Dalton Schultz displayed in college.

Swaim
No problem in 9 games during 2016 as the 2nd TE when Hanna was out for the season. Swaim only played 9 that season due to injury.

Dalton Schultz
Advanced blocking fundamentals in college. Showed good route running ability/awareness in limited opportunities.

Blake Jarwin

Ulility blocker (FB, H-Back, TE) in college. Cowboys kept him on the 53 as an inactive player. Eagles wanted him. Cowboys like his pass catching ability in practice.

Geoff Swaim

Solid blocker.

Rico Gathers
Boom or bust. Physically similar to MartyB. Terrific physical ability as both a blocker and receiver. Ability to learn the fundamentals/nuances/scheme is unknown.

well I am not so sure...hurns may have had a lot of catches and yards in Jax, but during most of those years Jax sucked and played from behind, way behind most of the time and defenses played them soft, allowing them to get the yards but keep the ball in front. Hurns is not the best route runner. With that said, I do think this year's group is overall better and deeper. assuming Hurns is same as Dez, then gallup, Thompson, Wilson, Williams, Beasley group is better than Williams, Beasley, switzer, butler.

butler was a one trick pony and very very very limited. switzer was an enigma and never caught on. Williams after 6 years still body catches. still drops balls and misses crucial crucial plays. with him it was feast or famine, and more often than not, famine....

I think this year's group may not have a super star, but its a much deeper group across the board and we canhave a 4 WR set, with all of them having to be accounted for with ability to run more routes, compared to last year.

as for TE, I liked Witten's veteran savvy, but he had lost two steps. he was slow in getting to his routes and wasn't getting much separation. he was very very average last year. so this year's group, won't have a "witten at his prime" type player, but they are also a decent and deep group. Swaim and Schultz should provide good blocking but enough to have to be accounted for as receiving TE. the wild cards are Jarwin and Gathers and how they show up....

overall, this group may not rank compared to a few years ago with Dez and Witten at their prime...but its a much deeper and better and more versatile group than the 2017 group...

I also think Williams may truly be on the bubble. it wouldn't surprise me to see Wilson take his spot.
 
No more Dez drama.. There barely was any.. Just something the team tries to sell. There isn’t a WR on this roster that’s as good as Dez.

Our TE group looks to be the worst in football.



It’s a blah group. If they do well it will be because Dak and the coaches step up. I can see it from Dak but I don’t see these coaches becoming more dynamic.

The 2017 Dez sucked. The new wr's on this roster can get separation and have more speed than he did last year.
 

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