Case for trading 17 for Jamal Adams

[Texas_Pete]

Any FS in this draft can be had in the 2nd round. And there isn't anyone near the prospect Adams is.

The answer to all of this is really simple. The Cowboys should have been more aggressive and signed Earl Thomas.

I'd argue it's more important to go get President (24 years old) than it was to go get Earl Thomas (30).

President is just entering his prime.

 

[Stash]

Last comments on this stuff because we aren't covering new ground.

Jets are NOT where DAL is. Any arguments to that effect is sophistry. Jets wanna hit 500 and maybe make the playoffs.

Nothing I stated is inaccurate whatsoever. The Jets beat the Cowboys last time they played. I don't like that fact any more than you do, but it is nonetheless a fact.

DAL hired a coach with a specific mandate to win it all.

Link?

DAL was talking to NYJ because they like the player; it has zero to do with the offensive-minded coach.

Because you say so? OK...

17 is a steep discount on what other teams paid for elite DBs recently. --guys they had to sign to big money.
Adams is the best in the league at his position and he is 24.

You want to use the word sophistry? Use it here, when you're trying to call anything to do with this trade "a steep discount", you can fool yourself on that, not anyone else.

DAL offered an R1 last year and that didn't get it done.
Maybe 17 will this year.

Color me surprised if it happens. I think the only people talking about this are fans, nobody inside that building.

 

[Stash]

I'd argue it's more important to go get President (24 years old) than it was to go get Earl Thomas (30).

President is just entering his prime.

Certainly far more costly.

But nobody wants to actually talk about that.

 

[cowboygo]

And how'd that work out for them? Would you consider that an example of what to do or what not to do?



I agree that coaching has to make the difference. The Stephen Jones cap model seems to be slow and steady wins the race rather than ever truly 'going for it' from a cap perspective. Once bitten, twice shy I suppose.

Didn't work out, but do think that was a good model to reach the SB especially in the BB-Brady era, unfortunately they had to face that tandem. Without that tandem, the Stephen Jones cap model might work this time with McCarthy to win it all. Feels so uneasy to not know the identity of our team next year. But personnel wise, I wouldn't want to face the Chiefs, or the Ravens. Heck any mobile QB, they all destroyed us last year. Someone's got to take a huge step in development on the defensive side, maybe even 2 guys. Easy to just pin everything on the Marinelli scheme, hopefully its just that and I'm under appreciating our guys.

 

[Big_D]

Stupid draft picks can haunt you for years. Like the MO tradeup. Can you imagine Michael Brockers/Bobby Wagner instead of MO?

So many dumazz gambles since then I forgot about Mo. that’s 8 in 8 years all with their top 2 picks. This team could’ve been light years better by now if they stay put and stop gambling. Just a flat out stupid front office!

 

[Bizwah]

We should only give up a first rounder. Nothing more. If the Jets won't bite, then they can keep him for one year only to lose him next season.

I would not give up more than 17. He's a great player, but we'd have him for one year then he would break the bank with his second contract. I doubt we'd want to set the market yet again.

 

[Stash]

Didn't work out, but do think that was a good model to reach the SB especially in the BB-Brady era, unfortunately they had to face that tandem.

And they were lucky to score the few points that they did. And now where are they? Cap hell with no 1st round draft picks to get them cheap labor. And cutting or trading away many of their best players. In a word - screwed.

Without that tandem, the Stephen Jones cap model might work this time with McCarthy to win it all. Feels so uneasy to not know the identity of our team next year. But personnel wise, I wouldn't want to face the Chiefs, or the Ravens. Heck any mobile QB, they all destroyed us last year. Someone's got to take a huge step in development on the defensive side, maybe even 2 guys. Easy to just pin everything on the Marinelli scheme, hopefully its just that and I'm under appreciating our guys.

We have to give them the opportunity to show us one way or the other.

 

[mattjames2010]

Are people really against giving up a single first for Adams? LOL

We need a safety, he's a great safety. If you can get him for a single first, you do it.

 

[mattjames2010]

Still not worth a 1st rounder, and will demand a high contract, and probably will want paid the highest S, as that seems a player trend. anting to be paid the highest.
DB's sacks come from blitzes. Is Nolan a high blitz defense? Not sure.

Wait, what the hell?

He went in the first round, he's playing like a first rounder, but he's not worth a first rounder? What?

 

[luckyman76]

I was against it before due to salary cap reasons but with Frederick retiring, I am rethinking it. You could basically replace the cap hit going forward for a 29 year old pro bowl player with a relatively equal cap hit on a 24 year old pro bowl player at a position of huge need, both now and in the future. I would only do a 1st round pick and only if I can agree on a long-term deal with Adams as part of the process. I might even get slick and trade down into the early 20's and then try and make the deal. I'm not giving up multiple high draft picks and I'm not doing it without an extension in place.

I am not doing it period. We are paying DLaw, Jaylon, and next LVE on D. Everyone else is replaceable or a stopgap. EVERYONE on O is paid top level. We have a balance problem and we have to spend all of our main draft picks over the next 3 years outside of maybe slot WR and C on D. $15M/yr FA outside of an edge rusher don't solve that problem. I'd CONSIDER Clowney at $15-17M/yr as an ROLB in a 3-4 but I am just so unsure of his motor, consistency, and durability. We will have to completely replace our current secondary and most of DL with picks. We might play a variation of the 3-4 but essentially DLaw, LVE, Jaylon, and Aldon become our LBs. That's why you need the beef of McCoy, Poe, and Woods up front. I'd prefer to get Henderson/Kinlaw in the 1st and then go S/CB and slot WR.

 

[Stash]

Are people really against giving up a single first for Adams? LOL

We need a safety, he's a great safety. If you can get him for a single first, you do it.

Sure, just forget about the fact that you'll also have to set the new market for the strong safety position on top of it, as that's an inconvenient truth.

 

[conner01]

Jets aren't giving you Adams for the 17 overall pick,.....And Dallas can't afford anymore top tier priced contracts...I expect Dallas to probably move down a few spots to garner more picks of take a DE or CB with their first selection...

They’d take 17 in a heartbeat
I wouldn’t give 17 for him

 

[The Quest for Six]

They’d take 17 in a heartbeat
I wouldn’t give 17 for him

Keep dreaming....

 

[fivetwos]

They’d take 17 in a heartbeat
I wouldn’t give 17 for him

That isnt true. I live locally. They expect to make the playoffs this year.

They cant sell it to the fans to move him for only one pick. He is their best and most popular player.

I don't think they came anywhere close on a deal last year, and Jet fans were livid over what the supposed price was, and were relieved when it didnt happen.

From Dallas' perspective, its very close as to if it's worth 17 for him, and I would say yes, but that alone will never get it done.

If Adams doesn't show up to camp, and the season starts and he is going to sit until week 10, I can see them settling for a 2021 first.

 

[JBS]

Sure, just forget about the fact that you'll also have to set the new market for the strong safety position on top of it, as that's an inconvenient truth.

Dallas already made an offer for adams. What makes you think they won't circle back? Of course they will. It might not work. But they will definitely try. And of course adams is more expensive than ET. Dallas never offered a first for Thomas. They've already offer a first plus more for adams

 

[xwalker]

Personally, I'm not liking the potential options at 17. If 3 QBs, 2 WRs, and 4 O-Lineman go before us, including Simmons, D. Brown and Okudah (total 12), the following could be available:

DT Javon Kinlaw
CB CJ Henderson
WR one of Lamb/Reudy/Ruggs
Edge K'lavon Chaisson

The Field (all safeties, Jordan Love for trade back opportunity, 2nd/3rd tier of corners, linebackers which we've shown interest)

I really believe S Jamal Adams easily trumps The Field, and a case can be made that he is a better option than the 4 names listed above.

Mike Nolan's defense is known to be an aggressive scheme, and turnovers are a crucial feature. If we are indeed blitzing at a high rate, having a playmaker like Adams would elevate the defense. T.Fred's retirement opens up cap next year. Adams cap hit won't be much until following years. I really think its an attractive option. If we are not able to get the 4 names listed, I'd rather trade down.

Also, I would only trade #17 for Adams, additional picks would make it pricey. If we go linebacker, I will puke.

You're ignoring the trade-offs of doing that in the salary cap era.

The real value of draft picks is as salary cap management assets.

Teams can not field a championship team without significant contributions from players on low cost rookie contracts.

Generally teams either use a draft pick to draft a player or use salary cap space to sign or re-sign a player. Trading a premium pick and giving the player a big contact is using both assets on the same player.

Teams also have to compare what type of player they could get in free agency without giving up any picks.

Teams trade premium picks for veterans when it's difficult to find those players in free agency or with mid/late 1st round picks.

Despite Adams just going into his 4th season, he basically has zero years remaining on his rookie deal because he is demanding a new contract.

When the Cowboys traded for Amari Cooper, he had 1.5 seasons of team contract control remaining. He also plays a position where elite free agents are rarely available. His position also has a very high bust rate in regards to 1st round picks.

Jamal Adams is terrific at what he does which is play SS but that is not considered one of the premium positions in the NFL.

How often do you see an SS drafted in the top 10 as compared to DL, LT, CB, etc..

 

[Stash]

Dallas already made an offer for adams. What makes you think they won't circle back? Of course they will. It might not work. But they will definitely try. And of course adams is more expensive than ET. Dallas never offered a first for Thomas. They've already offer a first plus more for adams

You say these things as if they're facts when they're not.

And you say 'Dallas' as if everything and everyone that was a part of whatever they offered last year is still here. They're not.

What they may have done last year under the previous coaching staff has no bearing on what 'Dallas' currently thinks.

 

[JBS]

You're ignoring the trade-offs of doing that in the salary cap era.

The real value of draft picks is as salary cap management assets.

Teams can not field a championship team without significant contributions from players on low cost rookie contracts.

Generally teams either use a draft pick to draft a player or use salary cap space to sign or re-sign a player. Trading a premium pick and giving the player a big contact is using both assets on the same player.

Teams also have to compare what type of player they could get in free agency without giving up any picks.

Teams trade premium picks for veterans when it's difficult to find those players in free agency or with mid/late 1st round picks.

Despite Adams just going into his 4th season, he basically has zero years remaining on his rookie deal because he is demanding a new contract.

When the Cowboys traded for Amari Cooper, he had 1.5 seasons of team contract control remaining. He also plays a position where elite free agents are rarely available. His position also has a very high bust rate in regards to 1st round picks.

Jamal Adams is terrific at what he does which is play SS but that is not considered one of the premium positions in the NFL.

How often do you see an SS drafted in the top 10 as compared to DL, LT, CB, etc..

SS don't get drafted in the top ten very often. There is a good reason why adams was. And he's living up to it.

 

[JBS]

You say these things as if they're facts when they're not.

And you say 'Dallas' as if everything and everyone that was a part of whatever they offered last year is still here. They're not.

What they may have done last year under the previous coaching staff has no bearing on what 'Dallas' currently thinks.

Well it was reported by individuals that work for the team and by individuals that work nationally that Dallas offered a first and more for adams. What else do you want me to think? The key individuals that are in charge of making significant trades for this organization are still here. Let's see what happens as we get closer to the draft. Rumors will re-circulate, but yes, this is my opinion.

 

[Dak_Attack_09]

Personally, I'm not liking the potential options at 17. If 3 QBs, 2 WRs, and 4 O-Lineman go before us, including Simmons, D. Brown and Okudah (total 12), the following could be available:

DT Javon Kinlaw
CB CJ Henderson
WR one of Lamb/Reudy/Ruggs
Edge K'lavon Chaisson

The Field (all safeties, Jordan Love for trade back opportunity, 2nd/3rd tier of corners, linebackers which we've shown interest)

I really believe S Jamal Adams easily trumps The Field, and a case can be made that he is a better option than the 4 names listed above.

Mike Nolan's defense is known to be an aggressive scheme, and turnovers are a crucial feature. If we are indeed blitzing at a high rate, having a playmaker like Adams would elevate the defense. T.Fred's retirement opens up cap next year. Adams cap hit won't be much until following years. I really think its an attractive option. If we are not able to get the 4 names listed, I'd rather trade down.

Also, I would only trade #17 for Adams, additional picks would make it pricey. If we go linebacker, I will puke.

Hell no, if he is not a cover safety it's not worth it.