Recap: Bobby Belt on Kelvin Joseph

gimmesix

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or stayed put and got Asante Samuel Jr.

That's the only thing bad about not valuing players who don't fit a certain mold. I think Samuel was considered the safer pick, but Joseph was closer to the length that we wanted and probably had a better SPARQ score.
 

gimmesix

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I mean. He was involved. He just didn’t pull
The trigger apparently.

I don't think we know the level of involvement. Just because you are in the vehicle with someone who decides to shoot a person, does not mean that you encouraged that or even wanted it to happen. We shouldn't assume guilt by association. All we know is that he was involved in the fight that preceded the shooting.
 

HungryLion

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I don't think we know the level of involvement. Just because you are in the vehicle with someone who decides to shoot a person, does not mean that you encouraged that or even wanted it to happen. We shouldn't assume guilt by association. All we know is that he was involved in the fight that preceded the shooting.


I didn’t argue a specific level of involvement. I just said involved. He was in a car with people who shot and killed someone and then didn’t tell authorities about it until he had no choice.

That tells me a lot about his character. Independent of what his criminal liability, if any, might be.
 

Acceptablename

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Bobby Belt was just on 105.3 The Fan —

Kelvin Joseph was “completely” in the doghouse all of last season.

He was “incredibly” immature throughout rookie year.

Coaches had little to no trust in him.

“Very poor practice player.”

Bobby said he’d rather have Kelvin Benjamin than Kelvin Joseph.
I got. Nothin for him. When the dirt is bad in college is bad in the pros. Jones has got to stop this
 

gimmesix

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I didn’t argue a specific level of involvement. I just said involved. He was in a car with people who shot and killed someone and then didn’t tell authorities about it until he had no choice.

That tells me a lot about his character. Independent of what his criminal liability, if any, might be.

Character? Sure. Involved to me means more than just being in the vehicle when someone decides to pull out a gun and shoot someone. He's certainly not innocent of making poor decisions.
 

Bobhaze

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Bobby Belt was just on 105.3 The Fan —

Kelvin Joseph was “completely” in the doghouse all of last season.

He was “incredibly” immature throughout rookie year.

Coaches had little to no trust in him.

“Very poor practice player.”

Bobby said he’d rather have Kelvin Benjamin than Kelvin Joseph.
Several points here:
  • Kid you not, a week before the 2021 draft, I heard someone on The Ticket- another Dallas sports radio station (probably was Bob Sturm) say that Kelvin Joseph was talented but considered “radioactive” by most NFL scouts because of his immature “posse” behavior off the field.
  • That never stops Jerry from using a premium draft pick to show the rest of the league he knows what he’s doing.
  • KJ may get a pretty serious suspension from the league even if he was not officially charged with a crime. He only spoke out about his knowledge of the crime when a photo of the scene that night identified him on the scene. Only then did he speak. And he’s never publicly expressed any remorse for the pain the murdered kid’s family is going through.
  • I would have cut this guy already. His bad attitude and immature, perhaps even outlaw off-field behavior is exactly the kind of stuff this culture needs out of its locker room. He hasn’t even shown that he’s capable of being anything beyond a ST player.
  • He hasn’t even shown he’s worth keeping around. But as Jimmy once said, Jerry never likes to admit his mistakes.
 

gimmesix

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Yes, he is. You're wrong about Barmore just like you're wrong about Joseph's "innocence" when it comes to the shooting homicide.

Just posted this in another thread. Two people in the vehicle have confessed to the shooting. Guess what? Joseph wasn't one of them.

https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/s...e-day-cowboys-player-spoke-to-police/2943584/

As far as Barmore goes, he's a 3-tech or DE in a 3-4. Playing at NT would be a waste. He's a quick player who is at his best when he's playing one-gap, not absorbing blockers.

Christian Barmore Scouting Report
By Charlie Campbell

Strengths:
  • Athletic; fast interior pass rusher
  • Closes on quarterbacks in a hurry
  • Speed to dart by guards
  • Speed-to-power rushes to go through lineman
  • Ability to bull rush
  • Can redirect
  • Can sink his hips and play low
  • Active hands to fight off blockers
  • Length to keep blockers out of his chest
  • Nice ball awareness for a defensive tackle
  • Ability to shed blocks
  • Agile
  • Slippery at the point of attack
  • Good burst off the ball; first-step quickness
  • Good vision, awareness
  • Carries weight well
  • Natural three-technique for a 4-3
  • Lots of athletic upside to improve in the NFL





Weaknesses:
  • Needs to get tougher as a run defender
  • Will struggle with bump blocks and double teams as a pro
  • Could stand to improve his strength to hold his ground against downhill runs
  • Maturity needs to improve
  • Has to become more professional on and off the field
  • Needs to become more well-rounded, consistent


Summary: Alabama has produced a string of excellent interior defensive line prospects under Nick Saban. Crimson Tide defensive tackles Marcel Dareus, Jonathan Allen, Da'Ron Payne and Quinnen Williams were all first-round picks, and Barmore could keep that tradition alive in the 2021 NFL Draft.

Barmore first saw the field as a rotational backup during his redshirt freshman season in 2019. He recorded 26 tackles, two sacks, and two passes defended while flashing big potential. Barmore took over as a starter in 2020 after dealing with an injury early in the season. As the year progressed, Barmore started dominating opponents, including excellent performances against Notre Dame and Ohio State in the college football playoff. Barmore totaled 27 tackles with six sacks, three forced fumbles and three passes batted in 2020 while helping Alabama win another National Championship. Barmore had potentially three more years of eligibility, but he decided to enter the 2021 NFL Draft rather than return to Alabama.

As an interior pass rusher, Barmore is a special and rare prospect. He has excellent speed off the snap, including a fast first-step, and more acceleration after that initial burst. He gets upfield in a hurry given his ability to fire his gap and dart past guards, which is surprisingly fast for a big-bodied defensive tackle. That quickness to leads to speed-to-power rushes on which Barmore rolls offensive linemen into the quarterback as they backpedal to try to compensate for his speed. While Barmore is not strong in the ground game, he shows power in the bull rush to get blockers on roller skates and push them into the backfield. Barmore also uses his length to keep blockers from getting into his chest, plus he has strong hands to shed blocks. On top of his speed and power as a pass rusher, Barmore also has good vision and awareness to adjust to scrambling quarterbacks, showing impressive ball awareness to go for the strip or bat down passes.

Barmore is very difficult to block as a pass rusher, and he has the rare ability to effectively rush from the interior of line. Barmore has the potential to be special defensive tackle who produces double-digit sack seasons. Barmore's in-line pass-rush ability coming from a defensive tackle is a very tough commodity to find, and if he has a good defensive end on his line, he could be even more deadly.

If Barmore were a good run defender, he would be a top-10 pick, similar to Quinnen Williams. Williams was good against the run, however, while Barmore struggled in the ground game for a lot of his collegiate career. As a pro, Barmore has to get physical and tougher in the ground game. He often lost his gap by improvising rather than holding his ground in college. He can also play too high and get physically overwhelmed by offense linemen. Barmore has the skill set to be a good run defender, and showed improvement late in 2020, but he is currently a liability as a run defender for the next level and needs a lot of development in this phase.




Barmore's best fit in the NFL would be as a three-technique in a 4-3 defense. In a 3-4, he could play as a defensive end who rushes from the inside in the sub package. Barmore played both end and tackle at Alabama, demonstrating the athletic versatility to get after the quarterback from both positions. As a pro in typical NFL sub packages, which are played 70 percent of snaps, Barmore would fit as a one-gap penetrating pass-rusher on the inside of the line.

BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1 learned from area scouts that while Barmore had first-round flashes and showing some potentially dynamic ability on his game tape, his lack of consistency keeps him from being solidly in Round 1. Those scouts feel Barmore needs to mature on and off the field to provide more consistent effort. That isn't surprising considering he was only a redshirt sophomore in 2020. Those scouts feel that if Barmore had returned to school and become more well-rounded, he could have been a top-10 pick in the 2022 or 2023 NFL Draft. His pro coaching staff is going to need develop Barmore into being a worker who provides consistent effort in training, practice, and down-by-down in games.

Barmore is still the top defensive tackle prospect in the 2021 NFL Draft. Some teams have given him second-day grades, but given his rare pass-rush ability, he probably will be selected in the back half of the first round.




Player Comparison: Chris Jones. Barmore's interior pass-rush ability looks comparable to Chris Jones'. Jones (6-6, 310) and Barmore are almost identical in size and have rare quickness and speed to get after the quarterback. Like Barmore, Jones had some raw elements to his game coming out of Mississippi State, which is why he slipped to the second round. Jones landed with the Chiefs, which did a great job developing him into one of the best interior defensive linemen in the NFL. Barmore is very similar to Jones in needing development but having big-time potential for the NFL.
 

big dog cowboy

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Bobby Belt was just on 105.3 The Fan —
Kelvin Joseph was “completely” in the doghouse all of last season.
He was “incredibly” immature throughout rookie year.
Coaches had little to no trust in him.
“Very poor practice player.”
This is horrible reporting. Where is the other half of the story? What did the Cowboys do about it? What have they done in the off season about this?
 

kskboys

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Several points here:
  • Kid you not, a week before the 2021 draft, I heard someone on The Ticket- another Dallas sports radio station (probably was Bob Sturm) say that Kelvin Joseph was talented but considered “radioactive” by most NFL scouts because of his immature “posse” behavior off the field.
  • That never stops Jerry from using a premium draft pick to show the rest of the league he knows what he’s doing.
  • KJ may get a pretty serious suspension from the league even if he was not officially charged with a crime. He only spoke out about his knowledge of the crime when a photo of the scene that night identified him on the scene. Only then did he speak. And he’s never publicly expressed any remorse for the pain the murdered kid’s family is going through.
  • I would have cut this guy already. His bad attitude and immature, perhaps even outlaw off-field behavior is exactly the kind of stuff this culture needs out of its locker room. He hasn’t even shown that he’s capable of being anything beyond a ST player.
  • He hasn’t even shown he’s worth keeping around. But as Jimmy once said, Jerry never likes to admit his mistakes.
Ick.

This is a guy you might throw a 6th or 7th at. You absolutely positively do not take him in the first 3 rounds. I mean, unless you are really really dumb.
 

America's Cowboy

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Just posted this in another thread. Two people in the vehicle have confessed to the shooting. Guess what? Joseph wasn't one of them.

https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/s...e-day-cowboys-player-spoke-to-police/2943584/

As far as Barmore goes, he's a 3-tech or DE in a 3-4. Playing at NT would be a waste. He's a quick player who is at his best when he's playing one-gap, not absorbing blockers.

Christian Barmore Scouting Report
By Charlie Campbell

Strengths:
  • Athletic; fast interior pass rusher
  • Closes on quarterbacks in a hurry
  • Speed to dart by guards
  • Speed-to-power rushes to go through lineman
  • Ability to bull rush
  • Can redirect
  • Can sink his hips and play low
  • Active hands to fight off blockers
  • Length to keep blockers out of his chest
  • Nice ball awareness for a defensive tackle
  • Ability to shed blocks
  • Agile
  • Slippery at the point of attack
  • Good burst off the ball; first-step quickness
  • Good vision, awareness
  • Carries weight well
  • Natural three-technique for a 4-3
  • Lots of athletic upside to improve in the NFL




Weaknesses:
  • Needs to get tougher as a run defender
  • Will struggle with bump blocks and double teams as a pro
  • Could stand to improve his strength to hold his ground against downhill runs
  • Maturity needs to improve
  • Has to become more professional on and off the field
  • Needs to become more well-rounded, consistent

Summary: Alabama has produced a string of excellent interior defensive line prospects under Nick Saban. Crimson Tide defensive tackles Marcel Dareus, Jonathan Allen, Da'Ron Payne and Quinnen Williams were all first-round picks, and Barmore could keep that tradition alive in the 2021 NFL Draft.

Barmore first saw the field as a rotational backup during his redshirt freshman season in 2019. He recorded 26 tackles, two sacks, and two passes defended while flashing big potential. Barmore took over as a starter in 2020 after dealing with an injury early in the season. As the year progressed, Barmore started dominating opponents, including excellent performances against Notre Dame and Ohio State in the college football playoff. Barmore totaled 27 tackles with six sacks, three forced fumbles and three passes batted in 2020 while helping Alabama win another National Championship. Barmore had potentially three more years of eligibility, but he decided to enter the 2021 NFL Draft rather than return to Alabama.

As an interior pass rusher, Barmore is a special and rare prospect. He has excellent speed off the snap, including a fast first-step, and more acceleration after that initial burst. He gets upfield in a hurry given his ability to fire his gap and dart past guards, which is surprisingly fast for a big-bodied defensive tackle. That quickness to leads to speed-to-power rushes on which Barmore rolls offensive linemen into the quarterback as they backpedal to try to compensate for his speed. While Barmore is not strong in the ground game, he shows power in the bull rush to get blockers on roller skates and push them into the backfield. Barmore also uses his length to keep blockers from getting into his chest, plus he has strong hands to shed blocks. On top of his speed and power as a pass rusher, Barmore also has good vision and awareness to adjust to scrambling quarterbacks, showing impressive ball awareness to go for the strip or bat down passes.

Barmore is very difficult to block as a pass rusher, and he has the rare ability to effectively rush from the interior of line. Barmore has the potential to be special defensive tackle who produces double-digit sack seasons. Barmore's in-line pass-rush ability coming from a defensive tackle is a very tough commodity to find, and if he has a good defensive end on his line, he could be even more deadly.

If Barmore were a good run defender, he would be a top-10 pick, similar to Quinnen Williams. Williams was good against the run, however, while Barmore struggled in the ground game for a lot of his collegiate career. As a pro, Barmore has to get physical and tougher in the ground game. He often lost his gap by improvising rather than holding his ground in college. He can also play too high and get physically overwhelmed by offense linemen. Barmore has the skill set to be a good run defender, and showed improvement late in 2020, but he is currently a liability as a run defender for the next level and needs a lot of development in this phase.




Barmore's best fit in the NFL would be as a three-technique in a 4-3 defense. In a 3-4, he could play as a defensive end who rushes from the inside in the sub package. Barmore played both end and tackle at Alabama, demonstrating the athletic versatility to get after the quarterback from both positions. As a pro in typical NFL sub packages, which are played 70 percent of snaps, Barmore would fit as a one-gap penetrating pass-rusher on the inside of the line.

BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1 learned from area scouts that while Barmore had first-round flashes and showing some potentially dynamic ability on his game tape, his lack of consistency keeps him from being solidly in Round 1. Those scouts feel Barmore needs to mature on and off the field to provide more consistent effort. That isn't surprising considering he was only a redshirt sophomore in 2020. Those scouts feel that if Barmore had returned to school and become more well-rounded, he could have been a top-10 pick in the 2022 or 2023 NFL Draft. His pro coaching staff is going to need develop Barmore into being a worker who provides consistent effort in training, practice, and down-by-down in games.

Barmore is still the top defensive tackle prospect in the 2021 NFL Draft. Some teams have given him second-day grades, but given his rare pass-rush ability, he probably will be selected in the back half of the first round.




Player Comparison: Chris Jones. Barmore's interior pass-rush ability looks comparable to Chris Jones'. Jones (6-6, 310) and Barmore are almost identical in size and have rare quickness and speed to get after the quarterback. Like Barmore, Jones had some raw elements to his game coming out of Mississippi State, which is why he slipped to the second round. Jones landed with the Chiefs, which did a great job developing him into one of the best interior defensive linemen in the NFL. Barmore is very similar to Jones in needing development but having big-time potential for the NFL.
Oooh, look! Christian Barmore was used as a NT lined up over Center many timed last year.



Yes, he played at DT most times, but other times, he got played as a NT.
 
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