Big Board for Pick 12

[beware_d-ware]

I could forgive Bain's length more easily if he had production to go along with it.

DE is a position that you can scout pretty reliably with numbers, and Bain's aren't great. The tape is great, but I am not going to spend a top five pick going against trend.

Bailey is a dude where I don't really love his tape, but his athletic tools and college production are screaming "top 10 pick"

 

[cnuball21]

I could forgive Bain's length more easily if he had production to go along with it.

DE is a position that you can scout pretty reliably with numbers, and Bain's aren't great. The tape is great, but I am not going to spend a top five pick going against trend.

Bailey is a dude where I don't really love his tape, but his athletic tools and college production are screaming "top 10 pick"

That is a big reason I am a little more down on him than most.

If he had 15 sacks and 20 TFLs this year I would probably say who cares...but he has never had a big season like that.

 

[rambo2]

At 12 I would go with one of these:
Bain
Downs
Reese
Bailey
Love
Delane
Styles
McCoy

At 20 I would go with one of these:
Delane
Styles
McCoy
Sadiq
Terrell
Howell
Cisse

Trade back from 20 and go with one of these:
Cisse
Hood
Hill
Allen
Thieneman
Mesidor
Height
R Mason Thomas

Added 3rd round pick:
Keionte Scott
Jadarian Price
Jacob Rodriguez

 

[JIMMYBUFFETT]

That is a big reason I am a little more down on him than most.

If he had 15 sacks and 20 TFLs this year I would probably say who cares...but he has never had a big season like that.

If 15 sacks and 20 TFL is your threshold then you're going to be looking for a DE for a while. Bain had 54 tackles, 15.5 TFL, 9.5 sacks, an interception, a forced fumble, and 5 QB hurries. But more impressive than just glancing down his stat line is who he did it against. 3 sacks, 4 TFL, and a blocked kick against Texas A&M in the playoffs. A sack and 1.5 TFL against Ohio State in the playoffs. A sack and 2.5 TFL against #1 Indiana in the National Championship game.

I'm not trying to diminish David Bailey who I like and have rated higher, but he also didn't meet your threshold with only 14.5 sacks and 19.5 TFL. Nor did Abdul Carter, Mykel Williams, Shemar Stewart, or James Pearce from the 1st round of 2025. Nor did Laiatu Latu, Dallas Turner, Jared Verse, Chop Robinson, or Darius Robinson from the 1st round of the 2024 class. Even Myles Garrett only had 15 TFL and 8 sacks.

I think it's an unrealistic standard. I also think that NFL scouting departments pay a lot less attention to the player "length" column than the draftnicks do. It's a fun stat for us fans to look at just like combine #s are. But NFL scouts are basing their assessment off position coaches, trainers, and people who've directly interacted with the kid for years on the field and in practice. They aren't just counting sacks, measuring their arms, and watching cut ups which is all we as fans can really do.

 

[cnuball21]

If 15 sacks and 20 TFL is your threshold then you're going to be looking for a DE for a while. Bain had 54 tackles, 15.5 TFL, 9.5 sacks, an interception, a forced fumble, and 5 QB hurries. But more impressive than just glancing down his stat line is who he did it against. 3 sacks, 4 TFL, and a blocked kick against Texas A&M in the playoffs. A sack and 1.5 TFL against Ohio State in the playoffs. A sack and 2.5 TFL against #1 Indiana in the National Championship game.

I'm not trying to diminish David Bailey who I like and have rated higher, but he also didn't meet your threshold with only 14.5 sacks and 19.5 TFL. Nor did Abdul Carter, Mykel Williams, Shemar Stewart, or James Pearce from the 1st round of 2025. Nor did Laiatu Latu, Dallas Turner, Jared Verse, Chop Robinson, or Darius Robinson from the 1st round of the 2024 class. Even Myles Garrett only had 15 TFL and 8 sacks.

I think it's an unrealistic standard. I also think that NFL scouting departments pay a lot less attention to the player "length" column than the draftnicks do. It's a fun stat for us fans to look at just like combine #s are. But NFL scouts are basing their assessment off position coaches, trainers, and people who've directly interacted with the kid for years on the field and in practice. They aren't just counting sacks, measuring their arms, and watching cut ups which is all we as fans can really do.

It was a bit more of a hypothetical indicating if a candidate is an extreme outlier as it relates to length, speed, etc I am expecting dominating production. I think you are missing the point bc just about everyone you listed isnt an extreme outlier like Bain is and / or were not top 12ish picks.

Bain hasnt eclipsed 10 sacks in a season and he had 2 more college games than most players this season due to the playoffs. His production is fairly average for a 1st round edge.

 

[rambo2]

If 15 sacks and 20 TFL is your threshold then you're going to be looking for a DE for a while. Bain had 54 tackles, 15.5 TFL, 9.5 sacks, an interception, a forced fumble, and 5 QB hurries. But more impressive than just glancing down his stat line is who he did it against. 3 sacks, 4 TFL, and a blocked kick against Texas A&M in the playoffs. A sack and 1.5 TFL against Ohio State in the playoffs. A sack and 2.5 TFL against #1 Indiana in the National Championship game.

I'm not trying to diminish David Bailey who I like and have rated higher, but he also didn't meet your threshold with only 14.5 sacks and 19.5 TFL. Nor did Abdul Carter, Mykel Williams, Shemar Stewart, or James Pearce from the 1st round of 2025. Nor did Laiatu Latu, Dallas Turner, Jared Verse, Chop Robinson, or Darius Robinson from the 1st round of the 2024 class. Even Myles Garrett only had 15 TFL and 8 sacks.

I think it's an unrealistic standard. I also think that NFL scouting departments pay a lot less attention to the player "length" column than the draftnicks do. It's a fun stat for us fans to look at just like combine #s are. But NFL scouts are basing their assessment off position coaches, trainers, and people who've directly interacted with the kid for years on the field and in practice. They aren't just counting sacks, measuring their arms, and watching cut ups which is all we as fans can really do.

Bain's stock is clearly up which puts him at a top 10 pick.

 

[Cowboyny]

Oh I agree Cnuball make an interesting point but to say he's a late first round pick it's ridiculous I'm sorry.
there's an exception to every rule and that's what I see in Bian. As I have said many times like John Madden used to say sometimes you have players who may not be the tallest or the fastest but their players you can count on. This guy is done it at a high level against some of the highest competition.

There are always outliers that fall through the gaps, remember many thought Sam Mills was too small to play in this league, he is now a hall of famer.

 

[Cowboyny]

Melvin Ingram had short arms and he dropped in the draft although he was successful in the NFL,lets see how short Bains arms are in the senior bowl.

Many media scouts believe he will have short length, but he might be the exception to the rule as he plays so fast and gets so low where big lineman have a hard time getting there. Low man usually wins.

 

[Ekspozed]

I do!

Most analysts project based off if what they are hearing around the league and what teams like what players. It only takes 1 team to fall in love and some teams suck at drafting so it would not surprise me at all if Bain goes top 10.

So he's hearing that despite 31 inch arms teams want him in the top 10. Got it.

 

[cnuball21]

So he's hearing that despite 31 inch arms teams want him in the top 10. Got it.

LoL sure...if that is your interpretation.

 

[Cowboyny]

When I watch Bain, he appears much better when rushing further away from the QB in that wide 9 alignment. Closer he gets, the less effective he becomes. This could be due to his lack of length and the team who drafts him have to play him to his strengths.

 

[Davidlee1973]

Jerry is picking an offensive lineman. It’s all he knows

 

[cnuball21]

Jerry is picking an offensive lineman. It’s all he knows

I would rather have Bain haha

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Owning is awesome but he is notorious for completely dismissing length.

I think some posters (not you) are acting like I think Bain is a scrub which is certainly not the case.

I am a fan...just in the 20s not around the top 10.

LOL ........if you think Bain is closer to a bottom 20 player, then you have lost all credibility to discuss this player IMO.

 

[Hawkeye0202]

DE is a position that you can scout pretty reliably with numbers, and Bain's aren't great. The tape is great, but I am not going to spend a top five pick going against trend.

This is interesting coz we don't have a top 5 pick........the question is do we take him with the 12th pick?

 

[darthseinfeld]

1. Caleb Downs - S
2. David Bailey - Edge
3. Arvell Reese - LBr / Edge
4. Jermod McCoy - CB

Had a hard time putting Downs over Bailey but I think he so much than just a Safety and would bring so much value to our defense. The asterisk on McCoy is he has to participate at the combine and look like the stud from 24.

Honorable mention are Delane (concerned about size and speed) and Styles (slides due to positional value and dont see much drop off to Hill if you want to target both at 20).

It is a short list but I want one of the best defenders in the class at 12 and I think we will have a good chance at 1 of these players being there. The rest of the players being talked about at 12 have too many warts / concerns for me.

Where are you on Faulk?

 

[darthseinfeld]

McCoy might be the only one on that list that falls to 12. I'd run to the podium for the Top 3.

I suspect Dallas' big board is different. Don't be surprised if they have Love high on their board. Dallas has never been one to shy away from taking an premier offensive playmaker. Many of the analysts have Love as a legit Top 5 prospect, so if he fell to 12, Jerry and Stephen might be hard pressed to pass on a Top 5 talent.

I wouldn't make that pick myself, largely because I assume we'll do jack squat in FA to make the defense better. So we need to use those picks on defenders.

Love likely won't get past the Chiefs anyway.

I think with Parker coming on, McCoy could be their top target. I can see him wanting to do with McCoy and Revel what he did with Mitchell and DeJean. Plus the talk so far from the FO is wanting to improve the back end.

Plus we dont know if Bland is going to return to form or if he was a system player.

 

[Hawkeye0202]

I think with Parker coming on, McCoy could be their top target. I can see him wanting to do with McCoy and Revel what he did with Mitchell and DeJean. Plus the talk so far from the FO is wanting to improve the back end.

Plus we dont know if Bland is going to return to form or if he was a system player.

Agree but think his top priority will be upgrading MLBer and/or S positions but I am sure if he will do it via draft or free agency or both. I'm keeping an eye on Reed Blankship. Read a couple nuggets that he'sthe smartest player on the Eagles defense. Don't see Nakobe Dean as some have mentioned......injured prone, plus Spotrac has $15M market value attached to him.

 

[Hawkeye0202]

I think with Parker coming on, McCoy could be their top target. I can see him wanting to do with McCoy and Revel what he did with Mitchell and DeJean. Plus the talk so far from the FO is wanting to improve the back end.

Plus we dont know if Bland is going to return to form or if he was a system player.

I thought DeJean was more a slot CB........

 

[darthseinfeld]

I thought DeJean was more a slot CB........

He is. But the post was more about him possibly looking to make a strong CB group a priority