Seahawks were built the same way we were. my long-winded thoughts

And there are fools here who would follow it right over the cliff
That's not what Im doing. I'm just saying we've done the same things they've done.... built the same kinda team via the same formula. If DeMarcus Lawrence made them elite, why couldn't he make us elite? So it's probably not because they got DeMarcus Lawrence that they won the Super Bowl.

But the big difference is they have a GM. I realize that. Can we overcome that? I guess we'll find out.... gotta go in in this 3 year window.
 
That's not what Im doing. I'm just saying we've done the same things they've done.... built the same kinda team via the same formula. If DeMarcus Lawrence made them elite, why couldn't he make us elite? So it's probably not because they got DeMarcus Lawrence that they won the Super Bowl.

But the big difference is they have a GM. I realize that. Can we overcome that? I guess we'll find out.... gotta go in this 3 year window.
So now you are comparing us to the 2025 Seattle Super Bowl champion Seahawks? And the big difference is that they have a GM? It goes a couple of steps further.....having one of the best GM's in professional sports can make the difference between futility and a championship. They are not paying their QB an astronomical amount of money, thus, being able to afford the likes of D Law. Thirdly, their HC you are dismissing as not knowing what he was doing, and had no experience. Not only is this ridiculous, 45 other teams in the NFL would be more than happy to have him, and not one of them wanted Schotty!

To be fair, you are correct that we could be well on the way to something, and the window is closing. So be optomistic as many are, but do NOT dismiss or compare us to the Hawks
 
If the Seahawks could win a Super Bowl, I don't see why we can't. They're not doing too much different things than we are.

They went and got a good a decent free agent signing..... DeMarcus Lawrence, but it wasn't a splash move by any means. Not seeing much of a difference between their acquisition of Lawrence compared to our acquisition of Gary. Gary has 46.5 sacks on 106 games played..... which is .4386 sacks per game. Lawrence has 67.5 sacks on 157 games played which is .4299 sacks per game. They look about the same player to me. Gary has obviously been wasted a bit on an underperforming franchise, just like Lawrence the same on an underperforming franchise.

Seahawks have Leonard Williams..... but despite being in the league for 10 years made his first All-Pro appearance last year at age 31, and it was a 2nd team appearance. Not sure I see too much of a difference between him and Quinnen Williams except their sacks totals are about similar, and Quinnen was first year All-Pro at a much earlier age...... in 2022. Sure, Quinnen's sack totals have gone down since 2022.... but Leonard's sacks total went down since 2020 and picked back up in the last 2 years. So paper tells me these are similar players and Quinnen can rise his sack totals just like Leonard.

They hired a free, energetic young coach with no head coaching experience. We hired a coach with no head coaching experience. You can say Schotty isn't Mike Macdonald, but you can do nothing except hire a new coach and hope his upside is greater than his resume up to that point.

They drafted a receiver that would become the best receiver in the NFL. We drafted one close, and traded for another. We have even more good receivers than they do. Their Tight End also had about the same numbers as ours last year.

Their offensive line was built slowly thru the draft. As was ours. I do not know of anyone on their O-Line except Charles Cross. Their running backs might be superior, but we averaged 4.6 yards per carry last year, they averaged 4.1 yards per carry.

Their Quarterback is cheaper... but at this point that slight difference doesn't even matter.

We drafted the best defensive back in the draft. It's not a crazy thought to think he can be essentially what Devon Witherspoon was to the Seahawks last year. In year 1. I know Downs and Witherspoon don't play the exact same position, but if you ask me, I think safety play is even more important than CB play because safetys eliminate big plays while most cornerbacks are assigned to take out one player. Safety has different assignments depending on the play.

We added some pieces just like they did. We got players like Dee Winters, Cobie Durant, and Jalen Thompson. They did the same thing and got some good players.... but 0 splash players. We added 0 splash players. You're telling me the addition of 3 or 4 good players on their defense elevated them to Super Bowl winners? If that's the case, isn't that what we've just done with one more draft day left to go?

The only great big difference between them and us is their General Management. Everything else held equal, or at least not by a difference big enough to matter..... their general management is not gonna screw up a great opportunity. We've done this repeatedly.

But can anyone really say that we're doing very different things? They have a great defense but you're telling me that adding DeMarcus Lawrence made them elite? Laughable. We've done the same things to get to where we wanna go..... but you just have to be smart enough to not waste a good enough team. Seahawks didn't.
Great post. Not only has the defense changed but if you think about it, last years and this years offense has changed as well from 2 to 3 years ago with Pickens and all the young studs on the offensive line.
 
We are definitely seeing our defense get transformed in an instant. I agree.
I read an interesting article about cap distribution. Most teams and especially the eagles are about 50% of cap in draft players, a quarter in players the traded for and a Quarter in FA. We are almost 50/50 with drafted players and trade players. Almost none of our cap goes to FA players. That’s the area we can build faster that we just won’t use
 
That's not what Im doing. I'm just saying we've done the same things they've done.... built the same kinda team via the same formula. If DeMarcus Lawrence made them elite, why couldn't he make us elite? So it's probably not because they got DeMarcus Lawrence that they won the Super Bowl.

But the big difference is they have a GM. I realize that. Can we overcome that? I guess we'll find out.... gotta go in in this 3 year window.
no one overcomes a bad GM
no one
 
That's not what Im doing. I'm just saying we've done the same things they've done.... built the same kinda team via the same formula. If DeMarcus Lawrence made them elite, why couldn't he make us elite? So it's probably not because they got DeMarcus Lawrence that they won the Super Bowl.

But the big difference is they have a GM. I realize that. Can we overcome that? I guess we'll find out.... gotta go in in this 3 year window.
I wasn't singling you out...... Seattle and Dallas approach the game from vastly different perspectives. Most franchises want to win at all cost (Philly, LA Rams, to name a few). Jerry, on the other hand isn't like those other franchises. The focus on winning championships isn't front and center in the front office and that lackadaisical attitude trickles down to the players. That's why D Law couldn't make Dallas elite, and until the Jones family alters their focus away from money and media attention no one will be able to do it.
 
All of the prior criticism the team and Jerry got is absolutely warranted. This is the first time in quite awhile I'm actually excited for the defense, we have a clear plan on what we want to accomplish and have put together a dangerous front 7.
 
If the Seahawks could win a Super Bowl, I don't see why we can't. They're not doing too much different things than we are.

They went and got a good a decent free agent signing..... DeMarcus Lawrence, but it wasn't a splash move by any means. Not seeing much of a difference between their acquisition of Lawrence compared to our acquisition of Gary. Gary has 46.5 sacks on 106 games played..... which is .4386 sacks per game. Lawrence has 67.5 sacks on 157 games played which is .4299 sacks per game. They look about the same player to me. Gary has obviously been wasted a bit on an underperforming franchise, just like Lawrence the same on an underperforming franchise.

Seahawks have Leonard Williams..... but despite being in the league for 10 years made his first All-Pro appearance last year at age 31, and it was a 2nd team appearance. Not sure I see too much of a difference between him and Quinnen Williams except their sacks totals are about similar, and Quinnen was first year All-Pro at a much earlier age...... in 2022. Sure, Quinnen's sack totals have gone down since 2022.... but Leonard's sacks total went down since 2020 and picked back up in the last 2 years. So paper tells me these are similar players and Quinnen can rise his sack totals just like Leonard.

They hired a free, energetic young coach with no head coaching experience. We hired a coach with no head coaching experience. You can say Schotty isn't Mike Macdonald, but you can do nothing except hire a new coach and hope his upside is greater than his resume up to that point.

They drafted a receiver that would become the best receiver in the NFL. We drafted one close, and traded for another. We have even more good receivers than they do. Their Tight End also had about the same numbers as ours last year.

Their offensive line was built slowly thru the draft. As was ours. I do not know of anyone on their O-Line except Charles Cross. Their running backs might be superior, but we averaged 4.6 yards per carry last year, they averaged 4.1 yards per carry.

Their Quarterback is cheaper... but at this point that slight difference doesn't even matter.

We drafted the best defensive back in the draft. It's not a crazy thought to think he can be essentially what Devon Witherspoon was to the Seahawks last year. In year 1. I know Downs and Witherspoon don't play the exact same position, but if you ask me, I think safety play is even more important than CB play because safetys eliminate big plays while most cornerbacks are assigned to take out one player. Safety has different assignments depending on the play.

We added some pieces just like they did. We got players like Dee Winters, Cobie Durant, and Jalen Thompson. They did the same thing and got some good players.... but 0 splash players. We added 0 splash players. You're telling me the addition of 3 or 4 good players on their defense elevated them to Super Bowl winners? If that's the case, isn't that what we've just done with one more draft day left to go?

The only great big difference between them and us is their General Management. Everything else held equal, or at least not by a difference big enough to matter..... their general management is not gonna screw up a great opportunity. We've done this repeatedly.

But can anyone really say that we're doing very different things? They have a great defense but you're telling me that adding DeMarcus Lawrence made them elite? Laughable. We've done the same things to get to where we wanna go..... but you just have to be smart enough to not waste a good enough team. Seahawks didn't.
They are next to nothing alike. They traded their franchise QB and former SB champion Russell Wilson when he was 33 and that was turned into Charles Cross (1st rounder), Boye Mafe (2nd rounder), Devon Witherspoon (1st rounder), and Derrick Hall (2nd rounder). The trade also netted them Noah Fant. Every one of those players played a key role into the SB run. Geno Smith played very decent football for their team before they moved on from him too. They just moved on from their hero RB Kenneth Walker. That team will consistently churn their roster, even if somebody performed “great.” Cowboys’ fans should take note that no one player is indispensable besides a Tom Brady or Patrick Mahomes type to organizations actually focused on winning a championship. We could get into the skins on the wall that McDonald had prior to getting hired, but this debate is just pure silliness. They play football in the NFL and so does this team in Dallas-most of the similarities start and end there.
 
It wasn’t until they brought in Darnold.
Darnold doesn’t have the regular season stats your boy Dak has but he sure showed up through the playoffs. Something Dak has continually failed to do. Sure Seahawks run game was there in the SB but Darnold beat the 49ers twice and the Rams twice. End of the season and playoffs. That’s not easy to do! And yes Darnold had help but he played great.
Dak has played about as well as Darnold did and it’s resulted in losses.
 
They are next to nothing alike. They traded their franchise QB and former SB champion Russell Wilson when he was 33 and that was turned into Charles Cross (1st rounder), Boye Mafe (2nd rounder), Devon Witherspoon (1st rounder), and Derrick Hall (2nd rounder). The trade also netted them Noah Fant. Every one of those players played a key role into the SB run. Geno Smith played very decent football for their team before they moved on from him too. They just moved on from their hero RB Kenneth Walker. That team will consistently churn their roster, even if somebody performed “great.” Cowboys’ fans should take note that no one player is indispensable besides a Tom Brady or Patrick Mahomes type to organizations actually focused on winning a championship. We could get into the skins on the wall that McDonald had prior to getting hired, but this debate is just pure silliness. They play football in the NFL and so does this team in Dallas-most of the similarities start and end there.
Regardless of how they compiled their talent the Cowboys have just as much talent as they do. The question is do they have the coaching.
 
Regardless of how they compiled their talent the Cowboys have just as much talent as they do. The question is do they have the coaching.
No, this is just pure speculation. Talent comparison is supremely difficult even for the best evaluators. And the OP is not just comparing the “talent.” Coaching and talent are not the only factors for a SB run either. Plenty of the best talent get exposed in the playoffs and the talent failure cannot get explained away as purely poor coaching.
 
So now you are comparing us to the 2025 Seattle Super Bowl champion Seahawks? And the big difference is that they have a GM? It goes a couple of steps further.....having one of the best GM's in professional sports can make the difference between futility and a championship. They are not paying their QB an astronomical amount of money, thus, being able to afford the likes of D Law. Thirdly, their HC you are dismissing as not knowing what he was doing, and had no experience. Not only is this ridiculous, 45 other teams in the NFL would be more than happy to have him, and not one of them wanted Schotty!

To be fair, you are correct that we could be well on the way to something, and the window is closing. So be optomistic as many are, but do NOT dismiss or compare us to the Hawks
I find you generally long winded. Possibly more long winded than me, so I won't engage you too much. I'm not dismissing their head coach. I just said he had no experience. Regardless of who people wanted..... there's lots of coaches most people say they wanted that turned out to be flops in the NFL. I don't think that means anything.

They are next to nothing alike. They traded their franchise QB and former SB champion Russell Wilson when he was 33 and that was turned into Charles Cross (1st rounder), Boye Mafe (2nd rounder), Devon Witherspoon (1st rounder), and Derrick Hall (2nd rounder). The trade also netted them Noah Fant. Every one of those players played a key role into the SB run. Geno Smith played very decent football for their team before they moved on from him too. They just moved on from their hero RB Kenneth Walker. That team will consistently churn their roster, even if somebody performed “great.” Cowboys’ fans should take note that no one player is indispensable besides a Tom Brady or Patrick Mahomes type to organizations actually focused on winning a championship. We could get into the skins on the wall that McDonald had prior to getting hired, but this debate is just pure silliness. They play football in the NFL and so does this team in Dallas-most of the similarities start and end there.
It doesn't matter how they got their talent. I agree that we need to churn our roster a bit, but didn't we just trade Osa? It's not like we're just keeping whoever shows their face at the front office demanding a contract. We probably should've moved on from Steele, but who else did you wanna see churned? We got rid of Diggs (the right move).... who else? Just curious as to what you're thinking here.

But I don't think it matters how anyone gets their talent. The team remains the same.

No, this is just pure speculation. Talent comparison is supremely difficult even for the best evaluators. And the OP is not just comparing the “talent.” Coaching and talent are not the only factors for a SB run either. Plenty of the best talent get exposed in the playoffs and the talent failure cannot get explained away as purely poor coaching.
Schotty is going into his 2nd year. I think we need to see more before concluding his poor coaching or not.
 
No, this is just pure speculation. Talent comparison is supremely difficult even for the best evaluators. And the OP is not just comparing the “talent.” Coaching and talent are not the only factors for a SB run either. Plenty of the best talent get exposed in the playoffs and the talent failure cannot get explained away as purely poor coaching.
There’s a lot that goes into winning a SB. Some stuff we may not have. But strictly on paper yes I agree with the OP here. Talent comparison isn’t difficult lol. You know why Miami stinks and why the Rams are good.
 
I find you generally long winded. Possibly more long winded than me, so I won't engage you too much. I'm not dismissing their head coach. I just said he had no experience. Regardless of who people wanted..... there's lots of coaches most people say they wanted that turned out to be flops in the NFL. I don't think that means anything.


It doesn't matter how they got their talent. I agree that we need to churn our roster a bit, but didn't we just trade Osa? It's not like we're just keeping whoever shows their face at the front office demanding a contract. We probably should've moved on from Steele, but who else did you wanna see churned? We got rid of Diggs (the right move).... who else? Just curious as to what you're thinking here.

But I don't think it matters how anyone gets their talent. The team remains the same.


Schotty is going into his 2nd year. I think we need to see more before concluding his poor coaching or not.
I’m suggesting that anyone is available for trade, even without an heir apparent. That includes Dak-your favorite player. This team focuses on marketing a star player or small group of players instead of considering a more significant rebuild. They desperately avoid taking risks that might result in a season with fewer than 6 wins, and will aggressively make moves to counter toward the middle of the season standings. I’m not saying Schotty is a poor coach-I’m saying that failures of the team’s most talented players gets explained away as poor coaching. This is league wide and the biggest reason is because teams cannot move on from highly paid players as quickly/easily as changing the front office and/or coaching staff.
 
There’s a lot that goes into winning a SB. Some stuff we may not have. But strictly on paper yes I agree with the OP here. Talent comparison isn’t difficult lol. You know why Miami stinks and why the Rams are good.
How much better or worse is Demarcus Lawrence than Boye Mafe at this stage of their careers? How much would each contribute to team win total and playoff success vs the other in a straight player to player comparison on the Seahawks this season? How certain are you-willing to bet your financial future and career on it? Real talent comparison isn’t some statistical comparison and the best GM’s and evaluators know it. Because the issue might be that you are comparing how that player might perform in the highest pressure situations, how that talent meshes with existing talent (without taking coaching into account), etc-which all falls under the talent comparison for me.
 
Welp. Once again....in April....we're the SuperBowl favorites

Just like last year.

And the year before.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
* And here is where Cheers was the #1 TV show, fax machines were cutting edge technology, and the Vietnam War was closer in time going backwards than the present day would have been going forward.

But...we drafted a safety and signed another team's defensive backs coach, so we're the '85 Bears again....just like last year.
 
I find you generally long winded. Possibly more long winded than me, so I won't engage you too much. I'm not dismissing their head coach. I just said he had no experience. Regardless of who people wanted..... there's lots of coaches most people say they wanted that turned out to be flops in the NFL. I don't think that means anything.


It doesn't matter how they got their talent. I agree that we need to churn our roster a bit, but didn't we just trade Osa? It's not like we're just keeping whoever shows their face at the front office demanding a contract. We probably should've moved on from Steele, but who else did you wanna see churned? We got rid of Diggs (the right move).... who else? Just curious as to what you're thinking here.

But I don't think it matters how anyone gets their talent. The team remains the same.


Schotty is going into his 2nd year. I think we need to see more before concluding his poor coaching or not.
I'm long-winded? LOL. Let me amuse you with the following, and I would suggest your facts are very off if you think he has no experience, and brought his immense talent to the HC position and played a massive part of the success the Seahawks have had. I am also fairly sure there was a good reason why he was one of the most coveted HC candidates over the last numbrer of years...unlike, well, you know.
 
Welp. Once again....in April....we're the SuperBowl favorites

Just like last year.

And the year before.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that
And the year before that.
And the year before that.
And the year before that
* And here is where Cheers was the #1 TV show, fax machines were cutting edge technology, and the Vietnam War was closer in time going backwards than the present day would have been going forward.

But...we drafted a safety and signed another team's defensive backs coach, so we're the '85 Bears again....just like last year.
All aboard the annual hype train...

all-aboard-the-hype-train-all-aboard.gif


By the way, your post was worthy of being it's own thread.
 
How much better or worse is Demarcus Lawrence than Boye Mafe at this stage of their careers? How much would each contribute to team win total and playoff success vs the other in a straight player to player comparison on the Seahawks this season? How certain are you-willing to bet your financial future and career on it? Real talent comparison isn’t some statistical comparison and the best GM’s and evaluators know it. Because the issue might be that you are comparing how that player might perform in the highest pressure situations, how that talent meshes with existing talent (without taking coaching into account), etc-which all falls under the talent comparison for me.
So last year you are telling me you had issues determining if our linebacker room was void of talent?
 

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