Boom or Bust

Clove said:
A learned along time ago not to root for "said" player. I used to completely study the draft and I had my draft guys picked out for 7 rounds. After none of those guys were chosen, I stopped doing that. Unless we are the GM, it's never going to go our way. The best thing to do is sit back, wait for the pick, and enjoy it. Why? Because they're with us if we don't like him or not.
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To a certain degree, that's a smart approach. The problem is, the Cowboys have picked my pet cats before....they got Xavier Woods last year, just for example and Zeke the year before that.
 
FuzzyLumpkins said:
He actually makes the Urlacher comparison too. Look at their combine results. They are near identical.
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hey fuzzy-- i dont follow basketball nor baseball nearly as close as i follow NFL....there is much to be said to "the draft is a crap shoot"...at least in NFL...are draftees who go into NBA and MLB littered with same amount of busts?...just wondering if you may know?
 
Thanks for your write up...I take it, from your perspective, that the pick garnered a linebacker that should be useful in the professional ranks. With an ability in coverage, he should thus be a 3 down player. Important.

Apparently, he reads pretty well and will fight for a play. That means he can fill for a defensive lineman, or drop back. I like that type of play and a set of wheels for lateral play...makes me happy.

I think as this player grows, so will the play of the defensive side of the ball.

Paint this fan very anxious to be able to watch the growth and play around him.
 
jday said:
Original Post. In other words, the post that kicked off this thread. The one that everyone for some reason has interpreted as me complaining about LVE and complaining only. The one that has exposed alot of posters for not actually reading the OP. :grin:
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Honestly? I read it. It reads like a whine. You close it by saying that LVE has a number of the indicia of a bust but what comes before never establishes that. Really, all you establish is that you like players that play with greater violence, like Evans.

Evans was your guy. We get it. It has impacted your view of LVE. You use “wrap up tackler” as a euphemism for “soft”. It somehow counts against LVE that he’s technically sound and wraps up. Guess what? Sean Lee isn’t a thumper either. I’ll gladly take another soft, wrap-up tackler like him.
 
CCBoy said:
Thanks for your write up...I take it, from your perspective, that the pick garnered a linebacker that should be useful in the professional ranks. With an ability in coverage, he should thus be a 3 down player. Important.

Apparently, he reads pretty well and will fight for a play. That means he can fill for a defensive lineman, or drop back. I like that type of play and a set of wheels for lateral play...makes me happy.

I think as this player grows, so will the play of the defensive side of the ball.

Paint this fan very anxious to be able to watch the growth and play around him.
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At this point, with nothing to do but take it, I'm right there with you. I am eager to see this kid prove me wrong. I love the Cowboys more than being right! :thumbup:
 
jday said:
You should get your facts straight. I was responding to someone else who brought up Barbie.

Furthermore, I suspect my credibility took a hit the moment I didn't like your pet cat.

:omg:

Color me shocked...
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Get your butt in chat.
 
jday said:
Actually, I have, once I saw the comparisons being made, I had to see for myself if there was in fact a fair comparison to be made and there simply was not. You can youtube it for yourself. The way Urlacher played was on another level of intensity and bad intentions behind the hits he delivered. Granted, it was a different era with different rules, but I really still don't see the comparison. LVE is not on that level...at least not yet.

So I'll make you a deal: I won't compare him to someone that will be insulting and you don't compare him to someone that will give other not as knowledgeable fans unrealistic expectations...deal?
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There are no Urlacher New Mexico games up on youtube. I watched highlights too but a) I know better than to evaluate off of highlights and b) LVE's highlights are pretty sweet too particularly his forced fumbles.

No one is saying that they are the same. They do have similarities specifically being combine clones. It's a valid comparison.

The only comparison between Carpenter and LVE is the fact you think he is likely to bust. They played different positions in different schemes in different conferences. Carpenter was panned as lacking burst and instincts and having no skill in coverage. He also didn't participate in the combine.
 
I'm on record not being a big fan of the pick, but the guy does seem to lay the wood pretty frequently. He won't hit violently at the sacrifice of not making the tackle, but he will explode into contact without regard when the time is right. He made some violent plugs in the middle for the Broncos.

My biggest gripe is how his frame will transition. He's lanky and plays high a little too much. He needs more weight and to lower his pad level or NFL linemen are going to lift and toss, literally.
 
Outlaw Heroes said:
Honestly? I read it. It reads like a whine. You close it by saying that LVE has a number of the indicia of a bust but what comes before never establishes that. Really, all you establish is that you like players that play with greater violence, like Evans.

Evans was your guy. We get it. It has impacted your view of LVE. You use “wrap up tackler” as a euphemism for “soft”. It somehow counts against LVE that he’s technically sound and wraps up. Guess what? Sean Lee isn’t a thumper either. I’ll gladly take another soft, wrap-up tackler like him.
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You indirectly made a good point there.

My post should have came with a disclaimer:

I will not be held responsible for a lack of reading comprehension.

I'll keep that in mind for next time. :thumbup:
 
GORICO said:
hey fuzzy-- i dont follow basketball nor baseball nearly as close as i follow NFL....there is much to be said to "the draft is a crap shoot"...at least in NFL...are draftees who go into NBA and MLB littered with same amount of busts?...just wondering if you may know?
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The NBA has a real problem with players skipping college and not fully embracing their D League widely. There are many teams that don't have their own development team. As it stands the bust rate in the lottery is pretty similar to the NFL first round but after that the bust rate sky rockets. The curve falls off a cliff whereas the NFL is a more gradual slope through 7 rounds.

MLB is a completely different animal. It is the norm to draft out of HS and they go through several stages of farm clubs before getting to the majors. Development is much much more significant for baseball organizations. Throw into that how foreign players play a huge role and are not drafted and player acquisition becomes much more muddled. Specifically with the draft their is a lot more volatility in outcomes because of all the raw prospects that are drafted and the ability of various clubs to develop talent.
 
FuzzyLumpkins said:
There are no Urlacher New Mexico games up on youtube. I watched highlights too but a) I know better than to evaluate off of highlights and b) LVE's highlights are pretty sweet too particularly his forced fumbles.

No one is saying that they are the same. They do have similarities specifically being combine clones. It's a valid comparison.

The only comparison between Carpenter and LVE is the fact you think he is likely to bust. They played different positions in different schemes in different conferences. Carpenter was panned as lacking burst and instincts and having no skill in coverage. He also didn't participate in the combine.
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I didn't compare him to Barbie.
 
jday said:
You indirectly made a good point there.

My post should have came with a disclaimer:

I will not be held responsible for a lack of reading comprehension.

I'll keep that in mind for next time. :thumbup:
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He has a point about the OP being short on justification for his bust factor.
 
jday said:
I didn't compare him to Barbie.
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You compared the comparison of Urlacher and the comparison of Carpenter. That is what I was discussing. The combine results make the Urlacher comparison valid on their own. There is no such similarity to Carpenter.
 
jday said:
Original Post. In other words, the post that kicked off this thread. The one that everyone for some reason has interpreted as me complaining about LVE and complaining only. The one that has exposed alot of posters for not actually reading the OP. :grin:
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well truth be told..there are some of us who saw your post as a well thought out attempt to be objective to both sides..yes it had some "bent" to it...but we all have our "bents" toward things in life....actually it helped me to not just lazily accept the status quo of McClay and others...Vander esche is on notice in my book...and that is Ok..first round picks should be on notice
 
FuzzyLumpkins said:
You compared the comparison of Urlacher and the comparison of Carpenter. That is what I was discussing. The combine results make the Urlacher comparison valid on their own. There is no such similarity to Carpenter.
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Carpenter only demonstrates that the FO is capable of getting it wrong.
 
jday said:
You indirectly made a good point there.

My post should have came with a disclaimer:

I will not be held responsible for a lack of reading comprehension.

I'll keep that in mind for next time. :thumbup:
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The OP is strong on rhetoric and weak on argument. You can blame that on others’ lack of reading comprehension but the evidence is there for all to see.

You’ve established nothing beyond a personal preference for thumpers.
 
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