Charean Williams believes Dallas might franchise Dak 2 years

[America's Cowboy]

I mean, Carr would be an absolute downgrade from Dak. And not because Dak is amazing, but because Carr is measurably worse at just about everything.

You think Dak dink-dunks too much? Carr has lower yards per attempt and yards per completion!
You think Dak is inaccurate? Carr completes a lower % of his passes, in spite of throwing short MORE than Dak!
You mad about some pick Dak threw? Carr throws more total picks, and more picks as a % of passes thrown!
You mad about Dak's red zone passing? Carr even has a slightly lower TD%!
You mad about Dak's lack of passing volume? Carr throws for a whopping... 14 more yards per game? So there's your big win I guess lmao

You mad about Dak not winning more? Carr has a losing regular season record and 0 postseason starts!

Also Carr is more fragile & can't run the ball at all.

Spot on, bro. All we can do is laugh at their desperateness and willingness to accept worse in return for getting rid of Dak. Crazy.

DDS is real.

 

[mattjames2010]

Grow up. Man up and accept the inevitable. Dak is this team's franchise QB. Even Stephen Jones recently said D-Law's recent franchise record new contract would not remain the highest paid for long (as in months). Y'alls haters attempts to quell your disillusioned minds is pathetic.

"lol"

Grown ups don't call people deranged over a football game and differing opinions.

 

[Jarv]

Oh......so we know for a fact Dak is playing hardball? My point is Charean is offering ZERO to support tagging Dak even once is part of Jerry and/or Stephen thinking, let alone twice. It's nothing more than gossip thrown against the wall.....

True, but if Dak wasn't playing hardball he probably would be signed by now.

 

[cowboyblue22]

in the rams playoff game the rams stopped zeke and dared dak to beat them plus they ran for over 275 yards u know what happened we lost in a pretty bad way

 

[CATCH17]

I am too Catch. I just try and keep it above board. I don't see him as this top rated passer or QB. I see him as a developing player who has a chance to become one of the better QBs in the league, and notice I don't say passer because I don't believe he will ever be that. However, there is more to the position then just throwing the ball. I also agree with you on your second point. His ability to scrable makes up for a multitude of sins for him.

I honestly like the guy, just like I liked Tony, but I was not in favor of paying Tony what we did either. Maybe I'm just cheap?

He's a football player playing QB. That's where the Tebow comparison's come from. Of course he is a much better passer then Tebow but still... He's closer to Tebow then he is Tom Brady.

 

[pansophy]

in the rams playoff game the rams stopped zeke and dared dak to beat them plus they ran for over 275 yards u know what happened we lost in a pretty bad way

Dak's QBR was over 80 in the Rams playoff game. What might the offense have done had they had more opportunities. I'm hard on Dak but can't put the loss on him.

I would be okay franchising him, at least once. I'd be okay paying him more in the end for some certainty about his ability. It's hard to argue that Washington made the wrong move while Minnesota benefitted.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

He's a football player playing QB. That's where the Tebow comparison's come from. Of course he is a much better passer then Tebow but still... He's closer to Tebow then he is Tom Brady.

I agree. Truth be told, and this is going to sound bad because people will read into it but Rosen is actually a much better comparison to Brady then Dak is. Rosen's capabilities are actually much more in line with Brady's then are Daks.

Gonna regret that.........

 

[sean10mm]

If you want to dump Dak because you think anything short of an elite passer with big raw numbers is a waste of time at QB in the modern era, I get that. I don't entirely agree with it, but it's logical enough - nobody's confusing Prescott's stats with Mahomes's, so if that's your bar, then you're right to think Dak doesn't clear it.

What confuses me is people wanting to dump Dak for just ANYBODY else. Like, Carr has been demonstrably worse than Dak at everything happening in an actual football game, throwing short more often while completing fewer passes. Rosen was literally the worst rated passer in the league. We've got people saying Dak is just like Tyrod Taylor, a guy who was drastically worse than Dak at everything about passing.

I agree. Truth be told, and this is going to sound bad because people will read into it but Rosen is actually a much better comparison to Brady then Dak is. Rosen's capabilities are actually much more in line with Brady's then are Daks.

Gonna regret that.........

I mean, Rosen can perform the physical act of throwing a football nicely enough compared to Brady. But he was also the lowest rated passer in the entire league, so drawing a straight line from him to Brady based on both guys passing the "Scrawny caucasians who can throw things" test is just really odd. Every 5'9" stocky dude with a passable-but-not-great 40 yard dash is not, in fact, Emmitt Smith. Mentally Rosen is a lot more like Jay Cutler than either Brady or Dak, which is not a good place to be.

 

[pansophy]

If you want to dump Dak because you think anything short of an elite passer with big raw numbers is a waste of time at QB in the modern era, I get that. I don't entirely agree with it, but it's logical enough - nobody's confusing Prescott's stats with Mahomes's, so if that's your bar, then you're right to think Dak doesn't clear it.

What confuses me is people wanting to dump Dak for just ANYBODY else. Like, Carr has been demonstrably worse than Dak at everything happening in an actual football game, throwing short more often while completing fewer passes. Rosen was literally the worst rated passer in the league. We've got people saying Dak is just like Tyrod Taylor, a guy who was drastically worse than Dak at everything about passing.



I mean, Rosen can perform the physical act of throwing a football nicely enough compared to Brady. But he was also the lowest rated passer in the entire league, so drawing a straight line from him to Brady based on both guys passing the "Scrawny caucasians who can throw things" test is just really odd. Every 5'9" stocky dude with a passable-but-not-great 40 yard dash is not, in fact, Emmitt Smith. Mentally Rosen is a lot more like Jay Cutler than either Brady or Dak, which is not a good place to be.

Dak is good enough to win and in a non salary cap league I'd be for paying him whatever -- like who cares how much he makes. I'm not convinced that any team has shown they can win with the QB and a few elite players eating a lot of the cap.

I don't really like the idea of going through random QBs but would rather do that then eat up a ton of cap space for a guy who is at best still a work in progress, and we still have a run first offense. I didn't see anything that makes me think that Goff is better than Dak, and they got to the super bowl with some help. I'd rather pay for a solid team top to bottom unless Dak starts accounting for 40+ TDs (including rushing).

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If you want to dump Dak because you think anything short of an elite passer with big raw numbers is a waste of time at QB in the modern era, I get that. I don't entirely agree with it, but it's logical enough - nobody's confusing Prescott's stats with Mahomes's, so if that's your bar, then you're right to think Dak doesn't clear it.

What confuses me is people wanting to dump Dak for just ANYBODY else. Like, Carr has been demonstrably worse than Dak at everything happening in an actual football game, throwing short more often while completing fewer passes. Rosen was literally the worst rated passer in the league. We've got people saying Dak is just like Tyrod Taylor, a guy who was drastically worse than Dak at everything about passing.



I mean, Rosen can perform the physical act of throwing a football nicely enough compared to Brady. But he was also the lowest rated passer in the entire league, so drawing a straight line from him to Brady based on both guys passing the "Scrawny caucasians who can throw things" test is just really odd. Every 5'9" stocky dude with a passable-but-not-great 40 yard dash is not, in fact, Emmitt Smith. Mentally Rosen is a lot more like Jay Cutler than either Brady or Dak, which is not a good place to be.

Brady is 6,4" 225 lbs.

Rosen is 6'4" 226 lbs.

Brady was slow, as was Rosen, but each had very good footwork and the ability to move effectively within the pocket. Each has a quick release, each is able to throw accurately within windows, each is able to demonstrate the ability to read defenses and move through progressions quickly, they are really very similar in a lot of ways. I believe that Brady has the better arm but in so far as what they do and how they do it, they are similar in a lot of ways. I notice that you try and draw a conclusion here. You are trying to suggest that I am saying that Rosen is Brady. That's not what I said and that's not what I'm doing here.

Are Rosen and Brady similar, both physically and in their skill sets, yes, without question they are.

Is Rosen's game more similar to Brady's then is is Dak's, yes it is.

At any point did I say that Rosen would be the next Tom Brady? No, not once, not even close.

Rosen is not Jay Cutler. Cutler had a much stronger arm then Rosen and he didn't move in the pocket as well as Rosen does. More accurately, he had lazy mechanics because, like a lot of QBs who can really bring it, he relied on his arm and not his mechanics. Rosen is not, or at least, was not that guy coming out of UCLA. Rosen is not closer to Cutler by any stretch IMO but everybody is entitled to their own opinion.

BTW, I don't want to get off topic here but I don't agree on Carr. I don't agree that Dak has been demonstratively better then Carr. Why do you say this?

 

[sean10mm]

Brady is 6,4" 225 lbs.

Rosen is 6'4" 226 lbs.

Brady was slow, as was Rosen, but each had very good footwork and the ability to move effectively within the pocket. Each has a quick release, each is able to throw accurately within windows, each is able to demonstrate the ability to read defenses and move through progressions quickly, they are really very similar in a lot of ways. I believe that Brady has the better arm but in so far as what they do and how they do it, they are similar in a lot of ways. I notice that you try and draw a conclusion here. You are trying to suggest that I am saying that Rosen is Brady. That's not what I said and that's not what I'm doing here.

Are Rosen and Brady similar, both physically and in their skill sets, yes, without question they are.

Is Rosen's game more similar to Brady's then is is Dak's, yes it is.

At any point did I say that Rosen would be the next Tom Brady? No, not once, not even close.

Rosen is not Jay Cutler. Cutler had a much stronger arm then Rosen and he didn't move in the pocket as well as Rosen does. More accurately, he had lazy mechanics because, like a lot of QBs who can really bring it, he relied on his arm and not his mechanics. Rosen is not, or at least, was not that guy coming out of UCLA. Rosen is not closer to Cutler by any stretch IMO but everybody is entitled to their own opinion.

Read again, I said MENTALLY he's like Jay Cutler. He's a jackass with garbage intangibles who you can't trust to put the work in or lead the team. That's why comparing him to Brady on superficial resemblance is ultimately almost completely worthless.

Lots of guys have had Brady's physical traits, but those traits aren't really what made Brady great, beyond the obvious "can physically put the ball out there."

 

[sean10mm]

BTW, I don't want to get off topic here but I don't agree on Carr. I don't agree that Dak has been demonstratively better then Carr. Why do you say this?

Because I know which one of the guys below is Carr, and which one is Dak:

Year     QBrec Cmp% TD% Int% Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate NY/A ANY/A
Care   32-46-0 62.8 4.4  1.9 6.7  6.7 10.7 240.2 88.8 6.08  6.08

Year     QBrec Cmp% TD% Int% Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate NY/A ANY/A
Care   32-16-0 66.1 4.5  1.7 7.4  7.5 11.2 226.6 96.0 6.42  6.56

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Read again, I said MENTALLY he's like Jay Cutler. He's a jackass with garbage intangibles who you can't trust to put the work in or lead the team. That's why comparing him to Brady on superficial resemblance is ultimately almost completely worthless.

Lots of guys have had Brady's physical traits, but those traits aren't really what made Brady great, beyond the obvious "can physically put the ball out there."

Fair enough but you also suggested that I was drawing a dotted line to Brady and that's not what was going on there. You were trying to frame this discussion and I won't allow that.

This is a true statement, Rosen is more similar to Brady in his abilities then is Dak and that's what was being discussed earlier. The point that was being made was that Dak was more similar to Tebow then Brady. I was simply making the point that between the two, Rosen is more similar to Brady then is Dak. I mean, at some point, you gotta read the thread.

 

[sean10mm]

Fair enough but you also suggested that I was drawing a dotted line to Brady and that's not what was going on there. You were trying to frame this discussion and I won't allow that.

This is a true statement, Rosen is more similar to Brady in his abilities then is Dak and that's what was being discussed earlier. The point that was being made was that Dak was more similar to Tebow then Brady. I was simply making the point that between the two, Rosen is more similar to Brady then is Dak. I mean, at some point, you gotta read the thread.

What you're getting hung up on is that ability isn't just PHYSICAL ability. If your mental traits are trash it doesn't matter if your measurables are like Brady because you aren't going to do jack squat in actual NFL games.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Because I know which one of the guys below is Carr, and which one is Dak:

Year     QBrec Cmp% TD% Int% Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate NY/A ANY/A
Care   32-46-0 62.8 4.4  1.9 6.7  6.7 10.7 240.2 88.8 6.08  6.08

Year     QBrec Cmp% TD% Int% Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate NY/A ANY/A
Care   32-16-0 66.1 4.5  1.7 7.4  7.5 11.2 226.6 96.0 6.42  6.56

The bottom one is Daks and the top is Carr's but so what? Dak has only played in the league for seasons and every single season, he played with better talent around him. I mean, why all the hate for Carr? If you look at last years stats, Carr put up better numbers then did Dak with a lot less talent around him. I don't get it?

 

[Ranching]

Will Grier at 58. Whos down?

I saw him play in person against Texas. Me likey!!!

 

[sean10mm]

If you look at last years stats, Carr put up better numbers then did Dak with a lot less talent around him. I don't get it?

No he didn't?

Year    Age  Tm Pos No.  G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp%  Yds TD TD% Int Int% Lng Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate  QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV
2017*    26 OAK  QB   4 15 15 6-9-0 323 515 62.7 3496 22 4.3  13  2.5  87 6.8  6.5 10.8 233.1 86.4 51.0 20 101 6.35  6.07 3.7   1   1 10

Year   Age  Tm Pos No.  G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp%  Yds TD TD% Int Int% Lng Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate  QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV
2017    24 DAL  QB   4 16 16 9-7-0 308 490 62.9 3324 22 4.5  13  2.7  81 6.8  6.5 10.8 207.8 86.6 69.5 32 185 6.01  5.74 6.1   0   4 14

Carr was also throwing to Amari Cooper, Jared Cook and Michael Crabtree in 2017. His running back was Marshawn Lynch. PFF rated them the #8 offensive line that season too.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

What you're getting hung up on is that ability isn't just PHYSICAL ability. If your mental traits are trash it doesn't matter if your measurables are like Brady because you aren't going to do jack squat in actual NFL games.

No, I'm not. That's what you are hung up on. I made it very, very clear that I was talking about their physical abilities and playing style. I was not saying Rosen is Brady. I think you got it wrong.

In terms of what or what not Rosen can "get done" I don't think anybody knows that yet. Nobody is going to win in Az with the talent they have on Offense right now. They are flat bad along the OL and the really only have David Johnson and an aging Larry Fitzgerald. According to PFF, the worst OL in the league last year, that lack of offensive firepower and a rookie QB, what do you expect? I think Az got exactly what you would expect out of Rosen last year and the season. You can't win like that. What Az should have done last year was sit Rosen and let him learn. Build the Offense and not brutalize your QB. It's crazy what they did there. So no, you can't compare Rosen to Brady in terms of play. One is arguably the best QB in the history of the game, with the best coach in the history of the game. The other is playing for an idiot organization who threw him to the wolves. No comparison at all there but for the record, nobody would have done well in Az last year.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

No he didn't?

Year    Age  Tm Pos No.  G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp%  Yds TD TD% Int Int% Lng Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate  QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV
2017*    26 OAK  QB   4 15 15 6-9-0 323 515 62.7 3496 22 4.3  13  2.5  87 6.8  6.5 10.8 233.1 86.4 51.0 20 101 6.35  6.07 3.7   1   1 10

Year   Age  Tm Pos No.  G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp%  Yds TD TD% Int Int% Lng Y/A AY/A  Y/C   Y/G Rate  QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV
2017    24 DAL  QB   4 16 16 9-7-0 308 490 62.9 3324 22 4.5  13  2.7  81 6.8  6.5 10.8 207.8 86.6 69.5 32 185 6.01  5.74 6.1   0   4 14

Carr was also throwing to Amari Cooper, Jared Cook and Michael Crabtree in 2017. His running back was Marshawn Lynch. PFF rated them the #8 offensive line that season too.

Look at Amari's numbers, look at Cooks numbers, look at Crabtree's numbers, look at Lynch's numbers and then look at the drops. Look at what Oakland did with their Offensive Line. That tells you everything you need to know about the difference between the Cowboys and the Raiders.

And BTW, these stats are not accurate so Yes, he did. I said last year and last year was not 2017.

 

[sean10mm]

You got me on that one, I copy pasted 2017 instead of 2018. My bad.

In 2018 Dak "only" had more touchdowns, fewer interceptions, lower interception rate, better yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, yards per completion, passer rating, QBR, adjusted net yards per attempt, game winning drives, wins and postseason wins than Carr.

Carr had 1% better completion rate, more pass attempts and threw for like 10 yards a game more.