News: PFT: Ezekiel Elliott has privately said that he's planning a training-camp holdout

[Sydla]

If he reports by week 10 then the season counts as an accrued season.
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If a player doesn't report by a certain date during August camp, he loses an accrued season.

 

[Sydla]

I mean...that's what players are doing.

It's why I have also said that the NFLPA needs to step in.

What players? There aren't a ton of hold outs. In other words, you won't see LVE or Smith holding out because Kwan Alexander is getting paid way more than them.

 

[Sydla]

Who said he's a victim? Good lord this forum sometimes.

He is paid less than market value, demonstrably so, because of rules that he had no say in. Holding out is his leverage to get paid what he should right now. That has nothing to do with whether or not he will or won't participate in the next CBA.

You are basically calling him a victim by your argument. When you say it's unfair that Elliott has to play by the rules ("that he had no say in" to quote you) of a CBA that was hatched when he wasn't in the league, that's basically calling him a victim.

 

[glimmerman]

Elliot is running out of his 16 million dollar signing bonus cause he is having to pay it out for his off field mistakes. Lol.

If he is patient then SJ is going to pay him 16 a year.

 

[DuncanIso]

I know simple concepts are hard for you to grasp but he signed a contract stating he would play for 4 years. Now saying he's going to not play IS breaking you word that he gave when he said he WOULD play for 4 years.If the Cowboys wanted to (and they wouldn't) if Elliott sits out, the Cowboys could void out his contract and sue him for the paid but not fulfilled bonus money he received. That has already happen with players and they lost in court. This hard concept for you, signing a contract is giving your word you will honor it.
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I think winning 2 rushing titles in 3 years is a lot of leverage.

 

[gjkoeppen]

If a player doesn't report by a certain date during August camp, he loses an accrued season.

Go check both the CBA and NFL by-laws. If a player holds out but reports by week 10 that season is counted as accrued. This states it and is easier to look up.

https://operations.nfl.com/updates/football-ops/2018-nfl-free-agency-faq/

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[gjkoeppen]

I think winning 2 rushing titles in 3 years is a lot of leverage.

So is getting in trouble EVERY off season a big leverage to not pay huge contracts. He's one little trouble away from a 10 game or 1 year suspension. He was EXTREMELY lucky he didn't get suspended for his actions this off season.
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[Sydla]

Go check both the CBA and NFL by-laws. If a player holds out but reports by week 10 that season is counted as accrued. This states it and is easier to look up.

https://operations.nfl.com/updates/football-ops/2018-nfl-free-agency-faq/

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According this, last year, Aaron Donald would have lost an accrued year by not showing up at a specific date in August.

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2018/08/tuesday-rams-aaron-donald[URL]https://www.profootballrumors.com/2018/08/tuesday-rams-aaron-donald[/URL]

 

[Fletch]

Donald, is it you ?

Yuuuge!

 

[Future]

This hard concept for you, signing a contract is giving your word you will honor it.

Except for the fact that pro athletes do the exact opposite constantly.

Holding out - or breaking your word if your a baby - is a standard negotiating tactic. It's not difficult.

 

[gjkoeppen]

According this, last year, Aaron Donald would have lost an accrued year by not showing up at a specific date in August.

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2018/08/tuesday-rams-aaron-donaldhttps://www.profootballrumors.com/2018/08/tuesday-rams-aaron-donald

First that's an rumor piece. The link I gave you is from the NFL's own site. Now which would a sensible person believe more, a rumor article that actually is called rumors or one that comes straight from the horses mouth?
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[Future]

What players? There aren't a ton of hold outs. In other words, you won't see LVE or Smith holding out because Kwan Alexander is getting paid way more than them.

I mean they could, but they aren't impactful enough players to hold any significant leverage.

There aren't a ton of hold outs because contracts usually get finished before the seasons start. Maybe I should have just said "threaten hold outs," to be fair.

 

[gjkoeppen]

Except for the fact that pro athletes do the exact opposite constantly.

Holding out - or breaking your word if your a baby - is a standard negotiating tactic. It's not difficult.

Talk about babies. It's little kids that think honoring contracts really doesn't matter. You keep thinking like a little kid and us adults will continue to look at it as not honoring a contract.
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[Future]

You are basically calling him a victim by your argument. When you say it's unfair that Elliott has to play by the rules ("that he had no say in" to quote you) of a CBA that was hatched when he wasn't in the league, that's basically calling him a victim.

Where did I say it's unfair? Stoppppp putting words in my mouth. It's not unfair because it's the same standard for every rookie.

What I said was he gets screwed by it, unless he holds out. The NFL has a play (CBA), and he has a play (Holdout). Tit for tat, eye for eye, whatever cliche you want. It's not unfair, just like it's not unfair for him to hold out to get market value on his contract.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I never said anything otherwise.

Just because you don't like the solution, doesn't mean it isn't one. You don't need to explain it, I understand. But since that solution isn't pragmatic today, the only OTHER solution for underpaid players on rookie deals is to hold out. You don't like it, but that's the reality. If Mayfield throws for 5,000 yards and 40 TDs this year, should he just accept making $20m/year less than Kirk Cousins and Jimmy Garoppolo? No.

First, you absolutely did say otherwise. You said that the Owners care. The Pie is the Pie.

Secondly, has nothing to do with what I like or what I don't like. Has everything to do with it actually being a solution. Question, are the players ever going to vote for what you suggest, ever? You and I both know that the answer to that question is no. It's as simple as that. Now, you could have said that the answer is to hold out. That's fine with me, hold out then. It doesn't help Zeke but if that's what he wants to do, that's fine. Just another example of why you don't pay players more then you should IMO but hey, it is what it is. If he holds out, he costs himself a championship and I don't know that that really helps, long term.

In terms of Mayfield, you are talking hypotheticals here. He could throw for 5k and 40 or he could have a set back and throw for 2.5K and 20 or he could throw from the practice filed into a trash can because he suffered an injury or, he could actually throw for 5K and 40 and still not make the playoffs because they didn't win, he just posted stats. Any of these things are possible but the bottom line is, the CBA is clear on how it works and he gets what he gets, if he doesn't like it, he can complain to his union but it doesn't mean he deserves anything more then what his contract obligates. That's the truth of it.

 

[Future]

Talk about babies. It's little kids that think honoring contracts really doesn't matter. You keep thinking like a little kid and us adults will continue to look at it as not honoring a contract.

Not honoring a contract is standard business practice for professional athletes. It's a negotiating tactic, not some barometer of morality. That's the part you don't want to acknowledge.

 

[Future]

First, you absolutely did say otherwise. You said that the Owners care. The Pie is the Pie.

Secondly, has nothing to do with what I like or what I don't like. Has everything to do with it actually being a solution. Question, are the players ever going to vote for what you suggest, ever? You and I both know that the answer to that question is no. It's as simple as that. Now, you could have said that the answer is to hold out. That's fine with me, hold out then. It doesn't help Zeke but if that's what he wants to do, that's fine. Just another example of why you don't pay players more then you should IMO but hey, it is what it is. If he holds out, he costs himself a championship and I don't know that that really helps, long term.

In terms of Mayfield, you are talking hypotheticals here. He could throw for 5k and 40 or he could have a set back and throw for 2.5K and 20 or he could throw from the practice filed into a trash can because he suffered an injury or, he could actually throw for 5K and 40 and still not make the playoffs because they didn't win, he just posted stats. Any of these things are possible but the bottom line is, the CBA is clear on how it works and he gets what he gets, if he doesn't like it, he can complain to his union but it doesn't mean he deserves anything more then what his contract obligates. That's the truth of it.

THEY CARE AND THE PLAYERS DRIVE IT. Good lord.

Yes it is. You don't like my solution, so you say it's not real lol.

It means he doesn't get more than his contract until he holds out. Which is my point.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Steelers fans said the same thing Cowboy fans are saying now. They thought it would be very difficult to make up for their all world RB. Connor wasn’t as good be definitely was good enough for them to move forward without Bell.

Exactly. James Connor is a great example of why I'm not worried if we lose Zeke. I like Zeke a lot, don't get me wrong. But at what price? I'm not saying Pollard is Connor, but I think he can be just as serviceable for us as Connor was last year for Pittsburgh. Maybe even more so with our oline.

 

[CouchCoach]

What will be interesting is that if he's a no show for TC, no big deal unless the other backs start showing something. It's not the norm that a team with one of the three best backs picks two more in the draft. That would be the first thing to get my attention if I were Elliott, right after hearing my Dad tell me to keep my *** in the house and do my drinking indoors.

Bell was a top back but Conner showed he could play at a high level, RB isn't the reason they didn't go anywhere.

If I am the GM, I don't even respond to this threats, if it really is one as Elliott hasn't even confirmed it but he is letting it stay out there to see if it has legs. I'd want to see my young backs, don't need to see Elliott except to make sure he's in shape. Camp is a long way from the kickoff to real football.

 

[DuncanIso]

Exactly. James Connor is a great example of why I'm not worried if we lose Zeke. I like Zeke a lot, don't get me wrong. But at what price? I'm not saying Pollard is Connor, but I think he can be just as serviceable for us as Connor was last year for Pittsburgh. Maybe even more so with our oline.

Then cut Zeke today.

Since he can be easily replaced.

Cheaper.


That what I thought. Bad idea.