It's time for a brutally honest roster talent evaluation

[Jake]

Because if a Fan uses all his efforts in a forum like this to pronounce his hate for the Owner, GM, all coaches, most of the players, and does nothing but spew negativity and make sure he trounces on every thing related to the star, how do you call that being a Fan in any way shape or form..?

I'm not 100% positive I tell the truth when it comes to poor games, bad execution, or coaching etc but at some point the fans who hate things all cowboys for 25yrs, thats the opposite of a fan, thats a critic hats what opponents do..

That's a ridiculous misrepresentation. I don't know exactly when any form of criticism began being described as "hate" but calling it that doesn't make it so.

I, like some others, am frustrated by the way this team has been run. Why? Because it hasn't worked yet the owner/GM/whatever other title he's given himself refuses to change how it is run.

6 head coaches
21 starting QBs
1 GM

That's the last 24 years of the Dallas Cowboys and it has not worked. I'll believe coach #7 is the solution when I see it. Jerry no longer deserves the benefit of the doubt. He has to regain trust or the criticism will continue.

If you feel differently that's your prerogative.

 

[Future]

Yes, you did. You stated the 3 super bowls were reason enough by themselves.

But I didn't say that's why they voted him in.

 

[kskboys]

That's a ridiculous misrepresentation. I don't know exactly when any form of criticism began being described as "hate" but calling it that doesn't make it so.

I, like some others, am frustrated by the way this team has been run. Why? Because it hasn't worked yet the owner/GM/whatever other title he's given himself refuses to change how it is run.

6 head coaches
21 starting QBs
1 GM

That's the last 24 years of the Dallas Cowboys and it has not worked. I'll believe coach #7 is the solution when I see it. Jerry no longer deserves the benefit of the doubt. He has to regain trust or the criticism will continue.

If you feel differently that's your prerogative.

Excellent post.

 

[kskboys]

But I didn't say that's why they voted him in.

He was the GM for a team that won 3 Super Bowls in 4 years.

That alone is basically a qualifier.

Yes, you did.

You are claiming that Jerry winning 3 super bowls is the lone qualifier to get voted into the HOF.

(Pssssssssttttttttt. We can see what you said.)

 

[Future]

Yes, you did.

You are claiming that Jerry winning 3 super bowls is the lone qualifier to get voted into the HOF.

(Pssssssssttttttttt. We can see what you said.)

Are you even reading ? I said it "alone is a qualifier." Not "It is the reason he got voted in."

Like do you know the difference between "a" and "the"?

 

[tm1119]

The Tyron health scare is the most over-rated narrative on this forum.

All we heard in 2017 was his impeding doom and then he went and played better in 2018. Heard the same narrative this year and the only major set-back he had was a fluke impact collision, his 40 million dollar QB crashing into his ankles (that same injury would of happend to ANY tackle that was on the field that play). If it wasn't for a fluke injury this would of been his healthiest season since 2016......... (let's slow our roll on his impeding doom).

If you want to talk health issues are LG Connor Williams has had knee surgery in his last 3 seasons. He's not durable at all and most think he's under-sized for the position. 4 total knee surgeries so far and he's only 22.......

You want to talk real health issues Amari cooper. He has literally disappeared in the 2nd half of the season in 2 of the last 3 years. Not sure if that's someone you want to give 3 years of guranteed high dollar money to

The narrative about the entire o-line is crazy. Fans saw arguably 1 of the best o lines ever in ‘15/‘16 and now complain whenever they don’t see the exact same dominance. Complaining about a top 5 oline in the nfl is ridiculous. Many of these same people that talk about Tyron are most likely the exact same people that swore Collins could never play OT and has to be moved back to OG.

 

[Kaiser]

You are seriously going through life w/ blinders on not to know this.

No, it means I seriously have more critical thinking skills than a 10 year old.

Here is what you are saying -

Person A works full time in an NFL front office, in charge of scouts, coaches and front office people 24/7. He lives and breathes it and is judged on it for 30 years, good and bad.

Person B reads a few articles about it from sportswriters who spend a few hours a day around the people working for Person A.

It takes a 10 year old or a blind hater to say that Person A knows absolutely nothing and Person B knows more. That has nothing to do with "blinders", its common sense.

 

[Kaiser]

Well, there’s Rick Gosselin in his Dallas MN article from 2017 that I referenced earlier. (Obviously I can’t post the link) Gosselin is a local reporter who votes for the HOF. He made it clear in his headline why JJ made the HOF: “Cowboys Owner Jerry Jones earned Hall of Fame jacket by changing the way the NFL does business”.

Gosselin supported JJs election to HOF but he’s made it clear it was for his “business contributions”. And I agree JJ deserved to go in as a “contributor”.

Again that ducks the questions. Where does Goose say Jerry knows "nothing about football". Saying you voted into the Hall of Fame for reason X has nothing to do with whether he knows less about his full time profession than the average fan does from reading a few news articles. Its like saying "Doctor X is an Oncologist but isn't a Brain Surgeon, therefore he never went to Medical School".

And its ironic you use Goose Gosselin as your example. He made his name in draft publications because he didn't pretend he could watch a few games and give assessments on draft position, he would just call NFL Front Office people and average their rankings, then print it. That approach was always a lot more accurate than the Mel Kipper blowhards who would watch a little tape and claim to know more than the Front Office people.

His journalism career is proof of the point I've made in this thread.

 

[Bobhaze]

Again that ducks the questions. Where does Goose say Jerry knows "nothing about football". Saying you voted into the Hall of Fame for reason X has nothing to do with whether he knows less about his full time profession than the average fan does from reading a few news articles. Its like saying "Doctor X is an Oncologist but isn't a Brain Surgeon, therefore he never went to Medical School".

And its ironic you use Goose Gosselin as your example. He made his name in draft publications because he didn't pretend he could watch a few games and give assessments on draft position, he would just call NFL Front Office people and average their rankings, then print it. That approach was always a lot more accurate than the Mel Kipper blowhards who would watch a little tape and claim to know more than the Front Office people.

His journalism career is proof of the point I've made in this thread.

You and I just disagree. No big deal. It’s what this forum is all about. I have always appreciated your strong opinions- even the ones we disagree on. There is no doubt you love the Cowboys...and so do I. We both love the Cowboys. I want them to win another championship. We just disagree on some details- that’s all.

Here’s the problem I have- not with anything you’ve said, but with some comments made by a few on this thread and other recent threads- When we disagree with someone, it’s very disrespectful to a fellow Cowboys fan to call their opinion “hate” or worse, to tell them to “go cheer for some other team”. That is ridiculous and should stop. Again, not saying you’ve done it K but it’s been happening too much on this and other threads.

If I didn’t love the Cowboys, I wouldn’t waste my time posting so many opinions. Some of my opinions are probably wrong too, LOL! But it’s fun to have opinions about my favorite team. Let’s direct our frustration toward someplace Like the ”City of Brotherly Shove“ instead of each other.

 

[Verdict]

That’s because some of us are sick of buying into the hype. It’s “show me” at this point, until then I’ll continue to be more negative than positive.

Im not suggesting you “buy in”. But do you hate the hire and if so, why?

Why hate everything and assume the worst about everything?

 

[Verdict]

You and I just disagree. No big deal. It’s what this forum is all about. I have always appreciated your strong opinions- even the ones we disagree on. There is no doubt you love the Cowboys...and so do I. We both love the Cowboys. I want them to win another championship. We just disagree on some details- that’s all.

Here’s the problem I have- not with anything you’ve said, but with some comments made by a few on this thread and other recent threads- When we disagree with someone, it’s very disrespectful to a fellow Cowboys fan to call their opinion “hate” or worse, to tell them to “go cheer for some other team”. That is ridiculous and should stop. Again, not saying you’ve done it K but it’s been happening too much on this and other threads.

If I didn’t love the Cowboys, I wouldn’t waste my time posting so many opinions. Some of my opinions are probably wrong too, LOL! But it’s fun to have opinions about my favorite team. Let’s direct our frustration toward someplace Like the ”City of Brotherly Shove“ instead of each other.

I agree with everything you just said. It would seem as though there is “some point” where the poster hates literally everything the Cowboys do. If so, how is that person an actual fan?

I mean it is even realistic to hate EVERYTHING COWBOYS? How is that even possible.

Lots of good with this organization.

 

[Bobhaze]

I agree with everything you just said. It would seem as though there is “some point” where the poster hates literally everything the Cowboys do. If so, how is that person an actual fan?

I mean it is even realistic to hate EVERYTHING COWBOYS? How is that even possible.

Lots of good with this organization.

There are several good things about this organization. I’m a big fan of Dak, Michael Gallup, Zack Martin, and many other players. I really like Will McClay and the role he has played in improving our drafts...yada yada, I could go on and on. But if I choose to criticize anyone or anything related to this team for a whole post, that’s not “hate”.

I want to see this team win. Period. And criticism or disagreements should never lead to fellow Cowboys fans telling any other fan to “cheer for some other team”. We all have to stop that. It stupid and extremely disrespectful.

 

[Verdict]

There are several good things about this organization. I’m a big fan of Dak, Michael Gallup, Zack Martin, and many other players. I really like Will McClay and the role he has played in improving our drafts...yada
yada, I could go on and on. But if I choose to criticize anyone or anything related to this team for a whole post, that’s not “hate”.

I want to see this team win. Period. And criticism or disagreements should never lead to fellow Cowboys fans telling any other fan to “cheer for some other team”. We all have to stop that. It stupid and extremely disrespectful.

I couldn’t agree more. Rock on!

That is similar to the sacred cow status of Witten among some fans. When you criticize a player they resort to personal attacks every time.

 

[LatinMind]

Mike McCarthy is a good hire. He gives us a realistic chance to maximize the talent we have, but perhaps more importantly, he gives us the opportunity to have a fresh set of eyes to evaluate this team’s roster. This team needs a really good offseason to evaluate its talent and upgrade where needed.

One of the weaknesses of our organization the last two decades is too often having a rosy estimate of our talent. The best NFL GMs are willing and able to look at players critically and determine how much tread is on the tire of a player and their true value in a hard salary cap.

I’m of the opinion that most of us as fans, and sadly even the Jones power brokers, tend to overvalue our talent. That’s normal for fans. It’s not normal for a good front office.

With that in mind, here are some positions and roster spots (in no particular order) I believe need some real scrutiny:

• LT- Truly one of the 3 most important positions on a team includes LT. From 2011-2018, Tyron Smith was one of the best players in the NFL and perhaps even the best player on the Cowboys roster. But back and knee injuries have made Ty Smith a lot more human. We need to consider that his days as a top LT are winding down.

I think they started the process. With Hyatt. He was awarded as the best OL in college before being drafted. He's really smart his problems came with speed and strength. You can improve that. He's not ready but they really like him as they protected him from being snatched up by putting him on the 53 late in the yr. Tyron is still better than 95% of the LTs in this league. Thats why u have good backups that can spot start. He's still only 28, crazy. We have seen Tyron struggle when they wanted him in open space. Keep him going forward in shorter space and he will dominate. Simple things are needed knowing your players.

• Safety- a no brainer. We haven’t had great talent at this position for too long. It’s time for this team to invest in a premium draft pick at a long time position of need.

McCarthy has always been a guy to put more emphasis on good S'. Showed this in Fa and the draft

• DT- a close second to safety in obvious need. Another position where we have settled for mid-late round draft picks or cheap retreads. It’s past time to address this position early in the draft.

Another spot McCarthy puts emphasis on. There are good options in FA and the draft. IN FA my favorite option would be Dany Shelton for NT. And im the draft i love that James Lynch decided to come out. This guy is a beast at 3tech or DE. He's played in both 4-3 and 3-4 too. And did good in both spots

• WR- Amari Cooper is a great talent and he certainly helped this team for two years. But I don’t believe in investing huge cap space on a position that is one of the easiest to find talent. Michael Gallup’s emergence also makes giving huge cap dollars to Cooper less attractive. I favor moving on from him and saving some cash.

Disagree with this so much. Cooper clearly wasnt buying into what Lal was doing. Questioned routes being called that most were questioning as well. His skill and talent made him successful, but teams started to bracket and take them routes away. Cooper is near the top in all categories for WRs since coming to the Cowboys. He's coming back.

• LB- I still believe a healthy LVE is a great talent. I’m a little concerned about Jaylon after his big contract but he’s still certainly a talent. This team still needs LB talent. We should probably say goodbye to Sean Lee though. Love the guy and what he has meant to this team. But it’s better to cut a guy a year early than too late.

Jaylon wasnt ready for leadership. But he'll be ok. He's a very good talent.He played out of position in 2019 because of Vander esch injury, and the team not wanting to expose Lee at the MIKE. Jaylon started the yr off hot and his force to MIKE effected his skill playing outside. He's very good in coverage and a good blitzing LBer. He's a capable guy inside but with his foot thats not a place you really want him. As the team showed when they put him outside instead of Vander esch. I think they even said this early in TC.

• Guard- I’m not convinced that Connor Williams is a starter. He’s ok at best. Maybe Connor Macgovern is an upgrade and Williams just becomes a decent backup. But this position needs to be addressed.

Agree a little. If Dallas stays in a Zone scheme Connor is def the starter. But if they go Gap blocking i think McGovern gets the edge as you deal more 1 on 1 creating a wall to open up a lane.

• TE- Jason Witten needs to go. He’s a HOFer but he’s done. We need another TE probably from the draft to complement the emergence of Blake Jarwin.

Witten is gone. If he does come back i think it might be as a coach. IDK if i want him as a TE coach but i wouldnt hate it. Id like to see him more of a assistant coach for now

 

[Whirlwin]

Apparently the only thing one must have to become a GM is enough money to buy a team. Jerry qualifies as a GM the night his check to buy the team cleared the bank.

Sherry had a great resume for knowing college coaches players organizations. I’m still not sure he has kept in touch but he had an awesome resume when he took over this franchise

 

[blueblood70]

The narrative about the entire o-line is crazy. Fans saw arguably 1 of the best o lines ever in ‘15/‘16 and now complain whenever they don’t see the exact same dominance. Complaining about a top 5 oline in the nfl is ridiculous. Many of these same people that talk about Tyron are most likely the exact same people that swore Collins could never play OT and has to be moved back to OG.

true we have 2 more years with TS so some plan will be needed and thats why I gave a plan for that..definitely got spoiled have 4 PBs across the line when other teams have 2 maybe some only one..all the injuries others teams have had on the line and we have most of ours intact the entire year..so we are lucky to a point..

truly a wasted season is behind us..

 

[john van brocklin]

Mike McCarthy is a good hire. He gives us a realistic chance to maximize the talent we have, but perhaps more importantly, he gives us the opportunity to have a fresh set of eyes to evaluate this team’s roster. This team needs a really good offseason to evaluate its talent and upgrade where needed.

One of the weaknesses of our organization the last two decades is too often having a rosy estimate of our talent. The best NFL GMs are willing and able to look at players critically and determine how much tread is on the tire of a player and their true value in a hard salary cap.

I’m of the opinion that most of us as fans, and sadly even the Jones power brokers, tend to overvalue our talent. That’s normal for fans. It’s not normal for a good front office.

With that in mind, here are some positions and roster spots (in no particular order) I believe need some real scrutiny:

• LT- Truly one of the 3 most important positions on a team includes LT. From 2011-2018, Tyron Smith was one of the best players in the NFL and perhaps even the best player on the Cowboys roster. But back and knee injuries have made Ty Smith a lot more human. We need to consider that his days as a top LT are winding down.

• Safety- a no brainer. We haven’t had great talent at this position for too long. It’s time for this team to invest in a premium draft pick at a long time position of need.

• DT- a close second to safety in obvious need. Another position where we have settled for mid-late round draft picks or cheap retreads. It’s past time to address this position early in the draft.

• WR- Amari Cooper is a great talent and he certainly helped this team for two years. But I don’t believe in investing huge cap space on a position that is one of the easiest to find talent. Michael Gallup’s emergence also makes giving huge cap dollars to Cooper less attractive. I favor moving on from him and saving some cash.

• LB- I still believe a healthy LVE is a great talent. I’m a little concerned about Jaylon after his big contract but he’s still certainly a talent. This team still needs LB talent. We should probably say goodbye to Sean Lee though. Love the guy and what he has meant to this team. But it’s better to cut a guy a year early than too late.
  
  
• Guard- I’m not convinced that Connor Williams is a starter. He’s ok at best. Maybe Connor Macgovern is an upgrade and Williams just becomes a decent backup. But this position needs to be addressed.
  
  
• TE- Jason Witten needs to go. He’s a HOFer but he’s done. We need another TE probably from the draft to complement the emergence of Blake Jarwin.

There are probably more positions of need not mentioned above. But it’s certainly clear this team needs upgrades at multiple positions. In general, I would say the defense has the most glaring needs. But I also hope Coach Mac is able to bring a more discerning eye on this roster. And that we can stop being married to a player too long because “we love them”.

We like our guys, has been a saying, that i hope not to hear anymore.

 

[Cowboyfanforlife]

Brutally honest...........Need to get alot bigger on defense....bigger corners.....Jeff Heath is just a modern day Bill-bates.....awuzie and brown are pee-wee height....jones probably walks....I think mccarthy starts building through the draft with a whole new regime...

 

[VaqueroTD]

Mike McCarthy is a good hire. He gives us a realistic chance to maximize the talent we have, but perhaps more importantly, he gives us the opportunity to have a fresh set of eyes to evaluate this team’s roster. This team needs a really good offseason to evaluate its talent and upgrade where needed.

One of the weaknesses of our organization the last two decades is too often having a rosy estimate of our talent. The best NFL GMs are willing and able to look at players critically and determine how much tread is on the tire of a player and their true value in a hard salary cap.

I’m of the opinion that most of us as fans, and sadly even the Jones power brokers, tend to overvalue our talent. That’s normal for fans. It’s not normal for a good front office.

With that in mind, here are some positions and roster spots (in no particular order) I believe need some real scrutiny:

• LT- Truly one of the 3 most important positions on a team includes LT. From 2011-2018, Tyron Smith was one of the best players in the NFL and perhaps even the best player on the Cowboys roster. But back and knee injuries have made Ty Smith a lot more human. We need to consider that his days as a top LT are winding down.

• Safety- a no brainer. We haven’t had great talent at this position for too long. It’s time for this team to invest in a premium draft pick at a long time position of need.

• DT- a close second to safety in obvious need. Another position where we have settled for mid-late round draft picks or cheap retreads. It’s past time to address this position early in the draft.

• WR- Amari Cooper is a great talent and he certainly helped this team for two years. But I don’t believe in investing huge cap space on a position that is one of the easiest to find talent. Michael Gallup’s emergence also makes giving huge cap dollars to Cooper less attractive. I favor moving on from him and saving some cash.

• LB- I still believe a healthy LVE is a great talent. I’m a little concerned about Jaylon after his big contract but he’s still certainly a talent. This team still needs LB talent. We should probably say goodbye to Sean Lee though. Love the guy and what he has meant to this team. But it’s better to cut a guy a year early than too late.
  
  
• Guard- I’m not convinced that Connor Williams is a starter. He’s ok at best. Maybe Connor Macgovern is an upgrade and Williams just becomes a decent backup. But this position needs to be addressed.
  
  
• TE- Jason Witten needs to go. He’s a HOFer but he’s done. We need another TE probably from the draft to complement the emergence of Blake Jarwin.

There are probably more positions of need not mentioned above. But it’s certainly clear this team needs upgrades at multiple positions. In general, I would say the defense has the most glaring needs. But I also hope Coach Mac is able to bring a more discerning eye on this roster. And that we can stop being married to a player too long because “we love them”.

I agree with all except WR. Give Coop another year to prove himself with Big Mike although I don't know if that's possible with the salary implications. I have a hard time abandoning a QB/WR team that went for that many yards though with so much of the team falling apart. I have to believe they'll get better next year.

Most disappointing position on that list is LB. That was supposed to be our strongest just one year ago. Hindsight is 20/20, but if LVE is an injury bust when we knew he already had this issue, that's some wasted draft picks the last few years. We were going pretty strong right up until Dak/Zeke's draft year, and then it went off the tracks a little bit.

Some of this almost depends on which defensive formation we're predominantly going towards. We need a fat guy at DT no matter what though.

 

[xwalker]

Apparently the only thing one must have to become a GM is enough money to buy a team. Jerry qualifies as a GM the night his check to buy the team cleared the bank.

Similar qualifications to starting threads...