Does Dak hold the ball too long?

IceStar-D7 · Jan 20, 2022

I guess we're in for a thousand Dak threads moving forward :laugh:

we get it. Dak sucks. According to some. But Dak isn't going anywhere. So if you are a true Cowboys fan you better hope he figures it out. That's my position. I'll stay on the theory it's more coaching then Dak. All I ask is get a good OC or coach in here to prove me wrong. If Dak sucks after this. I'll be the first one saying "good bye" But again. Dak's going nowhere so all the Dak post are well....pretty useless unless asking a question like OP.

glimmerman · Jan 20, 2022

How long is the breaks on the WR routes. When all receivers are going deep and don’t break for 3 seconds to get open then it’s Moore’s fault for not calling short breaking routes. If there is a shorter option then Dak needs to look at it. His pick was a shorter route but was hit when thrown.

glimmerman · Jan 20, 2022

CowboyRoy said:
These idiots on here dont know anything. They see Dak get sacked or he is running around and they all assume everyone is open all over the place and he just somehow decided not to throw it. LOL

The view on the field at the snap doesn't show if the receivers are open or not down the field. They have no clue whatsoever. 5 sacks, 10 penalties, no running room the Oline completely sucked on Sunday. Actually never seen a worse game by an Oline outside of the 8 sacks given up on Aikman some odd years ago against the Eagles.

Moore needed to go to dink and dunk. Let the LBs come and dump it right over to receiver. Or roll outs and dump offs. Keep doing it and they change what the defense does. He learned to beat the blitz. Moore is not reading what’s happening. We are down by 3 intermediate routes if we are down by 7 everyone go deep.. Don’t run except up the gut. No off tackle or toss plays. No misdirection. Nothing to change the way the defense game plan. Trying to beat there defensive game plan instead of reading it and hitting there weaknesses. Roll out and throw to one on one. There weakness was apparently PI and holding on there secondary.

PAPPYDOG · Jan 20, 2022

Kwmike22 said:
Does anyone have a stat on how long Dak held the ball for against San Fran?

Fritsch_the_cat · Jan 20, 2022

Dak holding the ball at all seems to be the main problem.

BBGTYCOON · Jan 20, 2022

Brooksey said:
When Dak was completing 77% of his passes through 8 games, he was averaging 2.5 seconds (#2) Brady was averaging 2.4 (#1).
After the injury he started holding the ball and got into a slump. During this time off he changed the way he plays, either he sabotaged himself
through film study or someone did it for him. Maybe it was an inside job by someone connected to Vegas..we were 8-0 against the spread at that time

CowboyRoy · Jan 20, 2022

glimmerman said:
Moore needed to go to dink and dunk. Let the LBs come and dump it right over to receiver. Or roll outs and dump offs. Keep doing it and they change what the defense does. He learned to beat the blitz. Moore is not reading what’s happening. We are down by 3 intermediate routes if we are down by 7 everyone go deep.. Don’t run except up the gut. No off tackle or toss plays. No misdirection. Nothing to change the way the defense game plan. Trying to beat there defensive game plan instead of reading it and hitting there weaknesses. Roll out and throw to one on one. There weakness was apparently PI and holding on there secondary.

Yep..........he needed underneath crossing routes where receivers could catch it on the run and make big plays. He needed Pollard coming out of the backfield catching short passes and running for big gains. I completely agree with you.

GINeric · Jan 20, 2022

At times he do hold on to the ball too long. Sometimes he should take off and get an easy 4 or 5 yards.

glimmerman · Jan 20, 2022

CowboyRoy said:
Yep..........he needed underneath crossing routes where receivers could catch it on the run and make big plays. He needed Pollard coming out of the backfield catching short passes and running for big gains. I completely agree with you.

Funny we could see this during the game but they can’t. It’s like JG, won’t adjust and get away from game plan even if it’s wrong or not working..

khiladi · Jan 20, 2022

Brooksey said:
When Dak was completing 77% of his passes through 8 games, he was averaging 2.5 seconds (#2) Brady was averaging 2.4 (#1).
After the injury he started holding the ball and got into a slump. During this time off he changed the way he plays, either he sabotaged himself
through film study or someone did it for him. Maybe it was an inside job by someone connected to Vegas..we were 8-0 against the spread at that time

Teams started playing more zone and reduced their blitzing against the offensive line. Dak has been getting favorable coverages to exploit since he stepped on to the field in 2016 with this running game and OL, meaning teams basically were bringing extra men in the box, 1 safety look with man. For the last couple years, I always thought to myself they really don’t respect Dak that much, yet they do it too much. In reality, any NFL QB with adequate blocking and talented WRs that can win 1 on 1 matchups can exploit man consistently. You look at the 1 on 1 match up on the outside, you give a brief look to move the 1 deep safety and you let a guy like Amari or Gallup beat the DB.

Even the article in SI admits:

None of this has anything to do with Prescott’s calf.

Dak sucked against San Diego, whose base defense is cover 2 and this was in week 2, but our RG was playing dominant at the time, so Dak could check into a run and Zeke and Pollard could still move the ball against it.

https://www.bloggingtheboys.com/202...escott-kellen-moore-offense-run-game-playoffs

This article from 2018 was telling us how bad he was against it.

Watching Dak against zone is interesting. These tend to be the times fans and analysts point out that he is holding the ball a little too long. He is trying to wait until a receiver runs open, and if he doesn’t see it in his first reads, he panics, and will use his feet or scramble around trying to buy time. This isn’t about accuracy, or deep throws, or even line adjustments, this is about learning to throw into the pockets or looking back to a previous read.

https://sportdfw.com/2018/10/24/dallas-cowboys-zone-coverage-is-daks-kryptonite/

This article gave numbers in reference to Amari and Dak, right before the Colts game, a team that also ran cover 2 as their base defense and after the article the Cowboys got shut out.

Much of Cooper’s impact this season has been against a man defense. Since Cooper’s first game with Dallas in week nine he ranks first against man defenses in yards (432), yards after the catch (209), touchdowns (6) and has put up a 139 receiver rating.

Having Cooper as a weapon against man defenses has improved the entire offense, as Prescott’s game has been elevated to new heights against man defenses, including a 48-point jump in IQR.

Comp % Y/A TD INT IQR
Pre Amari 52% 6.2 3 3 71
With Amari 61% 8.8 8 1 119

Despite this massive jump in production against man defense, Prescott has not had nearly as much success against a zone defense and his IQR has dropped from 100 to 84 with Cooper on the roster. Though he has an 80 percent completion percentage versus zones, it’s almost entirely short-pass based. He has no touchdowns and two interceptions on 91 attempts

Notice how everything becomes short-based for Dak, though his completing percentage shoots you

https://www.sportsinfosolutions.com...-amari-cooper-face-challenge-with-colts-zone/

Also, to point out, garbage time also pads Dak’s stats against zone, because those are generally soft zone coverage and the defenses are simply content in funneling everything inside to keep burning time of the clock.

Brooksey · Jan 20, 2022

CowboyRoy said:
EXACTLY..........."time to throw" is nothing more than "time until he actually throws it".

Brady gets it out quick and doenst run around so its smaller. A guy like Josh Allen and Hurts run around all over the place so that increases the time until they actually release the ball.

Little to do with how long the Oline game them to throw it.

Dak is not that good when he plays Josh Alllen or Russel Wilson ball, holding it and trying to make broken plays etc.
He plays his best when he gets it out quickly and he's in a rhythm. Our Wr's did not change, the play calling may have.
Between Dak and Moore something went wrong.

DanTanna · Jan 20, 2022

I counted to 4 many many times on Sunday and Dak was still standing there with the ball.

Brooksey · Jan 20, 2022

khiladi said:
Teams started playing more zone and reduced their blitzing against the offensive line. Dak has been getting favorable coverages to exploit since he stepped on to the field in 2016 with this running game and OL, meaning teams basically were bringing extra men in the box, 1 safety look with man. For the last couple years, I always thought to myself they really don’t respect Dak that much, yet they do it too much. In reality, any NFL QB with adequate blocking and talented WRs that can win 1 on 1 matchups can exploit man consistently. You look at the 1 on 1 match up on the outside, you give a brief look to move the 1 deep safety and you let a guy like Amari or Gallup beat the DB.

Even the article in SI admits:

Dak sucked against San Diego, whose base defense is cover 2 and this was in week 2, but our RG was playing dominant at the time, so Dak could check into a run and Zeke and Pollard could still move the ball against it.

https://www.bloggingtheboys.com/202...escott-kellen-moore-offense-run-game-playoffs

So if Dak was seeing more cover two it would make sense to use quick passes and run the ball more?

X550i · Jan 20, 2022

john van brocklin · Jan 20, 2022

Kwmike22 said:
Does anyone have a stat on how long Dak held the ball for against San Fran?

How long is forever?

khiladi · Jan 20, 2022

Brooksey said:
So if Dak was seeing more cover two it would make sense to use quick passes and run the ball more?

They tried the screen route. Remember Buddha Baker and his almost pick 6. The second Commanders game, Moore essentially went hurry up the whole game to try and get the decision-making process out of Dak’s hands and quicker reads.

I said the Saints game really exposed him, because they were the top rush defense in the league, and had no problems stopping the rushing game with four defenders.

With the injuries to our RBs, it clearly was a part of it.
Also, Moore constantly abandoning the run for some reason. It could also be Dak’s limitations as far as formations and tendencies, limiting Moore, which defenses caught on to making it easier to know when run is coming. Dak throws out of certain sets at a high rate. If he’s under center, many of them are the quick hitters, like the Buddha Baker almost pick, where Dak didn’t even bother to look at the defense before throwing.

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/20...lling-snap-analysis-2019-season-dak-prescott/

Swagger · Jan 20, 2022

khiladi said:
Teams started playing more zone and reduced their blitzing against the offensive line. Dak has been getting favorable coverages to exploit since he stepped on to the field in 2016 with this running game and OL, meaning teams basically were bringing extra men in the box, 1 safety look with man. For the last couple years, I always thought to myself they really don’t respect Dak that much, yet they do it too much. In reality, any NFL QB with adequate blocking and talented WRs that can win 1 on 1 matchups can exploit man consistently. You look at the 1 on 1 match up on the outside, you give a brief look to move the 1 deep safety and you let a guy like Amari or Gallup beat the DB.

Even the article in SI admits:

Dak sucked against San Diego, whose base defense is cover 2 and this was in week 2, but our RG was playing dominant at the time, so Dak could check into a run and Zeke and Pollard could still move the ball against it.

https://www.bloggingtheboys.com/202...escott-kellen-moore-offense-run-game-playoffs

This article from 2018 was telling us how bad he was against it.

https://sportdfw.com/2018/10/24/dallas-cowboys-zone-coverage-is-daks-kryptonite/

This article gave numbers in reference to Amari and Dak, right before the Colts game, a team that also ran cover 2 as their base defense and after the article the Cowboys got shut out.

Notice how everything becomes short-based for Dak, though his completing percentage shoots you

https://www.sportsinfosolutions.com...-amari-cooper-face-challenge-with-colts-zone/

Also, to point out, garbage time also pads Dak’s stats against zone, because those are generally soft zone coverage and the defenses are simply content in funneling everything inside to keep burning time of the clock.

The old favourite garbage time! :laugh:

Havic · Jan 20, 2022

Dak holding onto the ball too long is a combination of him not reading the defense correctly and WR's not being open.

1972COWBOY · Jan 20, 2022

Kwmike22 said:
Does anyone have a stat on how long Dak held the ball for against San Fran?

He backs up 10 yrds every passing play. So essentially a 10 yrd penalty every passing plays.

khiladi · Jan 20, 2022

I think one can accurately say:

Dak has perfected his craft at what he is was already good at, but he still sucks at what was always his issues noted in his scouting report.

Does Dak hold the ball too long?

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There are no Dak haters just Cowboy lovers!!!

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