A couple baseball questions

[dez_for_prez]

Being fairly young and not really caring about baseball much I had a couple questions.

1) Should Pete Rose ever be let into the hall of fame?
2) Should Mark McGuire be in the HOF?
3) With Clemens being found not guilty should he make the HOF at some point?

 

[Yeagermeister]

Being fairly young and not really caring about baseball much I had a couple questions.

1) Should Pete Rose ever be let into the hall of fame?
2) Should Mark McGuire be in the HOF?
3) With Clemens being found not guilty should he make the HOF at some point?

1. Yes
2. Tough one
3. He was found innocent of lying not innocent of juicing

 

[Hoofbite]

Yes

No

No

 

[Muhast]

4. Why do baseball coaches where the uniform?


Could you imagine Wade Phillips or Joe Paterno wearing pads on the sideline?

 

[dez_for_prez]

3. He was found innocent of lying not innocent of juicing

So would you let him in? I would rather McGuire in before Clemens because he at least manned up and admited to juicing.

I feel the whole steroids thing was way worse then what Rose did and he deserves to get in at some point.

 

[MC KAos]

Yes

No

No

agree mostly, although clemens might have to be considered but only for his career in boston, basically, i think its safe to assume he was clean before his head got to be the size of a boulder.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Rose should never and will never gain entry into the HOF. There's only one rule for off-field activities and Rose broke it...plus he probably destroyed Mario Soto's career with his gambling.

And all the PED user will end up in the HOF eventually.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Rose should never and will never gain entry into the HOF. There's only one rule for off-field activities and Rose broke it...plus he probably destroyed Mario Soto's career with his gambling.

And all the PED user will end up in the HOF eventually.

Agree on both points.

(I wish the PED users wouldn't get in, but people will eventually justify it that plenty of others have and are using without detection.)

 

[Royal Laegotti]

Nope!
Nope!
Nope!

 

[Yeagermeister]

So would you let him in? I would rather McGuire in before Clemens because he at least manned up and admited to juicing.

I feel the whole steroids thing was way worse then what Rose did and he deserves to get in at some point.

but have they really proven Clemens took roids? I can't stand the guy but if you don't have proof how an you keep him out?

Rose should never and will never gain entry into the HOF. There's only one rule for off-field activities and Rose broke it...plus he probably destroyed Mario Soto's career with his gambling.

And all the PED user will end up in the HOF eventually.

Rose should be in because of his play on the field. What he did while he was coaching is a completely different issue.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Rose should be in because of his play on the field. What he did while he was coaching is a completely different issue.

Doesn't matter when he bet on baseball. Every player, coach, bat boy, clubhouse attendant from Low A to the Bigs...understands that if you do it and are caught, you're gone for good, no ifs, ands or buts.

 

[InmanRoshi]

All the PED users should be let into HOF, and it's stupid for excluding them. Until 2006, they weren't breaking any rules. They were the best players of their era, just like Babe Ruth was the best player of his era belting home runs off of only white noodle armed pitchers throwing on 180 pitch counts, 3 days rest, a flat mound and blown out UCLs.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

1. Yes, unless he was found gambling against his own team. Some say he did. But, there's no competitive advantage to betting on your own team nor, when all is said and done, tarnish the game. Rose was kicked out of baseball more because of the way he acted towards Bart Giamatti and Fay Vincent after it was discovered he was gambling on baseball.


2. No. His use of PED’s was illegal in this country. But, what gets me is that he had a chance to clear the air and likely NOT be prosecuted by Congress. The country really needed to know what went on with steroids and steroid use in baseball because it was slowly becoming rampant in this country, particularly with teenagers, so it was a public health and safety issue. McGwire had the chance to do something honorable and instead took the coward’s way out. He also tried to point to him using Andro in his playing days as a way to take the focus off of his steroid use. So it was a plan that he had conceived for a long time. I feel no desire to have him in the HoF.

3. No. Another player that was able to gain a competitive advantage and helped tarnish the game.





YR

 

[Doomsday101]

Being fairly young and not really caring about baseball much I had a couple questions.

1) Should Pete Rose ever be let into the hall of fame?
2) Should Mark McGuire be in the HOF?
3) With Clemens being found not guilty should he make the HOF at some point?

I'm sure most will disagree with me but NO to all 3

I liked them all until Rose was caught betting on games while Manager of the reds and of course McGuire and Clemens cheating by using steriods

 

[DFWJC]

Rose...YES.
No HOF as a manager, but he broke no rules duing his playing career. He played the game like you would dream all players would play it.

McGuire...no


Clemens...not sure

 

[StanleySpadowski]

There's 6 current HOFers who I know used PEDs or other illegal drugs during their playing careers and those are only the ones of which I know.

The steroid era didn't start in the late 90s, it started in the mid-70s.

 

[JD_KaPow]

1. Yes, unless he was found gambling against his own team. Some say he did. But, there's no competitive advantage to betting on your own team nor, when all is said and done, tarnish the game.

This is absolutely not true. If you manage differently in games where you've bet on your team than in games where you haven't, you've tarnished the game. And since there's no definitive way to prove that you didn't let the betting affect your managing (although there's reason in Rose's case to believe that it did), the very fact of the betting tarnishes the game by introducing uncertainty about its integrity.

And of course, none of that matters, because gambling on baseball is blatantly, specifically and outrageously against the rules, for really good reasons. The details of who you bet on matter not at all.

Rose shouldn't even be allowed in the HOF if he buys a ticket.

On the steroid guys, I think speculation should never be enough reason to keep someone out. Where there's proof ("preponderance of the evidence" type proof, not "beyond a reasonable doubt" proof), I can understand voters declining to support guys. Personally, I'd put McGwire in for sure and probably Clemens as well, but I'm not as hung up on the whole PED as most seem to be.

 

[InmanRoshi]

There's 6 current HOFers who I know used PEDs or other illegal drugs during their playing careers and those are only the ones of which I know.

The steroid era didn't start in the late 90s, it started in the mid-70s.

And the use of amphetamines as a PED started a hell of a lot earlier than that.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

IIRC, there was a study on amphetamines done on fighter pilots because that's whom the government was giving them to for those long flights and the study showed that the amphetamines made their hand-eye coordination and other skill tests *worse*.

Although Dock Ellis did pitch a no-hitter on LSD.








YR

 

[Yakuza Rich]

On the steroid guys, I think speculation should never be enough reason to keep someone out. Where there's proof ("preponderance of the evidence" type proof, not "beyond a reasonable doubt" proof), I can understand voters declining to support guys. Personally, I'd put McGwire in for sure and probably Clemens as well, but I'm not as hung up on the whole PED as most seem to be.

I think anybody could see that McGwire was using the juice just by looking at his rookie baseball cards and comparing them with his time with the Cards.

Of course, somebody will eventually chime in with 'it doesn't help them hit home runs.' But, the scientist that created the PED's for BALCO has stated that his research shows that the drugs actually improve hand-eye coordination.






YR