Amari revisited

Trouty said:
The thread I was gonna post this in was merged or deleted as I was writing it. Same topic, Amari. Where each of us are with the trade, two games and three weeks after it went occurred:

For me, I thought it was a bad trade on two fronts -- The first hang up I had was da Raidahs return, a possible top-10ish pick. That pick is incredibly valuable, and at the time of the trade, for me, Cooper wasn't worth that kind of price, as his play had regressed, production dipped, and there were other concerns floating around him. He is young, had value as a high-reward gamble, but our 1st was too rich for my blood. The news slapped me in the face. I was stunned, and it lasted for some days. On top of that, I couldn't buy into the notion that the FO knew we were gonna draft a WR with that pick, 5 months before the draft, with a full college season still to be played before the then. I thought that line was just rhetoric to help people, like myself, rationalize the trade. A regressing Carr or otherwise, I didn't see Cooper as a no-doubter current 1WR. Or that he would ever be what he was his first two years. There's, what, ~10-15 true 1WR in the NFL at any given time? Probably closer to ten if we're being truly honest and critical about the players.

Now, with that said, through two games with us, I think he's back on that trajectory as an elite WR. Running just exquisite routes. He is damn near breaking ankles out there. I don't remember him being this kind of route technician in Oakland those first two years. He was dynamic, but through two games, he's wow'ing me. The talent and skill he's flashed thus far is undeniable and exciting in my eyes. And for that I feel a lot better about the price we paid. I don't like that we get zero cheep years from him, but if we landed one of the league's top 5-10 WRs for the next 4-5 years in Amari, I can live with getting no cheap years. So be it. We also have to hope and have faith that he remains focused, driven, hungry after his eventual extension. Dude is hungry right now, no denying that. He's making it work with a QB whom, on any given drive, you have no clue what your getting. Cooper's play smacks in the face from the TV.

Second issue I had was the notion that getting a supposed good WR, even true #1 in Big D, was gonna save our floundering 3-4 season, and turn us into a contender. And that a paid Cooper was worth more to our org and future than 5 years of cheap rookie contract. No matter the position, if you hit on that first rounder, those rookie contracts are crack for a functioning, viable org. I didn't view us as contenders on trade day, and still don't... but I didn't even view us as a team that would sniff the division title and a one-and-done exit in the playoffs.

We just beat the Eagles (did you hear!?) and Cooper was a large part of it, I feel. We are back in the hunt for the NFCE crown. For now. And probably still one-and-done if we somehow happen to make it... but I didn't think we stood a chance in Philly yesterday and here we are. I thought last night was going to be the game, the Sunday night massacre, that brought wholesale changes to the Cowboys. But alas. Live to fight for our season next Sunday. Hopefully we don't go into the fetal position @ ATL... like we did @ Skins, a team that isn't good, a week after we exposed the Jags to the NFL. A week after using Dak differently. Letting him run. We didn't use Dak's legs till the fourth quarter against the Skins, but by then it was too little too late. We have Cooper now, and he will help us win, and eternal optimist in me, which has been mostly dormant this season, is starting to percolate.

I don't know how to evaluate professional athletes -- for every one I get right, I get three or more wrong -- so there's no ego about being wrong about Cooper. It's only been two games so far, but his talent is undeniable, and I believe the trade will grow on me. I want Dallas to be great again, and am more than fine suffering with the team and our fellow fans to get there, provided there's a clear vision, direction, executive leadership coming from the front office. Right now, it doesn't seem that way. And that is putting it very nicely. I am terrified of Dak, too. I was one of his most ardent supporters here for a year and half, maybe two. It's hell seeing Dak play like this. I had hoped for a 15 year starter, and through last season into this, I thought we had a chance for that in Dak. Now it's looking to be an NFL career that tops out as a good backup and nothing more, imo. The first 8 words of this paragraph, tho.

TL/DR: I don't blame ya! :)
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We’re one and done in the post season if Dak misses a wide open receiver for a big gain, or he misfires like he did with Cooper on an out and up. You can’t miss those big plays in the playoffs.
 
Redsfan_83 said:
I think we can all say he has had a very positive effect upon this team..O still not great overall, but Zeke, Gallup, Bease, etc...all benefiting from having him on the field. Imagine if we were healthy on the OL?
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Imagine if we had a decent qb that can throw deep with anticipation. Its pretty clear...you wont win championships with a team that lives by the run game.
 
ClintDagger said:
It will be many seasons before we can actually judge this trade. I think the biggest reason the Raiders dealt Cooper was because of a lack of motivation / effort on his part—at least in their eyes. Right now we are getting a very motivated Amari Cooper and he looks like a legit #1. But there’s no guarantee he stays that way. Much like the Maher vs Bailey debate you can’t judge this decision on 1 game, 2 games, or even 10 games. We’ll have to see what kind of contract Cooper gets and whether or not he lives up to it.


I will say this, the top of the draft as a whole looks weak to me so if Cooper can prove to be a top 5-10 WR for many years to come I think it’s hard to judge this as a bad move. But that’s a big if.
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LOL right now the Maher decision was fine..he is starting to push right a bit and hopefully they see that on film and correct it in practice..hes at 81% this year and Baily at just over 80 with Maher having about 8 more attempts and still thats win for the Cowboys because of the money..lets not start taking VAILED shots at brett, he was under a ton of pressure and made what 15 straight at one point and only 4 total in ten games which is top 5 in the league..not bad for what we thought was bad move..
 
TasteMyScythe said:
A 2nd wouldn't have done it...The Titans offered a 1st for Amari,but they also wanted to swap 2nd round picks with the Raiders to kind of balance it out. The Raiders liked the Cowboys offer better for a straight up 1st.
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Source, please?

Second, does that make sense to you? The Raiders left the deal on the table because they didn't like the Titans offer to swap picks. That means the Titans we're willing to part with JUST a first-round pick.
In summary, the Cowboys find out that the Titans offered a first round pick but didn't pull the trigger because the Titans also wanted to swap second round picks with the Raiders. That sounds like the Titans weren't really willing to part with their first-round pick.
So, once again, Jerry Jones got desperate. He decided to give up a pick when even the Titans were less than willing to give up a first round pick for nothing more in return.

Anyway you slice it, we gave up more than any other team did. We got schnookered. Now, Amari might be the final piece to the puzzle, and all these hypotheticals will be irrelevant - if they aren't now. ;)

But if we could have gotten Amari for cheaper (and I believe we could have) then we should have. You don't overpay for an item you can get for less. Just my take.
 
mattjames2010 said:
No, it didn't. It needs a better QB and we could have found one in FA this off-season.

Both WR and TE are such low priorities in the grand scheme of things - with the rules of the NFL average talent at the WR position can get you by.

Giving a first for Amari Cooper will never be justifiable. And if we don't trade back up into the first, you'll see down the line losing that first round pick for a WR will come back to haunt us.
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You don't watch much football if you think we weren't poor at the TE spot and we spot
 
Before Amari, Zeke faced 11 in the box (slight sarcasm). With Amari commanding doubles, Zeke got loose for 151 yards and Dak threw for 270 yards. Coincidence? I don't think so. He was definitely worth a 1st round pick.

The offense now looks balanced and competent now. Hopefully they can build some steam and close out the season strong.
 
Hoe can you revisit a trade after 2 weeks...yet alone visit for the first time?

The trade was stupid when it happened and it remains stupid today.

Let's revisit the trade in 3 years.
 
Jipper said:
You don't watch much football if you think we weren't poor at the TE spot and we spot
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I'm not saying we don't need an upgrade at TE - I'm saying I'm not willing to give up valuable picks for TE, WR, or RB. In the past few years, we've given up first round picks for RB and WR while we haven't used a first round pick on a QB since 1989. You see the problem here?

We got lucky with Romo as an undrafted FA - that won't be happening again.
 
Ken said:
Great addition. Good guy, very good route runner...probably the best i hahaveeen since i i ve started watching the cowboys. I am trying to think of a better route runner...
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At times Cooper reminded me of Beasley's route running, which if a real compliment to Cooper.

But let's see it against a team that has all their starting CBs first. It's a lot easier to look great against scrubs.
 
Toruk_Makto said:
Hoe can you revisit a trade after 2 weeks...yet alone visit for the first time?

The trade was stupid when it happened and it remains stupid today.

Let's revisit the trade in 3 years.
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I don't like the trade, but it's sunk cost now. I do like Cooper.
 
Toruk_Makto said:
Hoe can you revisit a trade after 2 weeks...yet alone visit for the first time?

The trade was stupid when it happened and it remains stupid today.

Let's revisit the trade in 3 years.
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first off don't call me hoe, lol..that being said, I wasn't crazy about the trade either but from a football perspective something had to be done. We may have given up too much, but we had to do something to try to get things moving to try to salvage the season. When draft picks are involved how on earth can you look in 3 years to see how it went? Cowboys don't have their pick, and we have no idea how that pick would work out. Sure we will know how Amari performs and that's about it. And, how can we not revisit the trade after 2 weeks, do you not admit the offense has looked different in those two weeks, or are you suggesting things are the same?
 
Redsfan_83 said:
first off don't call me hoe, lol..that being said, I wasn't crazy about the trade either but from a football perspective something had to be done. We may have given up too much, but we had to do something to try to get things moving to try to salvage the season. When draft picks are involved how on earth can you look in 3 years to see how it went? Cowboys don't have their pick, and we have no idea how that pick would work out. Sure we will know how Amari performs and that's about it. And, how can we not revisit the trade after 2 weeks, do you not admit the offense has looked different in those two weeks, or are you suggesting things are the same?
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Amari is a good player. Of course the offense has looked better.

That's like the Zeke conversation. Yes Zeke is a very good player. Of course he will make the offense look better.

Unfortunately like for Zeke just looking at his performance in a small window is not the defining characteristic in evaluating a trade or draft pick. You have to look at opportunity cost. You have to look at longevity. You have to look at cap implications etc. Just at a minimum.
 
Toruk_Makto said:
Amari is a good player. Of course the offense has looked better.

That's like the Zeke conversation. Yes Zeke is a very good player. Of course he will make the offense look better.

Unfortunately like for Zeke just looking at his performance in a small window is not the defining characteristic in evaluating a trade or draft pick. You have to look at opportunity cost. You have to look at longevity. You have to look at cap implications etc. Just at a minimum.
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gives sports fans something to talk about doesn't it? Nobody is looking for a winner or loser of the trade at this point...
 
blueblood70 said:
LOL right now the Maher decision was fine..he is starting to push right a bit and hopefully they see that on film and correct it in practice..hes at 81% this year and Baily at just over 80 with Maher having about 8 more attempts and still thats win for the Cowboys because of the money..lets not start taking VAILED shots at brett, he was under a ton of pressure and made what 15 straight at one point and only 4 total in ten games which is top 5 in the league..not bad for what we thought was bad move..
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Did I say the decision was bad? I said it was yet to be determined. You are reading more into that than was meant. Unless you are saying you can judge these decisions in just a handful of games. Then yes, I totally disagree with that.
 
mattjames2010 said:
Where did you read this? I read we were fighting against the Eagles who offered a second.
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DMN reported it.....Titans wanted to trade a 1st for Amare...but they also wanted to swap 2nd round picks with the Raiders and that was why the deal didn't get done. Cowboys made the deal with no stipulations.
 
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