Anybody have an observation about Quinn's philosophy of getting to the passer?

[Bullflop]

I still growl at this staff. McCarthy is too secretive for me. He does not communicate often or well for my taste. But that's just me I guess.

Being secretive works out well for Belichick but I'm not so sure there's any real comparison to be made there . . .

 

[TwoCentPlain]

I still growl at this staff. McCarthy is too secretive for me. He does not communicate often or well for my taste. But that's just me I guess.

All coaches are secretive. Very rarely do they give any useful information. They give the pressers because the league mandates it and the league makes money off of them. You can tell the coaches hate doing it.

Why people watch these mindless pressers or care is beyond me. Process. Stacking. Need to watch the tape. Better execution in all three phases. Blah, blah, blah.

 

[DRella]

Quinn's plan is a little different than Nolan's. Its a hybrid 4-3, 3-4 defense with similar schemes. What's different from Quinn to Nolan, is he blitz's secondary more often. Players off corners and safety blitzes. More movement from LB as well.

 

[DasSchnitzel]

Your need to highlight certain phrases and not highlight others shows how you misunderstand what he is saying. Two can play that game.

Obviously, with the change in the coordinator and the coaches, we feel the direction where I see the team needs to go is going to come under the leadership of Dan Quinn. I’ve known Dan for quite some time and having the chance to be in a position to hire him is definitely a huge asset to our football operations. Schematically, to the naked eye, or laymen’s terms, I don’t think we’ll see a whole lot because I think it’s important to build off of what we did accomplish the second eight weeks in our ability to take the ball away. There was probably some conceptional things that felt like our players really understood and played fast with which wasn’t evident in the first eight weeks. This isn’t a start-over situation, we are able to build off of some of the things we accomplished last year. That definitely was a part of my thinking. Having the opportunity to hire Dan and I really like the way the staff has come together. The energy, the enthusiasm, the diversity of some of the systems, so it’s an opportunity for improvement and I think we are definitely on the right path there.

In the 2nd half of the season we started getting away from Nolan's scheme, and basically everyone runs varied fronts these days depending on personnel, down, and distance. Quinn does it and always has, the LoB was not a 4-3 defense.

Kinda silly to insist that we're going to run Nolan's scheme after firing Nolan just because the HC wants to see varied fronts like basically every other HC in 2021, but I think you've already made up your mind about what the future holds.

 

[plasticman]

Based on the Super Bowl game against the Patriots as well as the Cowboy game last season, it seems to be take a lead, then hold on for dear life with your fingers crossed.

......the results are mixed from barely hanging on to historical embarrassment.

 

[gimmesix]

Your need to highlight certain phrases and not highlight others shows how you misunderstand what he is saying. Two can play that game.

Obviously, with the change in the coordinator and the coaches, we feel the direction where I see the team needs to go is going to come under the leadership of Dan Quinn. I’ve known Dan for quite some time and having the chance to be in a position to hire him is definitely a huge asset to our football operations. Schematically, to the naked eye, or laymen’s terms, I don’t think we’ll see a whole lot because I think it’s important to build off of what we did accomplish the second eight weeks in our ability to take the ball away. There was probably some conceptional things that felt like our players really understood and played fast with which wasn’t evident in the first eight weeks. This isn’t a start-over situation, we are able to build off of some of the things we accomplished last year. That definitely was a part of my thinking. Having the opportunity to hire Dan and I really like the way the staff has come together. The energy, the enthusiasm, the diversity of some of the systems, so it’s an opportunity for improvement and I think we are definitely on the right path there.

The important part of what you highlighted is the context of it, which is what I highlighted.

He said what is important to build off is "our ability to take the ball away." The laymen's terms or "to the naked eye" is that the casual fan isn't going to really notice a difference because many of the things we'll be doing are the same as schemes that Nolan or any other defensive coordinator uses, especially those who emphasize turnovers. There are things that are going to be the same, especially with the last half of the season when we started to pull back on a lot of the complications that Nolan added. That does not mean it isn't going to be Quinn's scheme. There's a relation between what Quinn likes to do and what Nolan likes to do.

It's really silly to think that Quinn came here (when McCarthy said he was in demand) and McCarthy wanted him to come here to run someone else's scheme. Quinn's scheme is closer in relation to Marinelli's scheme while some of the back-end coverages are closer in relation to Nolan's schemes. He also mixes in some 3-4 elements that are more closely aligned with Nolan's schemes.

Again, in the last line of the quote, McCarthy talks about "the diversity of some of the systems" with Quinn and his staff. You don't mention the diversity of the systems if the plan is to simply use the system that's put in place. I think you are looking at what McCarthy too simply based on it not being " a start-over situation." It isn't like we're going from a 3-4 to a 4-3 or vice versa. There's a lot of cross over in what the two coaches prefer.

 

[gimmesix]

In the 2nd half of the season we started getting away from Nolan's scheme, and basically everyone runs varied fronts these days depending on personnel, down, and distance. Quinn does it and always has, the LoB was not a 4-3 defense.

Kinda silly to insist that we're going to run Nolan's scheme after firing Nolan just because the HC wants to see varied fronts like basically every other HC in 2021, but I think you've already made up your mind about what the future holds.

You said that more succinctly than I did.

 

[JW82]

he's for it.

 

[quickccc]

With all these new safeties and FA signings..meaning we are going to be blitzing more.is Aldon Smith now considered a pass rush specialist type player if he returns which I would hope happens.

I used to barf at how little Marinelli blitzed to pressure the other team.He was a Freaking dinosaur as DC and happy if Quinn changes things up.i am assuming our new Safeties are going to be coming on 3rd downs now. Hope so. Anybody have an observation about Quinn and his philosophy of getting to the passer. Seems to me a couple of seasons back Quinn's defenses looked like a freaking jail break at times.

Waiting for my answers.Take your time. I got 30 days before the draft.

i'm not as enamored with blitzing as some. Just blitzing for such the sake of blitzing.
there's a different with knowing when to blitz,. and knowing to how to blitz.
Some teams know how to blitz as a meaning to change up, disrupt offensive structure, tendencies, and weaknesses, they specialize at it and it's
what they do. Its' not simplistic and predictable.

And it's a difference between coaches that know how to design blitzes and having the idea player personnel
They know how to scheme and design, how to mask and disguise it, know how to confuse QB, coaches and blockers as a resort.

Whereas there's the other NFL teams that feel they have to blitz because they don't have an conventional pass rush, cannot rush the QB, and have to use the blitz as a resort as a means to gain any semblance of a pass rush.

 

[The Realist]

With all these new safeties and FA signings..meaning we are going to be blitzing more.is Aldon Smith now considered a pass rush specialist type player if he returns which I would hope happens.

I used to barf at how little Marinelli blitzed to pressure the other team.He was a Freaking dinosaur as DC and happy if Quinn changes things up.i am assuming our new Safeties are going to be coming on 3rd downs now. Hope so. Anybody have an observation about Quinn and his philosophy of getting to the passer. Seems to me a couple of seasons back Quinn's defenses looked like a freaking jail break at times.

Waiting for my answers.Take your time. I got 30 days before the draft.

He’s for it.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Quinn's scheme on defense isn't really about Blitz or even Sacks. I mean, they are nice if they come but that's not the objective. The objective is to force bad decisions. So, the front four are set up to force the OL back into the pocket. It doesn't have to be instant or immediate pressure, it just has to be progress. The LEO will take a wide 9 set a lot of times to get the corner and to basically flush the QB to one side of the field or the other. You want the QB to either run back into the rush of the other three DLs or to basically limit his field to only one half of the field. When you flush the QB, you are taking one side of the field away from him so the coverage is much easier. Most QBs don't throw across their bodies very well so it's an advantage to the Defense. This is why it's key to have a LB who can run and chase down the ball carrier because he will often be the pursuit guy that the LEO is flushing the QB towards. The other LBs need to be good in coverage and you need at least one who can play strong MLB run support role because there will be a run game that will need to be accounted for. After all, the NFL isn't quit to the point where they've just made the run completely illegal yet.

So this is the basic role for the front 7. In the secondary, you have a Strong Safety who can intimidate because you are going to see a lot of short to intermediate routes and you want the WRs to be worried about getting laid out. Also, you want that guy to be able to come up and help out in run support. This creates more opportunity for turnovers. So you have a QB basically being flushed, limiting his field of vision, you have CBs who can play bump and run, who can make plays on the ball, who can be disruptive. You have LBs who are dropping into short to intermediate coverage zones and you have a LB somewhere that is going to be scoping the QB or ball carrier and knifing through the blocking scheme to make plays or drag you down in pursuit.

The real star of this unit is the FS. That guy has to be a do it all dude. He has to be the guy that makes it all work. He has to be able to get to every area of the field, make plays on the ball to either break up the pass or to make a play on it to get the turn over. He has to be able to catch, he can't drop INTs. He must also be a good tackler because he's the last line of Defense that is going to be focusing coverage on half the field. So if you have somebody who can make a catch and break contain, he is going to have a lot of room to run if he can get to the far side of the field. That's when the FS comes into play. That guy must be able to walk down the ball carrier and make the play that saves 6. The FS has to be an all world type player. If you don't have that guy, this defense doesn't work.

 

[Redball Express]

He’s for it.

We are all for it. Will we do it or not. You tell me.

That is the 64 $Question.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCB54D1C5255C6B55

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I would recommend everybody watch the Atlanta game again, from last year. Quinn used local pressure to target isolated areas, forcing Dak to make the right call. He over loaded 2 on 1 and 3 on 2 to make Dak account for the third guy. Make Dak either get the team into the right play or beat the blitz on his own and make a play. This is how Atlanta built that huge lead in the first Quarter.

 

[EJK24]

Quinn's scheme on defense isn't really about Blitz or even Sacks. I mean, they are nice if they come but that's not the objective. The objective is to force bad decisions. So, the front four are set up to force the OL back into the pocket. It doesn't have to be instant or immediate pressure, it just has to be progress. The LEO will take a wide 9 set a lot of times to get the corner and to basically flush the QB to one side of the field or the other. You want the QB to either run back into the rush of the other three DLs or to basically limit his field to only one half of the field. When you flush the QB, you are taking one side of the field away from him so the coverage is much easier. Most QBs don't throw across their bodies very well so it's an advantage to the Defense. This is why it's key to have a LB who can run and chase down the ball carrier because he will often be the pursuit guy that the LEO is flushing the QB towards. The other LBs need to be good in coverage and you need at least one who can play strong MLB run support role because there will be a run game that will need to be accounted for. After all, the NFL isn't quit to the point where they've just made the run completely illegal yet.

So this is the basic role for the front 7. In the secondary, you have a Strong Safety who can intimidate because you are going to see a lot of short to intermediate routes and you want the WRs to be worried about getting laid out. Also, you want that guy to be able to come up and help out in run support. This creates more opportunity for turnovers. So you have a QB basically being flushed, limiting his field of vision, you have CBs who can play bump and run, who can make plays on the ball, who can be disruptive. You have LBs who are dropping into short to intermediate coverage zones and you have a LB somewhere that is going to be scoping the QB or ball carrier and knifing through the blocking scheme to make plays or drag you down in pursuit.

The real star of this unit is the FS. That guy has to be a do it all dude. He has to be the guy that makes it all work. He has to be able to get to every area of the field, make plays on the ball to either break up the pass or to make a play on it to get the turn over. He has to be able to catch, he can't drop INTs. He must also be a good tackler because he's the last line of Defense that is going to be focusing coverage on half the field. So if you have somebody who can make a catch and break contain, he is going to have a lot of room to run if he can get to the far side of the field. That's when the FS comes into play. That guy must be able to walk down the ball carrier and make the play that saves 6. The FS has to be an all world type player. If you don't have that guy, this defense doesn't work.

Nice write-up.

With your emphasis on safety in mind, I wonder if there is a chance we could land Trevon Moehrig in a trade down and then pick up a corner with our second round pick.

We could still get LB or DT help in the third and beyond and have our true center field Safety for years to come.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Nice write-up.

With your emphasis on safety in mind, I wonder if there is a chance we could land Trevon Moehrig in a trade down and then pick up a corner with our second round pick.

We could still get LB or DT help in the third and beyond and have our true center field Safety for years to come.

Moehrig aint the guy IMO. I don't know if that Safety is in this draft or not. Richie Grant might be that guy but he might be drafted by a team who likes him better at Corner too, IDK.

I guess we will see what they do there.

 

[calicowboy54]

In the 2nd half of the season we started getting away from Nolan's scheme, and basically everyone runs varied fronts these days depending on personnel, down, and distance. Quinn does it and always has, the LoB was not a 4-3 defense.

Kinda silly to insist that we're going to run Nolan's scheme after firing Nolan just because the HC wants to see varied fronts like basically every other HC in 2021, but I think you've already made up your mind about what the future holds.

I agree you saw some 4-3 / 3-4 during his time with LoB, i believe 1st year he had bigger D-Line and employed more of a 3-4 look with big S-LB 5T NT 4T LEO W-LB. then with bennett and others it looked more like traditional S-LB 4-3 DE NT 3T LEO W-LB. in both schemes the S-LB was your rush LB with LEO standing up or putting hand in dirt. this all is simular to what Nolan was attempting to do last year.

I think the deference is going to be on backend with Cover1/3 and 1Gaping the DL as apposed to 2Gapping the DL

 

[charron]

Being secretive works out well for Belichick but I'm not so sure there's any real comparison to be made there . . .

no one has to question big bill

 

[Praxit]

Philosophy is not to lose the game when you have the lead of over 20 points.

..unless you have a QB like Dak, who can unload points in mins. But yeah, huge fall to let a lead of that margin go.

 

[jterrell]

Nolan runs 4-3 over, 4-3 under and Bear fronts.
He likes undersized pass rushers but has missed on some.
He will likely employ Randy Gregory as his primary pass rusher.

His system isn't that complicated to learn or execute but you do need players to pull it off.
He did in Seattle.
In ATL it got ragged at times, especially after injuries hit them.

The new special sauce for most teams has been employing the SS as the Will.
So you take off a LB and replace him with a slot CB then shift the SS to Will.
It makes you much better in coverage without suffering much in run defense.
It's probably smarter than the recent past of just draft 225-235 pound backers who can cover but also can be bullied in the power run game.
The Vision is clear imho no matter what MM says.
DLaw and Urban will play 2 gap a decent amount of time on non certain passing downs. AWoods as the back up NT

The 3T will be Hill and Gallimore and they'll 1 gap.
Gregory will be a wide 9 type 1 gap.
The SAM will play a decent amount of man coverage on the edge and be a blitzer.
The LBs will have 1 gap and be asked to attack before the offense gets the hole created.

 

[jterrell]

Based on the Super Bowl game against the Patriots as well as the Cowboy game last season, it seems to be take a lead, then hold on for dear life with your fingers crossed.

......the results are mixed from barely hanging on to historical embarrassment.

The jokes are solid but it seems as a Cowboys fan getting to a Super Bowl to lose a lead and close game would be a pretty darn big win.