Bergeron on being passed for Mazi: I was upset, proved them wrong

The league didn't agree with Bergeron.
People are always goofy about bets that pan out. Sometimes bad bets pan out. Didn't mean they were good bets.
What are you on about?

The Cowboys were considering taking Bergeron at #27 (not #19 as you claimed).

This is not some fan debate lamenting about who they would have drafted instead.

Taking Bergeron over Mazi would have been the right choice.
 
How many first round picks have the rams had the last few years? No you don’t have to hit on every first round pick to win a SB. No one does. But I’m sure it helps.
How many has SEA had? How many has Philly had? How about KC?

You're trying to make a rule using only one example, when there are a myriad of examples the other way. We built a 3 time super bowl contender using extra 1sts. Same thing SEA just did last season.
 
Never mention that name. I'm still mad we didn't take Fletcher Cox instead of Mo.
Infuriated.

Our resident LSU fan at the time(Boutteman) was furious that we took the LSU player in MO. Before he ever played Boutte told us that he was no more than a product of having a mass of talent around him. Let's see, MO was slow, didn't turn all that well, didn't mirror WRs well.......what was it again that made him worth the 6th pick in the draft?
 
How many has SEA had? How many has Philly had? How about KC?

You're trying to make a rule using only one example, when there are a myriad of examples the other way. We built a 3 time super bowl contender using extra 1sts. Same thing SEA just did last season.
I don’t make any rules lol. You bring up your cherry picked examples as well. There is no exact science to winning and there are many ways to go about it. Obviously it’s more helpful when you hit on your first round picks, but you also have to hit on some later picks, do well in.free agency, and make some fruitful trades. Along with a little of luck.
 
Half the first round is a bust every year. Acting like it’s some high percentage hit rate is disingenuous. Granted we haven’t drafted as well the last 5 years or so.
And acting like it doesn't matter if we pick obvious busts is even more disingenuous.
 
So you're OK w/ us drafting obvious busts just because other teams do it?

I just do not get your logic here.
Where did I say that. I’d prefer to hit on them. I’m just pointing out that it’s not as easy as you make it seem. There are othe ways to win. Like hitting on draft picks in the other rounds, trades, FA, etc
 
I don’t make any rules lol. You bring up your cherry picked examples as well. There is no exact science to winning and there are many ways to go about it. Obviously it’s more helpful when you hit on your first round picks, but you also have to hit on some later picks, do well in.free agency, and make some fruitful trades. Along with a little of luck.
No, I did not. I looked at the successful teams of recent. Most were built on 1st round picks. Why would you say I cherry picked? I think you're misusing the term. I used models of success.
All of your last couple of sentences is true, but that does not support your devaluing 1st round picks.

Actually, there is an exact science to winning. Get a good QB, an OL that can protect, and a DLine that disrupts the opposing O and stops the run. Fill in the rest. This is the exact science that has always worked and is exactly how the super bowl winners of today are built.
 
Where did I say that. I’d prefer to hit on them. I’m just pointing out that it’s not as easy as you make it seem. There are othe ways to win. Like hitting on draft picks in the other rounds, trades, FA, etc
What? Where in the world did I say it was easy? Looks like you're going strawman here.

And what I'm arguing is against taking obvious busts like Mazi. No one screams for DTs more than I around here. So, why do you think it was that I did not like the Mazi pick?
 
No, I did not. I looked at the successful teams of recent. Most were built on 1st round picks. Why would you say I cherry picked? I think you're misusing the term. I used models of success.
All of your last couple of sentences is true, but that does not support your devaluing 1st round picks.

Actually, there is an exact science to winning. Get a good QB, an OL that can protect, and a DLine that disrupts the opposing O and stops the run. Fill in the rest. This is the exact science that has always worked and is exactly how the super bowl winners of today are built.
This is interesting. Mazi was the 23rd pick in the 2023 draft. From years 2000-2024, there have been 27 DT's picked between picks 21-32. One has made one AP team, three have been a Pro Bowl selection, and six played one year or less. The others fall between JAG's, solid backups, or average starters. At this point, we can assume Mazi is a JAG, nothing more. Team building is hard.
 
This is interesting. Mazi was the 23rd pick in the 2023 draft. From years 2000-2024, there have been 27 DT's picked between picks 21-32. One has made one AP team, three have been a Pro Bowl selection, and six played one year or less. The others fall between JAG's, solid backups, or average starters. Team building is hard. It's harder with an owner/GM that thinks he can do it all.
Absolutely, and picking the DT position might be the hardest position to draft.

However, taking a DT in the 1st who is slow off the ball and lacks lateral agility is just stupid.
 
And acting like it doesn't matter if we pick obvious busts is even more disingenuous.
You’re taking one horrendous pick and making it seem like the norm. Busts happen all the time because it isn’t an exact science. 50% hit rate on first round pivots proves that.
 
Actually, there is an exact science to winning. Get a good QB, an OL that can protect, and a DLine that disrupts the opposing O and stops the run. Fill in the rest. This is the exact science that has always worked and is exactly how the super bowl winners of today are built.
Your last paragraph is pretty spot on. But you didn’t mention first round picks. There are different ways to acquire talent, and it doesn’t have to be always be 1st round picks. The Pats probably wouldn’t have won all those SBs if they hadn’t lucked out on their famous 6th round pick. Parcells said it didn’t matter what rounds the hits come from, as long as you’re hitting on enough of them. I’m not defending the Mazi pick but it’s not like we pick an obvious bust every year. Trystan and Taco come close but not completely obvious.
 
You’re taking one horrendous pick and making it seem like the norm. Busts happen all the time because it isn’t an exact science. 50% hit rate on first round pivots proves that.
Another strawman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You must be speaking to another poster, because that's not even in the same realm of what I'm doing.

Your little stats are not relevant. Are you sure you're not taking something someone else said and applying it to me? Because your responses don't fit my posts.

Mazi was a terrible pick. That is all I've claimed. Why was he a terrible pick? I've already told you, but I'll restate: Slow off the ball, lacks lateral agility, and wasn't all that good in college.

I'm talking about why it was a terrible pick, your stats are not relevant to my arguments.
 
Your last paragraph is pretty spot on. But you didn’t mention first round picks. There are different ways to acquire talent, and it doesn’t have to be always be 1st round picks. The Pats probably wouldn’t have won all those SBs if they hadn’t lucked out on their famous 6th round pick. Parcells said it didn’t matter what rounds the hits come from, as long as you’re hitting on enough of them. I’m not defending the Mazi pick but it’s not like we pick an obvious bust every year. Trystan and Taco come close but not completely obvious.
Dude, quit arguing stuff I'm not saying!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Agree w/ your middle paragraphs.

I didn't mention first round picks because that is NOT what I'm even talking about. I'm talking about taking players who had obvious bust signs. Gregory, Mazi, Mo, Trysten Hill, guys like that.

Taco was not a terrible pick, he was a good pick that didn't work out.
 
I’ve been ardently following the draft for 35+ years now. Even so, Mazi was a lesson for me to trust your eyes and convictions.

I never saw the player Mazi was purported to be on tape at Michigan. Combine that with his absolutely abysmal production and it was clear to see he was purely hype—a myth based on supposed freaky athleticism.

Despite all that I allowed myself to be convinced there must be something I’m just missing. There wasn’t.
Blink - Malcolm Gladwell. 35 years of reps allows a person to invoke the eye test. I do look at stats, film reviews, analysis, etc....but I also include the basic eye test. Almost never fails.
 
Another strawman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You must be speaking to another poster, because that's not even in the same realm of what I'm doing.

Your little stats are not relevant. Are you sure you're not taking something someone else said and applying it to me? Because your responses don't fit my posts.

Mazi was a terrible pick. That is all I've claimed. Why was he a terrible pick? I've already told you, but I'll restate: Slow off the ball, lacks lateral agility, and wasn't all that good in college.

I'm talking about why it was a terrible pick, your stats are not relevant to my arguments.
Okay, you’re the one stating that you need to hit in first round picks to be successful and not pick obvious busts like Mazi. I’m replying directly to your comment. Am I mixing two different conversions together? If so, I apologize.
 
Okay, you’re the one stating that you need to hit in first round picks to be successful and not pick obvious busts like Mazi. I’m replying directly to your comment. Am I mixing two different conversions together? If so, I apologize.
You absolutely are.

My argument: You are going to have trouble making a playoff run when you take a player such as Mazi in the 1st who does not possess the skillset to play at a high level in the NFL. (Might not even be a backup). My argument is strictly about taking players who should not have been taken due to skillset deficiences. Reggie Robinson, Eric Scott, Morris Claiborne, Tolbert, Sam Williams, Randy Gregory, Kelvin Joseph. All bad picks because they didn't have the skillset to succeed. Same w/ Mazi.
 

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