Bledsoe or Roethlisberger?

[RCowboyFan]

Different style QB but Drew does rank in the tops in many categories in the NFL over his career no one can take that away from him and I think that will be taken into consideration I think the thing that can give him a great chance at the Hall would be getting a SB ring or 2. As for Ben and Bledsoe I think Ben is a very good QB and I would love to have him but I also realize he went to a QB's dream in Pitt I mean Tommy Maddox was putting up some good numbers in Pitt because they don't place all the pressure on the QB they want to run the ball and use that to set up play action and when you can be consistent running it freezes those LB and Safeties so they are not just pinning their ears back and coming after the QB. This is not a knock on Ben he is doing exactly what Pitt wants him to do and he does it very well but again throwing an average of 22 passes per game lowest in the league among starting QB's keeps him from shouldering all the responsibility for the teams success.

Not true now. It was true Maddox was good first year, probably because Defenses weren't upto par with his play. Since then he has been a Dud.

I do agree, they don't ask Ben to win it all. But thats Parcells philosophy too. Its the same way Aikman won too. He never was big stat guy. Big Ben has shown in Playoffs, when asked to throw, he can do that as well as anybody in NFL now. If you saw those games, you know what I am talking about since they barely ran most of the time to start the game off. In other words they employed the Cowboys philosophy of yester years, throw to get lead and then run to maintain it mostly.

Like I said, if Big Ben was given to Dallas now and Pittsburgh wanted to take Bledsoe, even just for this season, I would take Ben without batting an Eyelid. Heck Parcells himself said he is the best prospect he saw in 20 years when we first played. That ought to tell you who Parcells would take if given the option.

 

[Doomsday101]

If Bledsoe can replicate what Elway did in his last two years (regardless of the players around Bledsoe,) then my estimation of Bledsoe will go way up and you'll hear no argument from me regarding his HOF status. I have little confidence that he'll be able to do that.

I'm not saying he will or he won't I think a lot of that will depend on how the Cowboys as a team plays because in the end I don't care how great a QB is you don't win it all unless you have the team to win it all. As a Cowboy fan I hope this team can help him make it to the Hall Of Fame. I heard a player once say it is the QB's job to play good and our job to help make him great.

 

[Bledsoe4MVP]

I'm not even going to read all 12 pages, but anyone that seriously would rather have Bledsoe over Roth right now needs to have their head examined.

I would take Drew over 95% percent of the trash that masquerades as an NFL starting QB.....Big Ben included.

 

[Bledsoe4MVP]

I agree Elway was better but even Elway could not get a ring on his finger until Denver brought in a running back who went over the 2,000 yard mark in a season.

Terrell Davis won two world titles in denver, not John Elway. He is an all time great based on his numbers as well, but still not in the same class as Drew in terms of raw passing talent. He did have some great mobility that Drew don't though.

 

[Doomsday101]

Not true now. It was true Maddox was good first year, probably because Defenses weren't upto par with his play. Since then he has been a Dud.

I do agree, they don't ask Ben to win it all. But thats Parcells philosophy too. Its the same way Aikman won too. He never was big stat guy. Big Ben has shown in Playoffs, when asked to throw, he can do that as well as anybody in NFL now. If you saw those games, you know what I am talking about since they barely ran most of the time to start the game off. In other words they employed the Cowboys philosophy of yester years, throw to get lead and then run to maintain it mostly.

Like I said, if Big Ben was given to Dallas now and Pittsburgh wanted to take Bledsoe, even just for this season, I would take Ben without batting an Eyelid. Heck Parcells himself said he is the best prospect he saw in 20 years when we first played. That ought to tell you who Parcells would take if given the option.

Well when we can't run the ball and we can't pick up 3rd and short and we have to throw the ball 499 times a game averge of 31 passes a game that is not getting the same help Ben was getting. in the redzone teams knew they had to account for Bettis because if you didn't he would be standing in the endzone so when Pitt was down there and play action off of Bettis is was easy to see LB and S frozen in their tracks and that is just enough time to allow that WR to get wide open for some easy pickings. I'm not knocking Ben I think the guy is a very good young QB who is not even peaked in his career.

 

[Doomsday101]

Terrell Davis won two world titles in denver, not John Elway. He is an all time great based on his numbers as well, but still not in the same class as Drew in terms of raw passing talent. He did have some great mobility that Drew don't though.

Davis helped Dever win 2 SB so did Elway and there was others on that team that helped as well. Individuals do not win championship TEAMS win them I don't know of 1 single team who has won a SB where I can say well this guy won the game. It takes Offense,Defense and special teams to win not 1 guy. It never has and it never will which is why football is called the ultimate team sports 11 parts all playing together as 1

 

[Doomsday101]

What I loved about our team in the 90s was it was like watching a well oiled machine and it took all parts to win those SB. I saw the same in NE as well as SF and in Pitt

 

[Bledsoe4MVP]

Davis helped Dever win 2 SB so did Elway and there was others on that team that helped as well. Individuals do not win championship TEAMS win them I don't know of 1 single team who has won a SB where I can say well this guy won the game. It takes Offense,Defense and special teams to win not 1 guy. It never has and it never will which is why football is called the ultimate team sports 11 parts all playing together as 1

Well I'm glad somebody finally realizes that, I'm sick of all of the 'QB's that single handedly win a championship' debates myself.....this past superbowl finally ended that arguement once and for all in my mind.

That's why I don't understand how anybody can say that Big Ben (at least at this point in his career) is better than Bledsoe? Why because he has a ring on his finger as a starting QB and Drew don't?

My biggest beef with the Bledsoe bashers is that it seems whenever a team loses or plays poorly it's all on Drew's shoulders, but when the team wins it's because of the TEAM and not anything Bledsoe has done....even though the man has single handedly carried teams on his shoulders during the regular season and won some HUGE games when it mattered most. This is the mark of a great QB, not just an average one...

 

[Gamebreaker]

Terrell Davis won two world titles in denver, not John Elway. He is an all time great based on his numbers as well, but still not in the same class as Drew in terms of raw passing talent. He did have some great mobility that Drew don't though.

These are Elway's numbers in those two seasons he won a Superbowl with Terrell Davis.

Year ATT COMP YARDS TD INT
1997 502 280 3,635 27 11
1998 356 210 2,806 22 10

Looking at Bledsoe's stats, I can't find a single season where he was as effective a quarterback as Elway was in his last two seasons. Yes, Bledsoe often had seasons where he threw for more touchdowns, yet he also threw a whole lot more interceptions.

I don't see how you could give Davis credit for those titles, but not Elway. That makes no sense to me. Elway was so dangerous at quarterback, nearly every team they faced wouldn't dare put 8 men in the box to stop Terrell. Can Bledsoe ever say that?

 

[RCowboyFan]

Well when we can't run the ball and we can't pick up 3rd and short and we have to throw the ball 499 times a game averge of 31 passes a game that is not getting the same help Ben was getting. in the redzone teams knew they had to account for Bettis because if you didn't he would be standing in the endzone so when Pitt was down there and play action off of Bettis is was easy to see LB and S frozen in their tracks and that is just enough time to allow that WR to get wide open for some easy pickings. I'm not knocking Ben I think the guy is a very good young QB who is not even peaked in his career.

Problem with that theory is, how much of that is due to Drew's penchant for taking sacks or holding the ball too long? I.e. if D knows they can crowd the scrimmage and get to the QB or RB first, they don't have to worry about covering wrs too long. But say for Big Ben, he can run around and make plays, which makes the D cautious about blitzing etc all out.

Aikman could dump it off pretty quickly in those cases or could find TE/WR quickly which is why blitzing wasn't too good of an option. Anyway I guess we can go and on about this, but bottom line, I dont think Bledsoe at this point is better option than Big Ben in my opinion, and I guess we can agree to disagree like we always do

 

[iceberg]

even though the man has single handedly carried teams on his shoulders during the regular season and won some HUGE games when it mattered most. This is the mark of a great QB, not just an average one...

and single handidly lost 'em (cough seattle cough).

if you'd back off the love people would probably back off the hate.

 

[junk]

I would take Drew over 95% percent of the trash that masquerades as an NFL starting QB.....Big Ben included.

Well, that figures. You have an unhealthy man crush on Bledsoe.

I'm more concerned about the long term success of the franchise. Bledsoe probably has like two years left at most. He has proven to be a slightly above average QB in his career. Nothing special like his supporters want to make him out to be. Comparing him with Elway is ridiculous. Ben did something in his second year that Bledsoe has yet to do....lead his team to a Super Bowl.

Off the top of my head, I'd take these QBs over Bledsoe:

Big Ben
Peyton Manning
Matt Hasselbeck
Tom Brady
Carson Palmer
Eli Manning

I'd have to seriously consider:
Trent Green
The Bulge
Brees
McNabb
Leftwich

 

[Big Country]

This is actually kind of tough if you don't consider age. Bledsoe is clearly the better passer, but his lack of mobility may actually override that advantage. Given our line I would take Ben. Given Pitt's line I would take Bledsoe.

Let's just swap offensive-lines straight up... our present QB is more than capable. That would make for an interesting draft day in Big D.:laugh1:

 

[Bledsoe4MVP]

Well, that figures. You have an unhealthy man crush on Bledsoe.

I'm more concerned about the long term success of the franchise. Bledsoe probably has like two years left at most. He has proven to be a slightly above average QB in his career. Nothing special like his supporters want to make him out to be. Comparing him with Elway is ridiculous. Ben did something in his second year that Bledsoe has yet to do....lead his team to a Super Bowl.

Off the top of my head, I'd take these QBs over Bledsoe:

Big Ben
Peyton Manning
Matt Hasselbeck
Tom Brady
Carson Palmer
Eli Manning

I'd have to seriously consider:
Trent Green
The Bulge
Brees
McNabb
Leftwich

Eli Manning over Bledsoe? Leftwich? Trent Green? LOL
:laugh1::laugh2:

 

[Jarv]

I would take Drew over 95% percent of the trash that masquerades as an NFL starting QB.....Big Ben included.

Ok, you oh me a beer...that just splatered over my monitor when I read that statement and burst out laughing.

That puts him in the top 1% of the QB's playing now...So that means he's the 2nd best QB playing now....

So which one is better ? Brady obiviously took his job...So outside of Brady, Bledsoe is the best ? You have to be his agent or something.

 

[Jarv]

Let's just swap offensive-lines straight up... our present QB is more than capable. That would make for an interesting draft day in Big D.:laugh1:

Why do you think Bledsoe has been shopped around...lol...

It's easier to fix the QB position than 5 guys on the offensive line.

Bledsoe could probably win numerous 7-7 or 11-11 drills when no one is rushing the passer. But they do allow that in the NFL...Thats were he fails, when the pressure is on.

 

[junk]

Eli Manning over Bledsoe? Leftwich? Trent Green? LOL
:laugh1::laugh2:

Trent Green KC 4014 507 317 17 10 60 90.1
Eli Manning NYG 3762 557 294 24 17 78 75.9
Drew Bledsoe DAL 3639 499 300 23 17 71 83.7
Byron Leftwich JAC 2123 302 175 15 5 45 89.3

Manning is a 25 year old QB on the upswing. Bledsoe is a 34 year old on the downswing. Like I said, I am a Cowboys fan, not a Bledsoe fan. I'll take the guy that solidifies that position for the next 10 years or so.

Same story for Leftwich, although I don't think he is has as much upside as Manning. He's young and much more efficient than Bledsoe was last year despite missing time due to injury.

Green's numbers speak for themselves. Both he and Bledsoe are year to year propositions anyway.

Green's last four years:
16 16 470 287 61.1 3690 7.85 99 26 13 26/141 46 13 92.6
16 16 523 330 63.1 4039 7.72 67 24 12 20/130 54 8 92.6
16 16 556 369 66.4 4591 8.26 70 27 17 32/227 59 9 95.2
16 16 507 317 62.5 4014 7.92 60 17 10 32/204 51 11 90.1

Bledsoe's:
16 16 610 375 61.5 4359 7.15 73 24 15 54/369 45 13 86.0
16 16 471 274 58.2 2860 6.07 54 11 12 49/371 28 2 73.0
16 16 450 256 56.9 2932 6.52 69 20 16 37/215 31 9 76.6
16 16 499 300 60.1 3639 7.29 71 23 17 49/295 42 9 83.7

Green has been statistically dominant over Bledsoe. Bledsoe hasn't had a QB rating over 90 in his CAREER much less for 4 straight years.

Take off the Bledsoe blinders and see him for what he is. A slightly above average QB. He was a great signing for the price, but he hasn't really done anything in his career that makes me say "Wow".

Feel free to refute this with actual factual data, but I suspect you'll be unable to do more than plop down some laughing icons and make a comment about what a "stud" Bledsoe is. I have a sneaking suspicion that I am arguing with a 13 year old girl with the hots for Bledsoe, so I am sure I am wasting my time.

 

[jrumann59]

Bledsoe also hasn't had the running backs Green has had or the receivers green had in StL

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I'm not even going to read all 12 pages, but anyone that seriously would rather have Bledsoe over Roth right now needs to have their head examined.

nope, I'd take Ben because our line isn't the greatest, but the thought of Bledsoe being better than Ben isn't that far-fetched

 

[Bledsoe4MVP]

Ok, you oh me a beer...that just splatered over my monitor when I read that statement and burst out laughing.

That puts him in the top 1% of the QB's playing now...So that means he's the 2nd best QB playing now....

So which one is better ? Brady obiviously took his job...So outside of Brady, Bledsoe is the best ? You have to be his agent or something.

Yes I would take Drew over anybody but the man that replaced him in New England. Tom Brady is the real deal, as much as it hurts to admit it.