Brandon Carr thread

[ufcrules1]

Eskimo is a known Carr hater on the forum. I personally think Carr is a top 10 CB and love his passion on the field. The dude loves the game and has NEVER missed a game unlike some of our past weak minded CB's. He and Dez are my favorite players on the team. Love the intensity of both of them. We did not over pay for Carr, we paid him what the market value was for him. I can't stand Jerry but I am glad he didn't let Carr leave Valley Ranch without a contract.

 

[Nova]

I thought Carr held up his end of the bargain last year.

Is he a top 10 cb? Hard to say. I'd say he's at least close. Grading CBs is pretty tough without watching a ton of film. I've watched a lot of games but probably not nearly enough to make a definitive assessment.

The only guy who really got the best of him was Brandon Marshall, and that guy has just been a Cowboy killer in general.

Held AJ Green in check. Victor Cruz also. Had some big interceptions to win and turn the tides of some games.

Is seemingly a leader/big brother type on defense.

I'm glad we got him. Of course I wish we could have gotten him for less, but whatever we paid market price.

 

[CowboyGil]

Above average defender, good all around guy. Seems real down to earth.
And he got robbed on that play. They should've given him the TD.

 

[erod]

Doesn't it seem like that was the only interception this team had all season?

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I think Eskimo is pretty much right. Newman getting burned so badly at the end of 2011 scarred everyone and Ryan convinced Jerry that bad corner play was 90% of the reason they collapsed, so Jerry said fine, I'll give you the best corner on the market. (And I think that the defense not being that much better after Jerry gave him Carr and Claiborne is a big reason Rob got on Jerry's s list.)

Carr is pretty good, but he's hardly elite. People seem to forget that at times he got burned badly. It's not a huge problem because he should be solid enough and at least he's young, but that huge payday was more a function of his being the best corner in FA that year than his actual elite skills.

 

[Nova]

Yes, that's the guy I was thinking of but couldn't remember his name.

Cincinnati is putting together a pretty good roster aided by the Raiders overpaying for Carson Palmer and finding Dalton in the second round.

Joseph's first year with the Texans was about the same as Carr's first season with us. He had one more interception and gave up about 100 less yards, but he also had a higher YPC and played over 100 less snaps.

And although he had one more int, he didn't have the big game swinging ints that Carr had last year.

And if you do a direct comparison of years last year and it's no contest Carr.

Carr is a bigger corner and is younger. I like Joseph, but I'm glad we have the guy we have.

 

[Bowdown27]

Love Brandon Carr. He's a great db and could thrive in kiffin and marinelli defense. Him and Morris could be a combo to deal with

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I would say Joseph was substantially better than Carr. The Texans played a ton of straight man to man with little to no safety help and Joseph on the opposing best WR, which Rob didn't do with Carr.

Now Joseph isn't as durable, which is probably a fair criticism, but I don't think there's much doubt he's been a better player.

 

[Nova]

I think Eskimo is pretty much right. Newman getting burned so badly at the end of 2011 scarred everyone and Ryan convinced Jerry that bad corner play was 90% of the reason they collapsed, so Jerry said fine, I'll give you the best corner on the market. (And I think that the defense not being that much better after Jerry gave him Carr and Claiborne is a big reason Rob got on Jerry's s list.)

Carr is pretty good, but he's hardly elite. People seem to forget that at times he got burned badly. It's not a huge problem because he should be solid enough and at least he's young, but that huge payday was more a function of his being the best corner in FA that year than his actual elite skills.

Yeah he's not elite for sure... but really only Revis is at this time. Peterson can be, he certainly has the tools. Every year there's a new 'number 2' for CBs because they're so up and down. This year its Sherman, but can he replicate his success? I actually kind of doubt it.

At least Carr is pretty consistently hovers around top 10 category.

 

[Eskimo]

Carr ISOd on a top receiver gets abused badly in the Chicago game. We all wanted to see what he could do in such a situation and it was like taking candy from a baby for Brandon Marshall.

I do understand WRs have an advantage in 1-on-1 situation but a top 10 CB should put up a lot more resistance than Carr did on that play.

Carr's metrics were definitely only mediocre for a CB. He was nowhere near where the top CBs were. He was nowhere near where OScan was.

I do think it could have been a bit of a down year and may have been influenced by the Safety play. But based on the play I saw when he got left alone in press coverage he didn't look anywhere close to a top 10 guy.

Great guy - sure.

Works hard with good practice habits - sure.

Good guy in the lockerroom - seems to be the case from what we've heard.

Above average coverage - yes.

Good tackling - yes.

Top 10 coverage - no.

Overpaid - yes.

CBs get paid mostly on coverage and that is why I think he was overpaid. In comparision to Finnegan who go a similar payday last year he was not close to Finnegan's metrics from this past year.


I'm used to being on the opposite side of this board. I was one of about 3 people that hated the Rat deal. I was one of about 3 people who really thought Roy Williams was a waste a few games into the 2009 season when he threw Romo under the bus for his poor play.

Part of the issue with Carr is he is a CB and I don't value good CB play as much as others do. I do value elite CB play like TNew provided for a few years, like Jenkins did in 2009, like Revis provides, like Deion provided. I would definitely pay guys who can play like that consistently $10M/yr but not guys who are just above average in coverage. I really think these kind of salaries should be going mostly to difference-makers like top 10 QBs, elite WRs, shutdown CBs, top 10 LTs and top pass rushers. Such players fundamentally change the way other teams play you. I don't think other teams scheme to deal with Carr and how to get their top WRs away from him (at least you don't hear about it leading up to games or see it on gameday).

So yes I am not happy with how much we pay Carr for his present level of play. I don't hate Carr and I don't think he is a bad player. I just think he is overpaid by about $3M/yr.

 

[Nova]

CBs get paid mostly on coverage and that is why I think he was overpaid. In comparision to Finnegan who go a similar payday last year he was not close to Finnegan's metrics from this past year.

Where are you getting your stats from? By most accounts Finnegan didn't have a great year.

 

[Arkyvarminter]

Carr ISOd on a top receiver gets abused badly in the Chicago game. We all wanted to see what he could do in such a situation and it was like taking candy from a baby for Brandon Marshall.

I do understand WRs have an advantage in 1-on-1 situation but a top 10 CB should put up a lot more resistance than Carr did on that play.

Carr's metrics were definitely only mediocre for a CB. He was nowhere near where the top CBs were. He was nowhere near where OScan was.

I do think it could have been a bit of a down year and may have been influenced by the Safety play. But based on the play I saw when he got left alone in press coverage he didn't look anywhere close to a top 10 guy.

Great guy - sure.

Works hard with good practice habits - sure.

Good guy in the lockerroom - seems to be the case from what we've heard.

Above average coverage - yes.

Good tackling - yes.

Top 10 coverage - no.

Overpaid - yes.

CBs get paid mostly on coverage and that is why I think he was overpaid. In comparision to Finnegan who go a similar payday last year he was not close to Finnegan's metrics from this past year.


I'm used to being on the opposite side of this board. I was one of about 3 people that hated the Rat deal. I was one of about 3 people who really thought Roy Williams was a waste a few games into the 2009 season when he threw Romo under the bus for his poor play.

Part of the issue with Carr is he is a CB and I don't value good CB play as much as others do. I do value elite CB play like TNew provided for a few years, like Jenkins did in 2009, like Revis provides, like Deion provided. I would definitely pay guys who can play like that consistently $10M/yr but not guys who are just above average in coverage. I really think these kind of salaries should be going mostly to difference-makers like top 10 QBs, elite WRs, shutdown CBs, top 10 LTs and top pass rushers. Such players fundamentally change the way other teams play you. I don't think other teams scheme to deal with Carr and how to get their top WRs away from him (at least you don't hear about it leading up to games or see it on gameday).

So yes I am not happy with how much we pay Carr for his present level of play. I don't hate Carr and I don't think he is a bad player. I just think he is overpaid by about $3M/yr.

Name one corner who wouldn't have serious trouble with Brandon Marshall? I will do it for you...All of them.

 

[Nova]

Name one corner who wouldn't have serious trouble with Brandon Marshall? I will do it for you...All of them.

Patrick Peterson. But to be fair that guy is like having a Dez Bryant at CB, but probably a bit faster.

Also Revis.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Name one corner who wouldn't have serious trouble with Brandon Marshall? I will do it for you...All of them.

Yea I don't know where this perception of corners not getting burnt comes from. Had Bryant had not gotten hurt he would've went to Revis island and had his way. Richard Sherman who some felt was one of the best corners last year got burnt by Roddy White last season.

With the way rules favor receivers there are no longer shut down corners in this league. The closest is Revis and he has been burnt. Brandon Carr is closer to one of the better corners in this league than he is to being the worst. He's a good player and a good guy and that's the type of players this team needs to be filled with. Guys who work hard on their craft and want to get better each season. The money was well spent.

 

[ufcrules1]

Yea I don't know where this perception of corners not getting burnt comes from. Had Bryant had not gotten hurt he would've went to Revis island and had his way. Richard Sherman who some felt was one of the best corners last year got burnt by Roddy White last season.

With the way rules favor receivers there are no longer shut down corners in this league. The closest is Revis and he has been burnt. Brandon Carr is closer to one of the better corners in this league than he is to being the worst. He's a good player and a good guy and that's the type of players this team needs to be filled with. Guys who work hard on their craft and want to get better each season. The money was well spent.

Excellent post. All corners get burned.. it is just part of the game and the WR's do have the upper hand most of the time. The money we spent on Carr was well worth it. He is the poster child of the type of player we need here.. injury free, hits hard, plays with fire, is passionate, and is top 10 at his position.

 

[coult44]

Excellent post. All corners get burned.. it is just part of the game and the WR's do have the upper hand most of the time. The money we spent on Carr was well worth it. He is the poster child of the type of player we need here.. injury free, hits hard, plays with fire, is passionate, and is top 10 at his position.

Besides QB, there isn't a more difficult position on the entire football field. Especially with the way the NFL has made the rules be in complete favor of offense and the passing game. A CB is taught from the time he is high school, that he has to forget the last play, good or bad. There is ZERO chance that even the best CB's don't give up big plays or touchdowns..The question is how well do they respond after they give up that play. Carr NEVER gave up big plays and then continued to have more and more and more...And again,,,HE FREEKIN STAYS HEALTHY.....Unlike half the players on this team...

 

[SWG9]

Excellent post. All corners get burned.. it is just part of the game and the WR's do have the upper hand most of the time. The money we spent on Carr was well worth it. He is the poster child of the type of player we need here.. injury free, hits hard, plays with fire, is passionate, and is top 10 at his position.

...Except he never said that Carr shouldn't ever get burned. He said that we're paying a good player great money and that it's a losing proposition over the long haul (which I completely agree with, by the way).

Like it or not, the cap IS a zero sum game. 10 million to Brandon Carr is 10 million we don't get to spend elsewhere.

Again, no one dislikes Carr, we're simply saying that the resources might have been better applied elsewhere.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

He performed alright last season.