Byron Jones Insight from a CT Guy

[texbumthelife]

I think he was the BPA for the positions we were looking at.

There's no guarantee that the 'kid from Oregon' is going to be around in the 3rd.

And financially, the 27th pick is not that premium of a pick.

I think now we need to look at S, LB, QB and RT



YR

First round pick are premium picks. Come on, let's not nitpick. It has nothing to do with money either.

I fully believe he was the best player on their board and our scouting department has been tremendous the last few years, I just really think this move is more of a character pick than an ability pick.

It was interesting to hear the guys on DC.com last night point out, this should end Scandrick's issues real quick. That is an interesting point. Maybe Carr isn't the only corner looking over his shoulder. If all Jones does is push Casrr and Scandrick to be better, it's almost worth it I guess.

 

[vicjagger]

Great post! Thank you.

 

[CowboyChris]

I think he was the BPA for the positions we were looking at.

There's no guarantee that the 'kid from Oregon' is going to be around in the 3rd.

And financially, the 27th pick is not that premium of a pick.

I think now we need to look at S, LB, QB and RT



YR

No RB?

 

[LandryFan]

This is similar to how I 'studied' for college. A friend of mine who I knew wasn't dumb, but wasn't *that* smart was coasting thru a few courses we had, particularly Economics, Biology and Accounting. He looked like he never studied much before the test and was pulling great grades. I finally had to ask him how he was doing it knowing that he wasn't a genius by any stretch of the imagination.

His mother was a teacher and taught him how to 'study.' Almost all of the stuff on the test was in the notes. So, simply write down every single note you can take in class. Then, go home each day, and in a loose left binder, using 1-side of the sheet, write down the notes again as clear and as neat as you possibly can. Cross all of the t's and dot all of the eyes. If you make a mistake, junk the sheet of paper and start over again. Then, briefly go over what you have written. Make notes of any questions you have to bring to the next class to ask the professor. Repeat the same process for the next class, but this time you go over the previous class' notes as well.

By the time the tests came, I didn't have to study at all. I could simply do this for about 30 minute to an hour each day and the night before the test, breeze thru it all in 20 minutes of 'studying.' And by then I was able to go thru the rest of my college years being able to party on nights before tests and breeze thru almost every class. The only issue is that I was too lazy to do it for the entire year, so finals were a bit of a problem.

It's too bad that teachers and coaches fail to teach students and athletes on *how* to study instead of expecting them to pick it up on their own.

YR

I did the same for every class I ever took and it does, indeed work!

 

[Kaiser]

If you combine physical athletic freak with 33 wonderlic, also combined with ultra serious work-ethic....I'm liking that player's odds.

You can add "born leader" to the list of Byron Jones accolades also.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

First round pick are premium picks. Come on, let's not nitpick. It has nothing to do with money either.

I fully believe he was the best player on their board and our scouting department has been tremendous the last few years, I just really think this move is more of a character pick than an ability pick.

I don't know about that....I think a guy who breaks the world record in the broad jump and has a 44.5" vertical, is nearly 6'1" tall and was very productive in college has plenty of 'ability.'

It was interesting to hear the guys on DC.com last night point out, this should end Scandrick's issues real quick. That is an interesting point. Maybe Carr isn't the only corner looking over his shoulder. If all Jones does is push Casrr and Scandrick to be better, it's almost worth it I guess.

We absolutely needed to look at corner and most likely grab a corner in the first 2 rounds. There's no guarantee Claiborne will even make the roster or stay on the roster *this* season. Carr is too pricey and Scandrick is getting closer to 30 years old (turns 29 next season).

I like Patmon, but far from any guarantee that he can even replace Sterling Moore, much less be a quality top-3 CB on the team.

Jones also has quality FS experience. Teams are using 3 safety packages to stop those TE's and tall WR's. Last year we were using Church, Wilcox and Heath/Spillman. I would rather see us go with Church, Wilcox and Jones with Scandrick, Carr and Patmon/Claiborne.





YR

 

[Yakuza Rich]

No RB?

I'm not sure how important that is with Williams, McFadden, Randle and Dunbar. There's not exactly a Jim Brown in there, but I think all four *may* be severely underrated. I tend to think that Murray was let go because of Williams and once they signed McFadden they were probably more than satisfied.

I think it's still largely a BPA draft for us.



YR

 

[texbumthelife]

I don't know about that....I think a guy who breaks the world record in the broad jump and has a 44.5" vertical, is nearly 6'1" tall and was very productive in college has plenty of 'ability.'




We absolutely needed to look at corner and most likely grab a corner in the first 2 rounds. There's no guarantee Claiborne will even make the roster or stay on the roster *this* season. Carr is too pricey and Scandrick is getting closer to 30 years old (turns 29 next season).

I like Patmon, but far from any guarantee that he can even replace Sterling Moore, much less be a quality top-3 CB on the team.

Jones also has quality FS experience. Teams are using 3 safety packages to stop those TE's and tall WR's. Last year we were using Church, Wilcox and Heath/Spillman. I would rather see us go with Church, Wilcox and Jones with Scandrick, Carr and Patmon/Claiborne.


YR

I'm not sure where all these "very productive" comments are coming from. He had eight career picks an 21 PD against terrible competition. I've watched all the tape I can, because as a former DB I know picks and PD aren't the only thing that's important. If anything, the kid is very raw as a corner and is a projection, not a player coming from production. If you want to make that argument, I can see it. I absolutely won't buy this kid based on his production in college though.

Once again, it always comes back to his combine numbers. No one has made a single tangible argument for his ability as a corner and then backed it up with video. Not even the professionals. His tape is very underwhelming.

Once again, you haven't seen me say a single time we shouldn't have grabbed a corner. Make an argument for Jones, not "a corner." Show me tape where you see his "production."

I've been waiting for that for two weeks now. All I get is:

"he played corner and FS, he's versatile." -- Big whoop, I can probably find 20 kids who did that who didn't get drafted #27.

"He is such a good kid. Great character. Hard worker." -- I love to hear that about a guy, assuming he also has the ability. I don't see the instincts. I don't see any anticipation.

"We had to have another corner." -- I absolutely agree. However, as I have said probably 20+ times now, I don't agree with Jones @27. I am all for taking at least one DB, it's all about value.

So, please, give me tangible evidence that Jones, right now, is more than a great kid with remarkable athletic ability. I am sincerely asking. I want to like the pick. Give me a real reason to.

 

[JBS]

Yeah. He's a great person...big deal

Doesn't mean the guy is a great or even good player

Listen...character helps, no question...but if u can't play in this league, nothing else matters

Im not suggesting that jones isn't going to be a good player....but let's not pretend that being a great person means you'll be a good player

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

In History, Government and those type of classes I would just memorize the notes and repeat them back on the tests. If you asked me about them a week later I wouldn't remember much.

That didn't work once I was in Engineering and advanced Mathematics classes.

IMO, the #1 thing that college does is force you to figure out how to learn. A lot of the specifics that you learn are not that important, it's more about the process and the fortitude of doing it.

I think it would be hard to teach people specifically how to learn because everybody is different. Some people really thrive in the classroom environment but struggle just learning on their own. It was the opposite for me. I preferred to just know what notes or books to study and I didn't get much from lectures.

Yup that was my experience as well. I could hardly understand my multivar calc prof so had to teach PDE's to myself

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I'm not sure where all these "very productive" comments are coming from. He had eight career picks an 21 PD against terrible competition. I've watched all the tape I can, because as a former DB I know picks and PD aren't the only thing that's important. If anything, the kid is very raw as a corner and is a projection, not a player coming from production. If you want to make that argument, I can see it. I absolutely won't buy this kid based on his production in college though.

Once again, it always comes back to his combine numbers. No one has made a single tangible argument for his ability as a corner and then backed it up with video. Not even the professionals. His tape is very underwhelming.

Once again, you haven't seen me say a single time we shouldn't have grabbed a corner. Make an argument for Jones, not "a corner." Show me tape where you see his "production."

I've been waiting for that for two weeks now. All I get is:

"he played corner and FS, he's versatile." -- Big whoop, I can probably find 20 kids who did that who didn't get drafted #27.

"He is such a good kid. Great character. Hard worker." -- I love to hear that about a guy, assuming he also has the ability. I don't see the instincts. I don't see any anticipation.

"We had to have another corner." -- I absolutely agree. However, as I have said probably 20+ times now, I don't agree with Jones @27. I am all for taking at least one DB, it's all about value.

So, please, give me tangible evidence that Jones, right now, is more than a great kid with remarkable athletic ability. I am sincerely asking. I want to like the pick. Give me a real reason to.

He didn't face horrible competition. For example, there is tape of him against Perriman, Parker and other top WR prospects.

You guys are filling in the gaps and doing it poorly. He faced ECU was 2-8 with a pick for example. ABout the only complaint I see is he is raw in his technique. Well, duh, he only played corner for 2 years and was offense in HS.

 

[theogt]

I'm close with someone who coached him at UConn. One day prior to the 2013 UConn season, Byron handed this coach his playbook, saying he didn't need it anymore. Turns out Byron had made a complete hand-written copy of the notebook at home. His method for studying was to do exactly that... and every 2 weeks all throughout the year, he copied the playbook by hand to make sure it was completely committed to memory.

That's a pretty crazy story, if true.

 

[texbumthelife]

He didn't face horrible competition. For example, there is tape of him against Perriman, Parker and other top WR prospects.

You guys are filling in the gaps and doing it poorly. He faced ECU was 2-8 with a pick for example. ABout the only complaint I see is he is raw in his technique. Well, duh, he only played corner for 2 years and was offense in HS.

How on earth are you going to tell me he didn't face horrible competition? BYU, Stony Brook, Boise, USF, Temple, Tulane, ECU, UCF, Army, Cincinnati, Memphis and ECU... In 2014, before being injured and shut down, he had a pick against USF on a ball that was thrown right to him and one against ECU. You telling me you consider that tough competition? He played in the American Conference for God's sake. Come on!

Sounds to me like the people projecting him to be a stud, are "filling in the gaps" because it isn't there on tape. You're taking his tremendous character and great combine and filling in the gaps.

I can't find the tape, but I believe I read when UConn played UCF, they didn't match Byron Jones up on Perriman much. They still did a good job of shutting him down, but then again, I think Perriman is even more overrated than Jones. Either way, UCF had some of the worst QB play in the country. As for Parker, he actually had pretty good numbers in 2013 when he played UConn. Whether or not that was all against Jones, I couldn't tell you.

No disrespect intended, but you still haven't brought any tangible evidence. As I said above, that makes your comments projections and "filling in the gaps" far more than what I am contributing. I've watched the tape and posted it here. It is very underwhelming.

As for your argument about him being inexperience, that's exactly one of the reasons I don't like him. Why would that be an endearing quality? Not something I would state while making a case for how good he is. He played a season and half at corner before being injured and having to sit out. This isn't hang your hat material...

Before you get started on his versatility because he played safety, I will warn you not to even look at that tape. It's bad.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

How on earth are you going to tell me he didn't face horrible competition? BYU, Stony Brook, Boise, USF, Temple, Tulane, ECU, UCF, Army, Cincinnati, Memphis and ECU... In 2014, before being injured and shut down, he had a pick against USF and one against ECU. You telling me you consider that tough competition? He played in the American Conference for God's sake. Come on!

Sounds to me like the people projecting him to be a stud, are "filling in the gaps" because it isn't there on tape. You're taking his tremendous character and great combine and filling in the gaps.

I can't find the tape, but I believe I read when UConn played UCF, they didn't match Byron Jones up on Perriman much. They still did a good job of shutting him down, but then again, I think Perriman is even more overrated than Jones. Either way, UCF had some of the worst QB play in the country. As for Parker, he actually had pretty good numbers in 2013 when he played UConn. Whether or not that was all against Jones, I couldn't tell you.

No disrespect intended, but you still haven't brought any tangible evidence. As I said above, that makes your comments projections and "filling in the gaps" far more than what I am contributing. I've watched the tape and posted it here. It is very underwhelming.

There is tape against top WR's like Perriman and Parker and ECU had the third best passing offense in the nation.

You are using a generalization to dismiss. You want to talk about my supposed lack of tangible evidence well your handwaving at his conference and stat lines for secondary players is generalized wishful thinking.

I am telling you specific talented offenses and WR he played and that there is tape on to make a apples to apples evaluation. If you do not understand how that subsumes your generalization for blanket dismissal then oh well. I haven't seen the USF or Louisville tape so cannot comment more specifically but this notion that all he played was garbage is itself garbage.

 

[texbumthelife]

There is tape against top WR's like Perriman and Parker and ECU had the third best passing offense in the nation.

You are using a generalization to dismiss. You want to talk about my supposed lack of tangible evidence well your handwaving at his conference and stat lines is no better and less specific.

I am telling you specific talented offenses and WR he played and that there is tape on to make a apples to apples evaluation. If you do not understand how that subsumes your generalization for blanket dismissal then oh well.

Well I don't understand how naming his competition is generalizing. I guess you don't believe strength of competition means anything. That's almost as foolish to me as remarking about his inexperience as a positive when discussing his ability.

That's ok, we can agree to disagree. I'll be as specific as specific as possible. Let's look at ECU.

Here are some stats, can't get much more specific than this:

Shane Carden 38/64 445 2td 1int

Justin Hardy 14/186
Cam Worthy 7/138
Isaiah Jones 10/75

Here is the tape:

@:35 he gives up a ten yard completion and is literally barely in the frame.
@:45 gets away with blatant PI as he tackles the reciever

@1:06 gets a great jam,much props

@1:20 trips and falls down, gets flagged, gets bailed out by an "uncatchable ball" call.

@1:47 good job running through traffic

@2:06 gets away with holding the receivers arm down--that will get flagged in the NFL ( I point this out because even scouts have noted he is too handsy, because he lacks proper technique)
@2:54 does alright until his man changes direction, then loses him pretty bad
@3:50 gets a gift of a pick, although on a better thrown ball, he gives up a TD
@4:15 gets away with PI again and I believe this is where he hurt his shoulder...

Watch the tape. I am absolutely open to your interpretation. What I see is a guy who struggles when asked to do anything but run in a straight line with a receiver. He shows some great raw athleticism and some versatility to play in different schemes. He doesn't really show anything special in his coverage though. Without his combine I don't think he's done anything to separate himself from most of the other mid round corners.

As I have said and repeated ad infinitium, I don't think he is a bad player. I just don't think he is first round talent.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Well I don't understand how naming his competition is generalizing. I guess you don't believe strength of competition means anything. That's almost as foolish to me as remarking about his inexperience as a positive when discussing his ability.

That's ok, we can agree to disagree. I'll be as specific as specific as possible. Let's look at ECU.

Here are some stats, can't get much more specific than this:

Shane Carden 38/64 445 2td 1int

Justin Hardy 14/186
Cam Worthy 7/138
Isaiah Jones 10/75

Here is the tape:

@:35 he gives up a ten yard completion and is literally barely in the frame.
@:45 gets away with blatant PI as he tackles the reciever

@1:06 gets a great jam,much props

@1:20 trips and falls down, gets flagged, gets bailed out by an "uncatchable ball" call.

@1:47 good job running through traffic

@2:06 gets away with holding the receivers arm down--that will get flagged in the NFL ( I point this out because even scouts have noted he is too handsy, because he lacks proper technique)
@2:54 does alright until his man changes direction, then loses him pretty bad
@3:50 gets a gift of a pick, although on a better thrown ball, he gives up a TD
@4:15 gets away with PI again and I believe this is where he hurt his shoulder...

Watch the tape. I am absolutely open to your interpretation. What I see is a guy who struggles when asked to do anything but run in a straight line with a receiver.

As I have said and repeated ad infinitum, I don't think he is a bad player. I just don't think he is first round talent.

This has been already discussed. I can link you theo's rejoinder but I am not overly in the mood to repeat what has already been covered.

You apparently do not understand the college rules and want to play ref. There were no flags. The completion was a comeback when the QB had all day.

The 2:54 play he is out of the shot when the WR cuts so you cannot see what happened. The 3:05 interception saw him peel off his man and come back to highpoint the ball. What do ball skills mean? 2:06 he looks back for the ball and youre wrong that wouldn't be called in the NFL. :45 was a slant thrown low and inside like you are supposed to. He didn't tackle him the WR went to the ground to try and catch the low throw. I'll give you 1:20. He did fall down turning around to look for the ball. Technique hasn't caught up to obvious instincts.

Outside that you wave at a stat lines and don't discuss the actual matchup. That posits nothing. For all you know they lined up the WR on the opposite side. My point is taht there is tape to evaluate him against top competition and the hearsay I have heard is that despite his team being blown out he acquitted himself well. Grain of salt caveats certainly apply.

 

[dallasdave]

I'll cut right to it. Byron grew up one town over from me in New Britain, CT. He played his high school ball at a school that I later assistant coached for (one year after he left). Needless to say, I know some people who truly know Byron... know how he operates on the day-to-day, how he carries himself, treats people, works, etc.

And I can't be any more thrilled with this pick. I've only heard the best things about him. Very respectful & hard-working. I'll tell a quick story...

I'm close with someone who coached him at UConn. One day prior to the 2013 UConn season, Byron handed this coach his playbook, saying he didn't need it anymore. Turns out Byron had made a complete hand-written copy of the notebook at home. His method for studying was to do exactly that... and every 2 weeks all throughout the year, he copied the playbook by hand to make sure it was completely committed to memory.

This is a kid who defines "Right Kind of Guy." I'm a true believer that 95% of 1st round picks have the requisite physical ability to be starters in the NFL, but many of the guys who fail do so because they don't have the work ethic, don't love football, don't make the right decisions, etc. This kid lives & breathes football. He's truly a gym rat & will bring that leadership into the secondary. I view him as the secondary's version of Sean Lee (albeit with even greater athletic potential).

Welcome, Byron Jones!

Sounds like a winner

 

[dallasdave]

You can add "born leader" to the list of Byron Jones accolades also.

A future captain

 

[jrumann59]

First round pick are premium picks. Come on, let's not nitpick. It has nothing to do with money either.

I fully believe he was the best player on their board and our scouting department has been tremendous the last few years, I just really think this move is more of a character pick than an ability pick.

It was interesting to hear the guys on DC.com last night point out, this should end Scandrick's issues real quick. That is an interesting point. Maybe Carr isn't the only corner looking over his shoulder. If all Jones does is push Casrr and Scandrick to be better, it's almost worth it I guess.

If you really want to split hairs technically 1st-3rd picks are premium, players taken in those rounds usually are expected to be solid contributors to starters for the most part.

 

[texbumthelife]

If you really want to split hairs technically 1st-3rd picks are premium, players taken in those rounds usually are expected to be solid contributors to starters for the most part.

Well, I would have been more than happy with him in the third, where he was projected before his miraculous combine jump.