Twitter: Chiefs trade their 1st and more for Ravens T Orlando Brown

[Adreme]

ONCE AGAIN...I never said they weren't elite when Ozzie was there....for the past few years they've made some suspect moves. You are mentioning moves prior to the 2019 season....its now 2021....

I mean JK Dobbins was literally last years draft. Also Ozzie is basically still there. All they did was effectively have Ozzie and Decosta switch titles. Still the reason I am citing those classes is because it is impossible to truly evaluate a class until 3 years out. You cant even really have much of an idea until 2 years out especially considering there were no offseason programs last year. After this year we could talk about 2019 draft classes and have an idea for 2020, but will know very little about 2021.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

That is not really the option. When you have that many pro-bowl players (I think they had 8 or 9 with almost all on rookie deals) you have to decide you would rather have all pro then pro bowl. So the choice is Brown or a 3rd round comp pick. They are probably going to sign Andre Villanueva for half of Brown's cost without a significant dropoff (old 80-20 rule except probably closer to 90-40 in this case). Now you can double dip on edge rushers to make up for the other pro bowl departures, who will likely become 3rd round comp picks, sure up the front 7 and keep their defense, which is built around their amazing secondary, strong while probably looking for a G in round 3 as you already signed one in FA.

That is a recipe for success and why they are a perennial contender.

Well looking at their salaries.....maybe if they weren't wasting money on Sammy Watkins, Nick Boyle and past their primes Brandon Williams and Calais Campbell they wouldn't' have had to get rid of Brown? Just throwing that out there I'm not sure how they value those guys over Orlando Brown.......

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I mean JK Dobbins was literally last years draft. Also Ozzie is basically still there. All they did was effectively have Ozzie and Decosta switch titles. Still the reason I am citing those classes is because it is impossible to truly evaluate a class until 3 years out. You cant even really have much of an idea until 2 years out especially considering there were no offseason programs last year. After this year we could talk about 2019 draft classes and have an idea for 2020, but will know very little about 2021.

Everything I've read is that Decosta is the one making the decisions so if he's not I stand correct on that. I'm not close enough to speak on that situation. I just know since Decosta took over the way the Ravens have been ran has been far different than when Ozzie was there.

And that's fair. You can't judge a draft class until after about 3 years.....but I'm just speaking on what I've seen thus far. In recent memory. They've had some suspect drafts just like us is the point I Was initially making. Never downplayed what they did in 2018 or anything like that. Ravens are a solid team but they have some glaring holes just like the Cowboys. Just at different positions. I actually can't recall the last time the Cowboys had a receiving group as bad as what the Ravens put out there. And I like Hollywood Brown but maybe the issue is he should probably be their #2 option and not #1. And while I like Mark Andrews as well....you can't effectively build a team around a tight end unless you are the exceptions like the 49ers with Kittle and Chiefs with Kelce.

 

[TwoCentPlain]

It’s a mess of a recipe IMO. I have no issue trading Brown for a good pick. Chiefs pick sucks. Who at 31 is gonna be as good as he was?

The Ravens got the 31st pick plus the Chiefs' 3rd and 4th round picks. Ravens could package those picks and maybe move up in the 1st round and grab Darrislaw or maybe even Slater. Or, the Ravens could keep the picks and maybe get a Fredbeard and Gallimore and Biadasz.

Ravens are also signing Villanueva so they have the replacement already for their OL. So, the Ravens lose Brown but add Villanueva and 3 extra picks.

Brown has one year left and is a FA in 2022. Chiefs have to either sign him long term at $18-20M/year or franchise him for a year. If they franchise him, this drama queen (look at what he pulled in Balt demanding a trade because he wants to play LT like his dad) might hold out and report late. He might tear something this year and the Chiefs are royally screwed then.

Chiefs have all their eggs in one basket with Brown. Ravens have various options. I like what the Ravens did here.

 

[Adreme]

Well looking at their salaries.....maybe if they weren't wasting money on Sammy Watkins, Nick Boyle and past their primes Brandon Williams and Calais Campbell they wouldn't' have had to get rid of Brown? Just throwing that out there I'm not sure how they value those guys over Orlando Brown.......

Boyle is the major reason their entire offense works (ty for reminding me who the TE I was trying to remember was). Their running game took a hit when he went down and as a blocker he is elite which is worth 5m. Watkins is 5m. Campbell and Williams are not signed in 2022 (neither is Watkins for that matter) so they dont matter (though the fact that they signed Campbell clearly helped them sure up why they lost in the playoffs 2 years ago so cant argue with results). The Ravens had the second best scoring defense in the NFL. The players they signed, even after getting COVID, clearly did their job.

Brown for 20m is not worth 3-4 starters. He simply is not. A top 10-12 LT , who you would be playing at RT, is not worth that much. They picked the all pro LT to give the big contract. They picked the all pro corner to give the contract. They are probably going to pick the TE to give the contract (those are usually cheap). They are going to pick the former league MVP to give the contract. So instead of getting a 3rd round comp in 2 years, they got a 1st this year and they had to trade was 1 year. This is how you win. You sign the elite and you trade the very good, who always get overpaid, and you extend the good for fair money. Nick Boyle is good (even if I had no idea who he was), there is a reason per Scheft that he had 10 teams who would have made an offer in FA and they got him for 5m per year.

 

[TwoCentPlain]

Let’s say the Ravens offer their two 1st to come up to 10 and take Chase....do you take it?

I highly doubt Chase is there at #10. Assuming he is, I would not take Balt two 1sts for Chase. I would draft Chase and let Gallup and Cooper go next year. Or I would most likely have much better trade options.

 

[cowboy_ron]

Offensive tackles OR corners/tight ends.

Hmmmm...

Anybody get that memo something 'bout games being won in the trenches or something like that?

Or even, if you ain't got a stud LT protecting the QB, you ain't got squat?

Smith will go down and this place will be one big mass of confusion, lol

But yeah, corners and tight ends, smh

Mahommes and Rodgers send their regards.

Sewell would ease the pain

 

[Adreme]

Everything I've read is that Decosta is the one making the decisions so if he's not I stand correct on that. I'm not close enough to speak on that situation. I just know since Decosta took over the way the Ravens have been ran has been far different than when Ozzie was there.

And that's fair. You can't judge a draft class until after about 3 years.....but I'm just speaking on what I've seen thus far. In recent memory. They've had some suspect drafts just like us is the point I Was initially making. Never downplayed what they did in 2018 or anything like that. Ravens are a solid team but they have some glaring holes just like the Cowboys. Just at different positions. I actually can't recall the last time the Cowboys had a receiving group as bad as what the Ravens put out there. And I like Hollywood Brown but maybe the issue is he should probably be their #2 option and not #1. And while I like Mark Andrews as well....you can't effectively build a team around a tight end unless you are the exceptions like the 49ers with Kittle and Chiefs with Kelce.

The way Baltimore works, and its weird but I live here so I know a lot about it, has generally not changed over the past 15 years. Basically for about the past 7 or so years, going back to when Ozzie was GM, Ozzie and Eric would run the draft. Ozzie was the GM, and Eric was the "GM in training" and they would run the draft room. Two years ago they named Decosta formally as the GM and gave Ozzie a new title but the draft room looks exactly the same, as they had been giving Decosta more and more power over time to make the transition easier, but they just changed seats. I am not even joking on that. The philosophy they had, and still have, is still apparent to people who watch. If you give them a pick in the teens, they will usually trade back into the 20s doing 2 or 3 trade backs so that they can collect 3rd/4th round picks because they like to try and find solid starters there.

The thing that has made that team good at drafting, and they still have it down, is not the 1st 2 rounds. They have had hits over the years, but probably not that much better than any other team. The thing that makes the Ravens good at drafting is finding good talent in rounds 3 and 4. For example, the name you hear if you live around here is last years 3rd round pick justin madubuike (no I could not spell that right without Google) and how you can expect him to break out. They got one of their 2 MLB starters from the 3rd round (and Queen from the 1st). They just collect 3rd and 4th round picks and take as many shots with them as they can.

 

[America's Cowboy]

You make these types of moves when you don't have a Terence Steele on the roster when you lose your starter.

Not necessarily...

The Cowboys could easily use one of their 3rd round picks on this young beast of a Left Tackle...



-or-

Draft this guy in the 3rd. Plug him at Left Guard and move Connor Williams to his natural college position of Left Tackle...



The problem is such maneuvering decisions within the draft is too hard for this front office. It's easier for them to overpay (both in draft picks and pay) to trade for an old veteran player = other teams getting the better end of the stick on us.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

The Ravens got the 31st pick plus the Chiefs' 3rd and 4th round picks. Ravens could package those picks and maybe move up in the 1st round and grab Darrislaw or maybe even Slater. Or, the Ravens could keep the picks and maybe get a Fredbeard and Gallimore and Biadasz.

Ravens are also signing Villanueva so they have the replacement already for their OL. So, the Ravens lose Brown but add Villanueva and 3 extra picks.

Brown has one year left and is a FA in 2022. Chiefs have to either sign him long term at $18-20M/year or franchise him for a year. If they franchise him, this drama queen (look at what he pulled in Balt demanding a trade because he wants to play LT like his dad) might hold out and report late. He might tear something this year and the Chiefs are royally screwed then.

Chiefs have all their eggs in one basket with Brown. Ravens have various options. I like what the Ravens did here.

If they get somebody as good as Brown than that’s fair. They did good. I don’t see it but who knows.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Boyle is the major reason their entire offense works (ty for reminding me who the TE I was trying to remember was). Their running game took a hit when he went down and as a blocker he is elite which is worth 5m. Watkins is 5m. Campbell and Williams are not signed in 2022 (neither is Watkins for that matter) so they dont matter (though the fact that they signed Campbell clearly helped them sure up why they lost in the playoffs 2 years ago so cant argue with results). The Ravens had the second best scoring defense in the NFL. The players they signed, even after getting COVID, clearly did their job.

Brown for 20m is not worth 3-4 starters. He simply is not. A top 10-12 LT , who you would be playing at RT, is not worth that much. They picked the all pro LT to give the big contract. They picked the all pro corner to give the contract. They are probably going to pick the TE to give the contract (those are usually cheap). They are going to pick the former league MVP to give the contract. So instead of getting a 3rd round comp in 2 years, they got a 1st this year and they had to trade was 1 year. This is how you win. You sign the elite and you trade the very good, who always get overpaid, and you extend the good for fair money. Nick Boyle is good (even if I had no idea who he was), there is a reason per Scheft that he had 10 teams who would have made an offer in FA and they got him for 5m per year.

I’d rather have Brown than 3 starters if those starters are Sammy Watkins, Nick Boyle and Branson Williams.....

 

[ConstantReboot]

Championship teams make championship moves.

Our team overpays for mediocre talent. Signs injured and 3rd string backups during free agency. And brags about how smart they are regarding football matters.

 

[tyke1doe]

These are the moves you make when you have a talented front office.
The Ravens will make it work. They'll pick two studs low in the draft while most of the other teams above them strike out.

 

[Adreme]

I’d rather have Brown than 3 starters if those starters are Sammy Watkins, Nick Boyle and Branson Williams.....

I would take 3 Nick Boyles over 1 Orlando Brown especially at RT. As Watkins and Williams are not under contract next year their status is not relevant, but Boyle costs about 1/3 of what Brown would. You can get You can get a RT in this draft. You can sign Andre Villanueva for 1/4 of what Brown would cost and take a 3rd round flier in draft. Paying premium for very good does not work out. There is only one position you can justify that with and that is the QB. Every other position you need to pay great top dollar, but let someone else overpay for very good. Take the trade or the comp pick and find new players.

Orlando Brown is a very good football player. He is not a top 5 LT. He is not a top 5 RT. He is going to get paid like he is a top 3 LT. Instead they will pay a top 5 TE 7 million less per year. They will pay their MVP whatever the QB market is. Those are the players worth signing. Not the above average. They have an embarrassment of riches and it seems like every year a new player on that team breaks out and makes a PB, which is either drafting or coaching or both but its something that does not happen here outside of WRs. I compare the last 4 years of drafting and its night and day. You look at the trades made and its night and day. You look at contracts given and I would also say night and day (though the Collins contract was really good).

 

[Floatyworm]

Yeah Stanley is their LT......maybe with Lamar you don't need a highly paid offensive line but man.....I keep Orlando Brown....

You trade disgruntled players....a lesson we have never learned here under Jerry's watch. Jimmy would just cut them. We have a knack for collecting turds. Ravens will take Teven Jenkins OT Oklahoma St......and not miss a beat....get out from having to cave into a absurd contract demand....and have extra picks to boot. Smart trade.

 

[Flamma]

I thought the issue was he wanted to be paid like a left tackle? Either way I make it work. If Stanely gotta play right tackle that's fine but I'm not trading him away for some Chiefs garbage picks.

I agree, it was a good trade for the Chiefs. But that doesn't mean it was bad for the Ravens. The Ravens may feel they don't need him, and they can do just fine with who they do need at pick 31. If they're going for a WR or a corner, they can still get a pretty good player. If they take an offensive lineman, then that's just dopey.

From what I heard from a Ravens fan, a fan that's really happy about the trade, he says the guy wanted to play left tackle.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

You trade disgruntled players....a lesson we have never learned here under Jerry's watch. Jimmy would just cut them. We have a knack for collecting turds. Ravens will take Teven Jenkins OT Oklahoma St......and not miss a beat....get out from having to cave into a absurd contract demand....and have extra picks to boot. Smart trade.

When did Jimmy cut a disgruntled player who was a Pro Bowler? I don’t recalll that at all.....

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I agree, it was a good trade for the Chiefs. But that doesn't mean it was bad for the Ravens. The Ravens may feel they don't need him, and they can do just fine with who they do need at pick 31. If they're going for a WR or a corner, they can still get a pretty good player. If they take an offensive lineman, then that's just dopey.

From what I heard from a Ravens fan, a fan that's really happy about the trade, he says the guy wanted to play left tackle.

If it’s not a money issue and a left tackle issue then nothing you can do about it. I don’t like the trade especially since it helps the Chiefs....but maybe that’s the best deal they could’ve gotten.

 

[Motorola]

Kansas City Chiefs:
A) Saw the problem and viewed the resulting catastrophe that kept them from winning consecutive NFL Champioships
B) Made a significant move to help address that problem so they can get another NFL Championship.

 

[jrumann59]

Yeah Stanley is their LT......maybe with Lamar you don't need a highly paid offensive line but man.....I keep Orlando Brown....

But Brown wanted to be paid LT money.