Cooper and Collins

[waldoputty]

I am all for keeping Leary since we can easily create lots of cap space and currently have $60mil space for 2018

But the question here is RT - with Free giving up almost the most sacks for RT last year.

Some of us have been thinking about Collins for RT since he was signed.

How about trying Cooper for RT?
He is supposed to be extremely athletic for a guard.
He actually runs a slightly faster 40 than Collins.
He is also supposed to be a little light in the base for a guard.
Both problems kind of sound like Collins?
If Collins gets considered, why not Cooper?

 

[robbieruff]

I recall once reading that he was drafted as high as he was due to the fact that teams envisioned him eventually playing tackle (hard to imagine a guard being chosen in the top 10 of any draft with the intent of just keeping him at guard). Certainly, there was always bulk/strength concerns when he came into the league as a guard and that (perhaps) has been part of his continued struggles to play to his draft pedigree. I like the fact that we have the option of a low risk testing period with him and that should allow us to explore several opportunities/combinations for him...including possible RT. What's the harm in it at this point, right?

I think the consensus is Free's days as a starter are probably over (perhaps he's kept as a lower cost insurance policy and could be a nice veteran swing tackle to help as a bridge to a longer term solution).

I don't think it's that crazy a notion...would love it he we were able to coach him up to his potential, regardless of where he ends of playing.

 

[Killerinstinct]

I think we should cut Free now. Start Chaz Green and if he get's hurt it is not that big of a deal. Maybe Collins or Cooper aren't perfect at RT and maybe Cleary isn't ready to be an every down guy but I seriously don't see why you keep Free because you are worried about your Backup options not being prefect fits behind Green. Collins may not be a perfect RT but is he really any worse than Free?

Besides you could take the savings from cutting Free and sign Menelik Watson if you are really that worried about it.

It is time to move on from some dead weight.

Free and Wilber need to go and Tyrone Crawford and Thornton better show something big this year or they are both out the door next year. IMO

 

[Echo9]

Whether we like it or not, Leary is almost definitely going elsewhere. All the signs point to this and we need to get used it. Secondly, Cooper is currently a free agent that we'd have to sign back if we want.

With Collins, it's been made pretty clear that he is better suited in the NFL as a Guard. We get this speculation at least once a week asking why we don't try him at Tackle and every week someone explains that (according to the initial OTA) his tryout at tackle went poorly. We know very little about Cooper, but it will be interesting to see if we decide to bring him back.

In a perfect world, we would would be able to sign Leary to the a contract he deserves and will get, and Collins would be able to play at Tackle. The team does not think either of these scenarios are likely. The world is not perfect.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

He's a little short for RT. I think he's only like 6'2

 

[waldoputty]

Whether we like it or not, Leary is almost definitely going elsewhere. All the signs point to this and we need to get used it. Secondly, Cooper is currently a free agent that we'd have to sign back if we want.

With Collins, it's been made pretty clear that he is better suited in the NFL as a Guard. We get this speculation at least once a week asking why we don't try him at Tackle and every week someone explains that (according to the initial OTA) his tryout at tackle went poorly. We know very little about Cooper, but it will be interesting to see if we decide to bring him back.

In a perfect world, we would would be able to sign Leary to the a contract he deserves and will get, and Collins would be able to play at Tackle. The team does not think either of these scenarios are likely. The world is not perfect.

Cooper is a FA, but heard he likes it at Dallas and he would cost a lot less than Leary...

 

[waldoputty]

He's a little short for RT. I think he's only like 6'2

He is a little short and his arm length is 1/4" less than Collins.
The question is WHY Collins is not well suited for RT, and does Cooper have that problem(s)?

 

[waldoputty]

I think we should cut Free now. Start Chaz Green and if he get's hurt it is not that big of a deal. Maybe Collins or Cooper aren't perfect at RT and maybe Cleary isn't ready to be an every down guy but I seriously don't see why you keep Free because you are worried about your Backup options not being prefect fits behind Green. Collins may not be a perfect RT but is he really any worse than Free?

Besides you could take the savings from cutting Free and sign Menelik Watson if you are really that worried about it.

It is time to move on from some dead weight.

Free and Wilber need to go and Tyrone Crawford and Thornton better show something big this year or they are both out the door next year. IMO

I dont think Green will last enough for a starter. As a backup, his health is barely acceptable.
I am all for getting someone better since we have the cap space, but lets get the person first before cutting Free.
I also thought Free was a very good guard, so that is not a bad option?

Agreed with Crawford, but need to understand the cap impact from cutting him.
Some mentioned it does not make sense - but may be June 1 cut does...
Thornton is less than 1/2 the cost of Crawford so he does not need to be as good.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

He is a little short and his arm length is 1/4" less than Collins. The question is WHY Collins is not well suited for RT, and does Cooper have that problem(s)?

I think Collins might be able to eventually play RT but I just don't think the team really sees him there. I think they know Leary is gone and Collins is the guy they tag to replace him. They don't know about Cooper and his ability to be a consistent starter so you really can't plan for the move of Collins and the insertion of Cooper at LG. I'll be honest, I really don't understand why Cooper is not an exceptional Guard. He has all of the tools but for whatever reason, he just has not shown it. IDK

 

[Killerinstinct]

I dont think Green will last enough for a starter. As a backup, his health is barely acceptable.
I am all for getting someone better since we have the cap space, but lets get the person first before cutting Free.
I also thought Free was a very good guard, so that is not a bad option?

Agreed with Crawford, but need to understand the cap impact from cutting him.
Some mentioned it does not make sense - but may be June 1 cut does...
Thornton is less than 1/2 the cost of Crawford so he does not need to be as good.

Cutting Crawford next year is cap friendly. Thornton if he doesn't improve is dead weight too. There is no way you play Free at G. You just cut him. He is not good. We already have 4 options if Green is injured or we will if we re-sign Cooper.

Play Cleary at RT, Move Collins to RT and play Cooper, Play Cooper at RT, Move Martin to RT and play Collins and Cooper at G.

and again, this is "IF" Green gets hurt.

I see no reason to keep Free. Not only does he clear cap space if cut but he just isn't any good anymore.

 

[waldoputty]

I think Collins might be able to eventually play RT but I just don't think the team really sees him there. I think they know Leary is gone and Collins is the guy they tag to replace him. They don't know about Cooper and his ability to be a consistent starter so you really can't plan for the move of Collins and the insertion of Cooper at LG. I'll be honest, I really don't understand why Cooper is not an exceptional Guard. He has all of the tools but for whatever reason, he just has not shown it. IDK

I guess the question is if either could be better than Free. lol
If we put the best 5 out there, hopefully Free is not one of the 5...

 

[Vinnie2u]

We can't afford 5 pro bowlers across the line. But if Free is the weak link it's time to at least find a replacement.

 

[waldoputty]

Cutting Crawford next year is cap friendly. Thornton if he doesn't improve is dead weight too. There is no way you play Free at G. You just cut him. He is not good. We already have 4 options if Green is injured or we will if we re-sign Cooper.

Play Cleary at RT, Move Collins to RT and play Cooper, Play Cooper at RT, Move Martin to RT and play Collins and Cooper at G.

and again, this is "IF" Green gets hurt.

I see no reason to keep Free. Not only does he clear cap space if cut but he just isn't any good anymore.

I recall Free played well at Guard.
My point is dont cut anyone until we have the replacements.
Green is completely undependable.

 

[gmoney112]

He is a little short and his arm length is 1/4" less than Collins.
The question is WHY Collins is not well suited for RT, and does Cooper have that problem(s)?

They just think Collins can be an All-Pro type talent at Guard as opposed to RT. There is a legitimate shot that we have 4 All-Pro type players on the OL.

I don't know if Cooper ever played T. I know he was drafted expected to play G and also backup C if needed.

I'm all for giving Green/Cleary a full go at Tackle. I think Cleary played pretty well at LT and he's a huge dude. He'll be 27 in April, give him some reps with Chaz.

 

[Killerinstinct]

I recall Free played well at Guard.
My point is dont cut anyone until we have the replacements.
Green is completely undependable.

Maybe at one point Free played well at Guard. That would have been years ago. He doesn't play well anywhere now. We already have replacements as I have pointed out and we can get another if need be.

 

[waldoputty]

Maybe at one point Free played well at Guard. That would have been years ago. He doesn't play well anywhere now. We already have replacements as I have pointed out and we can get another if need be.

i think he played guard 2-3 years ago.
his problem with RT is pass blocking.
guard covers that weakness up to a great deal.
i do not agree we have proven options at RT.
green is made of glass and is barely ok at backup with his health.
cleary played in one game.
if nothing else, free is OT depth.
a proven RT should be brought in before cutting him.

 

[waving monkey]

If Free is so bad why do the people that see him and coach him everyday keep him around?
I haven't seen anyone that fires me up replacing Free.
Cooper has to develop his skills and confidence back. Collins replaces Leary that has been stated.

 

[Killerinstinct]

If Free is so bad why do the people that see him and coach him everyday keep him around?
I haven't seen anyone that fires me up replacing Free.
Cooper has to develop his skills and confidence back. Collins replaces Leary that has been stated.

He gave up 8 sacks this year, can't run block and leads the team in penalties. What's not to like? He sucks plain and simple.

 

[xwalker]

I am all for keeping Leary since we can easily create lots of cap space and currently have $60mil space for 2018

But the question here is RT - with Free giving up almost the most sacks for RT last year.

Some of us have been thinking about Collins for RT since he was signed.

How about trying Cooper for RT?
He is supposed to be extremely athletic for a guard.
He actually runs a slightly faster 40 than Collins.
He is also supposed to be a little light in the base for a guard.
Both problems kind of sound like Collins?
If Collins gets considered, why not Cooper?

Length or lack thereof.

6-2, 33" arm length

I think you'll have a hard time finding an NFL OT with those dimensions.


I've watched his game footage from Cleveland. He is not light in weight anymore.

 

[xwalker]

I recall Free played well at Guard.
My point is dont cut anyone until we have the replacements.
Green is completely undependable.

Free only played Guard in one game.