CFZ Cowboys Edge Rushers

[Creeper]

Tafua looks like Bradley Anae to me. He even leaves his feet a little when he executes his first move on the tackle.

Williams is quick but not strong. I don't expect much out of him in his rookie season. If he gets stronger he could be special.

The Cowboys need to hope someone emerges are a disruptor because that's what Gregory was. Sure, he made some bonehead plays sometimes, but he was the most disruptive DE the Cowboys had. I think some people let Gregory's bonehead plays influence them too much. He really helped the pass defense.

 

[xwalker]

Guys, listen to xwalker.

He was spot-on about Bradley Anae being a star.

I didn't hype Anae. You are thinking of @Dak_Attack_09

 

[xwalker]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but he was perceived to be the possible third round pick for the Cowboys. I think even the Cowboys hinted around that they might be looking at him in the third round.

Do you perceive that as the Cowboys underplaying their interest a little bit, or do you think that they got jumpy and reached for him?

• I don't think anybody from the Cowboys that is actually involved in the draft ever commented on where they might draft Sam Williams.
  • That was all speculation by the dc.com media guys and local sports talk radio guys like Broaddus.

• It appears based on interviews with S.Jones and McClay that they had 5 players that they discussed for the round 2 pick.
  • They quickly narrowed that down to Sam Williams or Jalen Tolbert.
  • They decided they were more willing to risk losing Tolbert than losing Williams.

• The Cowboys have had success when they draft players that they're 'sold on'.
  • They've had massive failures when they draft players that were a split decision within the organization.
  • They've also had big failures when drafting players that they didn't meet or do background checks on.

• Morris Claiborne: They didn't expect to have a chance to draft him; therefore, they didn't meet with him or check into his mental makeup.
  • That was back before Will McClay got the top talent evaluation job.

• Travis Frederick: They were 'sold' on him.
  • They considered another trade down before drafting him but decided it was not worth the risk of losing him and they liked getting the 5th year option.

• Taco: Split decision.
  • Stephen Jones and McClay loved TJ Watt but Marinelli loved Taco.

• Dak: They were 'sold' on him.
  • They had more pre-draft contact with Dak than any draft prospect in the past 2 decades.
  • The reasons they waited until the 4th round to draft him:
    • They were convinced that as long as QBs like Connor Cook were available, that other teams would draft that player before Dak.
    • Their draft board is a pure talent ranking. They don't build character/intangibles into the board. They evaluate that on draft day.
    • They had other QBs ranked higher than Dak because they use their own pure talent rankings to evaluate when other teams will draft players.
    • Connor Cook had the prototype QB measurables but the Cowboys had Dak's intangibles/leadership rated at the very top of any player in that draft.

 

[Cowboyny]

There are 2 basic types of Edge Rushers & some that played both styles.
Speed Rusher: ex. Von Miller
Leverage Rusher: DLaw
Both: Lawrence Taylor

Obviously there is more to Von Miller than just speed rushing.
- However, he is in that category because a very high percentage of his pass rush wins are from just blowing past OTs with speed.

Leverage Rusher could also be called Technique Rusher.
- DLaw developed an array of pass rush moves based on technique over speed.
- At at 251 pounds pre-draft, DLaw didn't have great speed (4.8 forty, 1.68 ten yard).

Football media have started using the term 'Euro Step' which is taken from Basketball jargon.

Sam Williams, despite being a 4.46 forty guy, had a high percentage of his success as a leverage type rusher.

Quick note on Dante Fowler:
- In 2020 with Atlanta in Dan Quinn's defense, he played more of the leverage/technique style than before or after being with Quinn. After Quinn departed Atlanta, Fowler played as a 3-4 OLB in 2021.

Dan Quinn obviously likes the leverage style.
- UDFA Mika Tafua's style is like a DLaw clone.
- Tafua might not have the athletic ability to make it in the NFL, but he had great technique in college.
- It took DLaw 2 or 3 years in the NFL to develop the same type of pass rush techniques.

I don't have cut-ups of DLaw or Sam Williams; therefore, I'm going to use some of Mika Tafua for discussion purposes.

Again, this is not about Mika Tafua per se. My goal is to demonstrate pass rush techniques.

This is a textbook DLaw pass rush move.
- Notice how he has that jump-step and it puts him on a straight line path to the QB.
- The hands and feet have to be in precise sync; otherwise, this move will be a big fail.
- DLaw does it will a bit more of a power move into the OT before the jump-step, but it's the same concept.

Learning technique take time and reps. Believe the team feels like they have enough at the position to allow a player like Sam Williams to develop this yr. Usually a steep learning curve at the position as players can longer just rely on their athletic abilities.

 

[Ken]

Sam "De" William's does not have the bag that DLaw or even Tafua have.

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/lists/instant-analysis-cowboys-no-56-pick-sam-williams/

But I hope you're right in that he is already an advanced technician because his athleticism, size and explosiveness are ridiculous off the charts good.

Still, Cowboys would be wise to hire DWare as his personal coach.

This is why some "experts" are just not experts at all.

That first clip, "nothing special about" ????

His get off was legendary and won right there. That is a play no other edge rusher makes in this class, imo.

3rd clip- "manhandled. lol.

The line stunt was slant/crash gap. He did his job. Holy cow.

He will never line up like that for the cowboys either. The fact that he can, is amazing though.

 

[Ken]

Sam Williams played 4i on many run downs.
- That is a position normally played by a DT type or 3-4 DE.
- Brent Urban (6-7, 308) played that alignment often in his NFL career.
- SW was never going to look great against the run from a 4i alignment.
- If the draft media graded his run defense only when he was outside as a true 4-3 or 4-2-5 DE, then he would have been considered a plus run defender.

Exactly.

Whoever the Defensive Coordinator is for Ole Miss....he should be fired.

This guy should have done nothing else other than come off that edge...

 

[quickccc]

1st clip: Variation of the previous move.
- Notice the jump-step is earlier in the pass rush set.
- He then 'powers thru' turning the corner.
- Watch how his cleats are firmly planted on his steps.
- He has just enough lean (bend) to make this work really well.
- Any push from the OT ends up as pressure through his body to his feet and into the ground.
- In contrast, we've all seen many college speed rushers that are easily pushed wide if the OT breaths on them.
- The common theme with DLaw, Sam Willliams and this UDFA that over-achieved his physical ability, is that they can 'power thru' turning the corner. It is not easy to push them wide past the QB.

2nd clip: Not really a long move per se. He does flash a long arm but does not really use it.
- Notice how he has both hands on the OTs outside arm.
- It is a just a very subtle move to restrict the OTs arm/hand movement just slightly.

Bradlee Anae 2.0

- Lacks athleticism, subs it for advance rush technique.
- Uses chop down technique, swim over, not a top athlete but subs that for advance hand and leverage techniques.

- The big difference is Anae had a more productive sack numbers at college level, and he dominated both Senior Bowl practices and all star game
(a lot vs Terrence Steele) ..thus allowing to be selected by Cowboys in 5th round.

- Also like Anae, Taufa does not play special teams ...

 

[DogFace]

I missed it.

Why was he a late edition to the senior bowl?

 

[DCreppinBoysfan]

what i like most about Dlaw is the fact he sets the edge on run plays forcing the RB to cut back inside to the LB.....or he stalemates the blocker which keeps the LB free to make a play

his pass rushing imo isnt the best but its not a big deal either i honestly see him as a set up guy more than anything and sacks are something if he gets cool if he doesnt he had his hand in the play that made the sack

Williams ive looked at his tape he's fast his technique needs work but once he puts it together at the pro level hes going to be a good one because you wont be able to double team any edge rusher and then you have to worry about Parsons possibly coming on a blitz

So all those years we had two setup guys(Crawford and DLaw) but nobody to get us home? That’s explains a lot

 

[xwalker]

Bradlee Anae 2.0

- Lacks athleticism, subs it for advance rush technique.
- Uses chop down technique, swim over, not a top athlete but subs that for advance hand and leverage techniques.

- The big difference is Anae had a more productive sack numbers at college level, and he dominated both Senior Bowl practices and all star game
(a lot vs Terrence Steele) ..thus allowing to be selected by Cowboys in 5th round.

- Also like Anae, Taufa does not play special teams ...

Maybe the bold red font was difficult for you to see...

I don't have cut-ups of DLaw or Sam Williams; therefore, I'm going to use some of Mika Tafua for discussion purposes.

Again, this is not about Mika Tafua per se. My goal is to demonstrate pass rush techniques.

 

[quickccc]

Maybe the bold red font was difficult for you to see...

we just see it differently.

You're seeing a different type player vs Bradlee Anae.... while i'm seeing a similar type and style Anae-like player.

 

[quickccc]

Tafua looks like Bradley Anae to me. He even leaves his feet a little when he executes his first move on the tackle.

Williams is quick but not strong. I don't expect much out of him in his rookie season. If he gets stronger he could be special.

The Cowboys need to hope someone emerges are a disruptor because that's what Gregory was. Sure, he made some bonehead plays sometimes, but he was the most disruptive DE the Cowboys had. I think some people let Gregory's bonehead plays influence them too much. He really helped the pass defense.

As with any rookie DE, it's gonna take some developmental time, and we know that slower process irritates certain very impatient, overreaction fans.
Dlaw took some time to develop, ..ditto Gregory... Armstrong. .. .

We're gonna depend upon by committee than solo double digit sack DE guy.
Fowler once had a 11 sack season with Rams yet came unusual cheap in FA market considering

What i do not wanna see is Williams being " game inactive " for most of the season, because he cannot play special teams, etc.
Cannot gain value experience and rotation reps like that.

 

[xwalker]

we just see it differently.

You're seeing a different type player vs Bradlee Anea.... while i'm seeing a similar type and style Anae-like player.

Are you unable to read?

The analysis was not about Tafua per se.
- I don't care about Tafua.

The analysis was about pass rushing techniques and the clips of Tafua were convenient.

The underlying point is that Sam Williams played with those types of techniques but he also ran a 4.46 forty.

Tafua (college) and DLaw (NFL) developed those techniques because they can't get close to running a 4.46 forty.
- i.e. Can't win as speed rushers.

The fact that Sam Williams used similar techniques but also has the ability to just line up and speed rush means the sky is the limit for him.

 

[xwalker]

Exactly.

Whoever the Defensive Coordinator is for Ole Miss....he should be fired.

This guy should have done nothing else other than come off that edge...

It was only on run downs that SW lined up at that spot; although he did often just inside off the snap as a pass rusher.

Belichick shutdown the Rams in the 2018 season Super Bowl by changing his defensive scheme to have the RDE play the B gap (inside the LT) vs the run instead of the RDE's normal run assignment (C gap outside the LT).

It allowed the LB on that side to say outside the LT regardless of play type.

The Cowboys and Marinelli had no answer for the Rams running scheme in the playoff game that season.
- The Rams running game was based on restricting the LBs from moving right/left.
- Marinelli had no answer for the Rams scheme in the playoff game that year.
- Belichick, by making this simple change, allowed his LB to stay outside regardless of play type.
- The Rams scheme to restrict the right/left movement was useless because the LB didn't need to move right/left.

Dan Quinn often has his DEs pass rush on the inside.
- That means that if it ends up as a run play, the DE must be able to at least have some ability to play the run from the inside.
- It's the reason that Quinn liked Randy Gregory. In college, despite playing at 235 pounds, Gregory was one of the best Edge players vs the run.
- I'm certain that Sam Williams ability to pass rush on the inside was a big part of why Dan Quinn liked him over other pass rushers in this draft.

 

[Ken]

It was only on run downs that SW lined up at that spot; although he did often just inside off the snap as a pass rusher.

Belichick shutdown the Rams in the 2018 season Super Bowl by changing his defensive scheme to have the RDE play the B gap (inside the LT) vs the run instead of the RDE's normal run assignment (C gap outside the LT).

It allowed the LB on that side to say outside the LT regardless of play type.

The Cowboys and Marinelli had no answer for the Rams running scheme in the playoff game that season.
- The Rams running game was based on restricting the LBs from moving right/left.
- Marinelli had no answer for the Rams scheme in the playoff game that year.
- Belichick, by making this simple change, allowed his LB to stay outside regardless of play type.
- The Rams scheme to restrict the right/left movement was useless because the LB didn't need to move right/left.

Dan Quinn often has his DEs pass rush on the inside.
- That means that if it ends up as a run play, the DE must be able to at least have some ability to play the run from the inside.
- It's the reason that Quinn liked Randy Gregory. In college, despite playing at 235 pounds, Gregory was one of the best Edge players vs the run.
- I'm certain that Sam Williams ability to pass rush on the inside was a big part of why Dan Quinn liked him over other pass rushers in this draft.

I understand that he played it on run downs, but people pass on run downs. Those are times where him coming off the edge would have been a hell of a lot easier than fighting through the trash.

I also agree that him playing in this scheme with this technique is a big reason he was available to us in the 2nd (including off the field, obviously). As I stated, I think it IS a good thing that he showed he could hold up fine in this defense for his prospects to play in our scheme vs the run. It is why I am so confident he will not be just a "pass rush specialist" in his rookie year with us.

 

[xwalker]

I understand that he played it on run downs, but people pass on run downs. Those are times where him coming off the edge would have been a hell of a lot easier than fighting through the trash.

I also agree that him playing in this scheme with this technique is a big reason he was available to us in the 2nd (including off the field, obviously). As I stated, I think it IS a good thing that he showed he could hold up fine in this defense for his prospects to play in our scheme vs the run. It is why I am so confident he will not be just a "pass rush specialist" in his rookie year with us.

It is interesting how much college coaches impact the draft rating of players.

If Tyler Smith has only played OG in college, nobody would have questioned him as a 1st round talent.
- He would have been able to just line up and dominate college DLinemen as an OG.
- At LT, no amount of physical talent can mask a lack of proper technique.

Having said that, I assume that character questions had the biggest impact on Sam Williams draft rating by most teams.

 

[quickccc]

Are you unable to read?

The analysis was not about Tafua per se.
- I don't care about Tafua.

The analysis was about pass rushing techniques and the clips of Tafua were convenient.

The underlying point is that Sam Williams played with those types of techniques but he also ran a 4.46 forty.

Tafua (college) and DLaw (NFL) developed those techniques because they can't get close to running a 4.46 forty.
- i.e. Can't win as speed rushers.

The fact that Sam Williams used similar techniques but also has the ability to just line up and speed rush means the sky is the limit for him.

You had a previous post, stating you don't understand the comparisons between Anae vs Tafua.
You brought up Tafua.
That's where i'm responding to that post, explaining my side of the comparisons.

You're actually posting film clips of Tafua.,.. yet you're saying you" don't care about Tafua " ?

and i'll reinterate thru your posted film sessions clips that i'm still seeing Bradley Anae 2.0; Very similar player styles.

But yet, i'm still not supposed to bring up Anae vs Tafua.comparisons ?

Go figure.

 

[Bobhaze]

Nice work here X. Appreciate all the homework.

Generally, I’m not as impressed with college highlight films to judge NFL talent. Sometimes they show us great insight. But they can also show that same player against college guys that would never even make an NFL camp body. It can cause us to overrate a player’s overall NFL level ability.

I think Sam Williams (whatever he’s called now) has excellent pass rushing skills and think he can become a good pass rusher at the next level. But I also think his lack of run stopping ability makes him more of a project than an immediate weapon on defense. IMO, We will need some patience to see what Williams can become. Glad we have him, but I don’t expect immediate big payoffs.

 

[BAT]

 

[BAT]

De Williams has similar burst off the snap to Parsons - crazy get off.