Dak’s third down rating

percyhoward

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I can see that with all the tight throws, but have a few issues with PFF ... I don't really trust their objectivity
There's that, and I don't agree with their idea that a ball that was both on target and untouched by a defender is "contested." On target and tipped or knocked away, yes. Off target with the defender in position, yes.
 

irishline

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How many of those initial 3rd down Dak pass conversions have been nullified due to penalties? I can think of at least 8-10 of them so far after only 4 games.

That stat is seriously deceiving.

8 to 10 huh?

This is the problem with this stuff, people either incorrectly remembering things or just not bothering to look stuff up. If you are going to call someone's stats wrong at least take the time to make sure your own thoughts are accurate first and not inflated by 400 or 500%.

Here are the play-by-plays for all 4 games... find me 8 to 10 Dak pass conversions that were nullified... you won't.

Week 1 - Two 3rd down penalties against us. Both delay of game on Dak.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018090910/2018/REG1/cowboys@panthers?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 2 - two 3rd down penalties against us. One on a run by Zeke and the other on a pass by Dak. There is 1.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018091613/2018/REG2/giants@cowboys?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 3 - two 3rd down penalties against us - One illegal touch by Zeke on a pass. The other was a sack and declined. There is 2.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018092312/2018/REG3/cowboys@seahawks?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 4 - zero 3rd down penalites against us.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018093002/2018/REG4/lions@cowboys?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

So in total - 2 of your 8 (or 10) 3rd down pass conversions reversed by penalties actually occurred. In total we have had 6 3rd down penalties... 2 delay of games on Dak, 3 holds (1 of which was declined), and 1 illegal touch. What is seriously deceiving may not be what you think it is.

http://www.nflpenalties.com/team/dallas-cowboys?year=2018&view=log
 
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gmoney112

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Lot of people upset about stats aggregated by an entity who has shown over and over they couldn't find their butt with two hands and a map.

They outsource their analysis to scrubs, bro.

I cant wait for AI to give us reasonable analysis, aside from a few places and NFL official stats, it's mostly just terrible.

PFF contracted with the NFL because of Collinsworth right? Are they even allowed to use any other "stats"?
 

America's Cowboy

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8 to 10 huh?

This is the problem with this stuff, people either incorrectly remembering things or just not bothering to look stuff up. If you are going to call someone's stats wrong at least take the time to make sure your own thoughts are accurate first and not inflated by 400 or 500%.

Here are the play-by-plays for all 4 games... find me 8 to 10 Dak pass conversions that were nullified... you won't.

Week 1 - Two 3rd down penalties against us. Both delay of game on Dak.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018090910/2018/REG1/cowboys@panthers?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 2 - two 3rd down penalties against us. One on a run by Zeke and the other on a pass by Dak. There is 1.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018091613/2018/REG2/giants@cowboys?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 3 - two 3rd down penalties against us - One illegal touch by Zeke on a pass. The other was a sack and declined. There is 2.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018092312/2018/REG3/cowboys@seahawks?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 4 - zero 3rd down penalites against us.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018093002/2018/REG4/lions@cowboys?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

So in total - 2 of your 8 (or 10) 3rd down pass conversions reversed by penalties actually occurred. In total we have had 6 3rd down penalties... 2 delay of games on Dak, 3 holds (1 of which was declined), and 1 illegal touch. What is seriously deceiving may not be what you think it is.

http://www.nflpenalties.com/team/dallas-cowboys?year=2018&view=log
Don't you know how to count??? Only 2? SMDH!!!
 

TheMarathonContinues

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So when stats post positive things things about Dak his haters say stats lie. When they post negative stats they are telling the truth.
 

Hennessy_King

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He was better than many QBs whose teams won multiple championships. He wasn't good enough to win a championship with the inept front office/coaches he had to deal with, but I don't know if there was ever a QB who was that good.

As for Dak, usually you need a QB that has the ability to put up stats if you want to be effective at moving the ball, but hey you can hope for a Qb to move the ball and not put up stats all you want.
He wasn't better tho. He was maybe a top 10 qb never was considered elite, ever. You do realize in 2014 romos stats looked very similar to daks because we are a run first team now.
 

LocimusPrime

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8 to 10 huh?

This is the problem with this stuff, people either incorrectly remembering things or just not bothering to look stuff up. If you are going to call someone's stats wrong at least take the time to make sure your own thoughts are accurate first and not inflated by 400 or 500%.

Here are the play-by-plays for all 4 games... find me 8 to 10 Dak pass conversions that were nullified... you won't.

Week 1 - Two 3rd down penalties against us. Both delay of game on Dak.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018090910/2018/REG1/cowboys@panthers?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 2 - two 3rd down penalties against us. One on a run by Zeke and the other on a pass by Dak. There is 1.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018091613/2018/REG2/giants@cowboys?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 3 - two 3rd down penalties against us - One illegal touch by Zeke on a pass. The other was a sack and declined. There is 2.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018092312/2018/REG3/cowboys@seahawks?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

Week 4 - zero 3rd down penalites against us.

https://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2018093002/2018/REG4/lions@cowboys?icampaign=GC_schedule_rr

So in total - 2 of your 8 (or 10) 3rd down pass conversions reversed by penalties actually occurred. In total we have had 6 3rd down penalties... 2 delay of games on Dak, 3 holds (1 of which was declined), and 1 illegal touch. What is seriously deceiving may not be what you think it is.

http://www.nflpenalties.com/team/dallas-cowboys?year=2018&view=log
:hammer:
 

Number1

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So when stats post positive things things about Dak his haters say stats lie. When they post negative stats they are telling the truth.

put me on record as thinking Dak can be a SB winning franchise QB, I had him as a top QB coming into the draft and the best immediate fit for this team (I'd have traded half the team for Goff except he's a WCO guy).

he is a good play action deep timing system QB, a solid leader, protects the ball (but too many throw aways for my taste) and can run when needed
I'd note he hasn't missed a start and can run over a LB

my argument is let him do what he does best - run around and throw deep - but I don't lie about stats, for example, Dak's had a bizarre 2017

in 9 wins, 26 PPG, 14 TDs and 2 INTs,
in 7 losses, 16 PPG, 8 TDs, and 11 INTs
that's weird

I also note, he was sacked 3 times as often in losses as wins, the D allowed only 12 PPG in wins and a ridiculous 32 PPG in losses. And half those INTs in losses came off the hands of WRs, because Dak threw it too hard

notice in 2 wins this year he been sacked 3 times, in the 2 losses 11

according to many Dak detractors he's the reason for every loss, every sack, and "can't see" and can't throw straight and is "afraid" to throw deep ...

he really does complete a ton of tight shots and I have no stat to back it up but I'll lay money he's one of the top deep ball throws in the game (when they go deep)
 

irishline

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Don't you know how to count??? Only 2? SMDH!!!

Do you know how to read? I provided you with links that support my claim that its only 2, unlike what you "think" it is.

Prove me wrong. I provided everything you need to do so. Show me these 8 or 10 + 3rd down conversions. Fact is you can't because they did NOT happen. I gave you the play-by-play for each of the 4 games you referenced. They are NOT there. Or are the NFL's own game logs lying? Sorry to upset you with actual game logs, facts, and whatnot.

I do not have an agenda here but to point of that what you "remember" isn't actually what happened. I do not root against any Cowboy player, I am a Cowboy fan, why in the world would I want to root against someone playing on the team I have loved for 30+ years?

But at the same time I have no problem looking at and understanding what is wrong with the team. If you can't objectively see that what you said was wrong (and pointed out with actual facts and stats to back it up), maybe step away for a bit and chill out. Fragile... SMDH....
 
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Gator88

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He wasn't better tho. He was maybe a top 10 qb never was considered elite, ever. You do realize in 2014 romos stats looked very similar to daks because we are a run first team now.
He was a top 10 Qb easily every year he played and wasnt hurt for most of the season, top 5 for multiple seasons, and the best QB in 2014. Romo's stats in 2014 were not similar to Dak's. When Dak leads the league in passer rating, completion percentage, and yards per attempt in the same season, then maybe their stats will be similar.
 

Hennessy_King

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He was a top 10 Qb easily every year he played and wasnt hurt for most of the season, top 5 for multiple seasons, and the best QB in 2014. Romo's stats in 2014 were not similar to Dak's. When Dak leads the league in passer rating, completion percentage, and yards per attempt in the same season, then maybe their stats will be similar.
Hah maybe to you. Never considered top 5 around the league.
 
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