Defensive Depth Chart Evolution

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Going into the 2013 season our depth chart looked something like:

Spencer Ratliff Hatcher Ware
Durant Lee Carter
Carr Church Allen Scandrick

Crawford Hayden Bass Selvie
Lawrence Sims Holloman
Claiborne Wilcox Heath Webb

Spencer, Bass, Crawford, and Ratliff never played. By week 9, Durant, Lee, Carter, and Allen were out. Hatcher and Ware were both playing hurt and shells of their early efforts. Backups Claiborne, Wilcox, and Holloman missed from 5 games to the whole season. So for example in our midseason Minnesota game had us trotting out the likes of:

Selvie Hayden Nevis Ware
Sims Lawrence Carter
Carr Church Heath Scandrick

Rayford Wynn Irvin Brown
Jones Bosworth
Moore Hamilton Webb

If you don't recognize some of the names on the second team don't worry about it. They were street FA we brought in. The above was what gave up all those points and yards in November and December. The first depth chart held but for Sims until week 7 where Ware hurt his quad. At that point they were 12th in the league for all of the massive points they gave up to Denver and the Giants. Then we trotted out this or a similar lineup for the next 7 weeks and that brought us from top half to worst. The last two weeks saw both Wilber and Holloman play and voila the middle of the field stopped being pitch and catch land.

The story of the offseason has been rehashed but coming out of TC this year our depth chartlooks something like

Selvie Hayden/McClain Melton Mincey
Carter McClain Durant
Carr Church Wilcox Scandrick

Crawford Bishop Coleman Spencer
Wilber Lawrence Hitchens
Claiborne Hamilton Heath Patmon

Now the obvious discussion is that injuries happen in the NFL and how can you be sure we won't get raped by injury once again? First of all we are already doing better than last year. We have lost Laurence for 8 weeks and Holloman for the year but last year we lost Crawford and Bass, Ratliff was talking about ligaments pulling off of bone, Spencer had a degenerative knee condition, and Wilcox had a death in the family. Now Melton and McClain may make a liar out of me but as of today they are supposed to play on Sunday. Even if neither can go their backups are much better than anything we had last year.

The DL is two deep across the board despite losing Lawrence for 8 weeks. This depth will improve as Spencer works his way in and Lawrence returns fromm injury. We have 5 DT that can play. Last year we had a starting 4 and a bunch of garbage when the right side of line started getting dinged it was over. That will not happen quite so easily this year.

LB has better depth as well where we can take yet another LB loss and still not have to trot out the likes of Ernie Sims. Both Wilber and Hitchens are superior players than Sims. Even this years version of Lawrence is better than Sims.

Secondary is where the issue is due to suspension. Moore is near replacement level and Patmon is green as grass. With Scandrick out for 4 weeks that could be problematic especially if Claiborne gets hurt again. this is my biggest worry on defense. Safety is razor thin where one injury can bring a return of the Heath show. Mind you that Heath level play is what we had straight out the gate last year.

Another thing to consider are all the names that are on the current depth chart now that were here last year. Of those starting only McClain, Mincey, and somewhat Melton are new to the scheme. The backups have a lot of youth but Wilber Crawford and even the much reviled Heath and Hamilton have a years experience.

The cover 3/2 system the team uses is not easy to execute. I feel that the experience will be invaluable.

We are not going to be able to absorb the upwards 100 games lost due to injury to a dozen players getting hurt like last year. No team in the league can handle that. OTOH, we can lose some front 7 players and still not have the wheels fall off. I don't forsee many Drake Nevis and Ernie Sims starts.

 

[xwalker]

Going into the 2013 season our depth chart looked something like:

Spencer Ratliff Hatcher Ware
Durant Lee Carter
Carr Church Allen Scandrick

Crawford Hayden Bass Selvie
Lawrence Sims Holloman
Claiborne Wilcox Heath Webb

Spencer, Bass, Crawford, and Ratliff never played. By week 9, Durant, Lee, Carter, and Allen were out. Hatcher and Ware were both playing hurt and shells of their early efforts. Backups Claiborne, Wilcox, and Holloman missed from 5 games to the whole season. So for example in our midseason Minnesota game had us trotting out the likes of:

Selvie Hayden Nevis Ware
Sims Lawrence Carter
Carr Church Heath Scandrick

Rayford Wynn Irvin Brown
Jones Bosworth
Moore Hamilton Webb

If you don't recognize some of the names on the second team don't worry about it. They were street FA we brought in. The above was what gave up all those points and yards in November and December. The first depth chart held but for Sims until week 7 where Ware hurt his quad. At that point they were 12th in the league for all of the massive points they gave up to Denver and the Giants. Then we trotted out this or a similar lineup for the next 7 weeks and that brought us from top half to worst. The last two weeks saw both Wilber and Holloman play and voila the middle of the field stopped being pitch and catch land.

The story of the offseason has been rehashed but coming out of TC this year our depth chartlooks something like

Selvie Hayden/McClain Melton Mincey
Carter McClain Durant
Carr Church Wilcox Scandrick

Crawford Bishop Coleman Spencer
Wilber Lawrence Hitchens
Claiborne Hamilton Heath Patmon

Now the obvious discussion is that injuries happen in the NFL and how can you be sure we won't get raped by injury once again? First of all we are already doing better than last year. We have lost Laurence for 8 weeks and Holloman for the year but last year we lost Crawford and Bass, Ratliff was talking about ligaments pulling off of bone, Spencer had a degenerative knee condition, and Wilcox had a death in the family. Now Melton and McClain may make a liar out of me but as of today they are supposed to play on Sunday. Even if neither can go their backups are much better than anything we had last year.

The DL is two deep across the board despite losing Lawrence for 8 weeks. This depth will improve as Spencer works his way in and Lawrence returns fromm injury. We have 5 DT that can play. Last year we had a starting 4 and a bunch of garbage when the right side of line started getting dinged it was over. That will not happen quite so easily this year.

LB has better depth as well where we can take yet another LB loss and still not have to trot out the likes of Ernie Sims. Both Wilber and Hitchens are superior players than Sims. Even this years version of Lawrence is better than Sims.

Secondary is where the issue is due to suspension. Moore is near replacement level and Patmon is green as grass. With Scandrick out for 4 weeks that could be problematic especially if Claiborne gets hurt again. this is my biggest worry on defense. Safety is razor thin where one injury can bring a return of the Heath show. Mind you that Heath level play is what we had straight out the gate last year.

Another thing to consider are all the names that are on the current depth chart now that were here last year. Of those starting only McClain, Mincey, and somewhat Melton are new to the scheme. The backups have a lot of youth but Wilber Crawford and even the much reviled Heath and Hamilton have a years experience.

The cover 3/2 system the team uses is not easy to execute. I feel that the experience will be invaluable.

We are not going to be able to absorb the upwards 100 games lost due to injury to a dozen players getting hurt like last year. No team in the league can handle that. OTOH, we can lose some front 7 players and still not have the wheels fall off. I don't forsee many Drake Nevis and Ernie Sims starts.

Good post.

 

[jazzcat22]

Very nice post, pretty much sums it all up.

 

[mmohican29]

Going into the 2013 season our depth chart looked something like:

Spencer Ratliff Hatcher Ware
Durant Lee Carter
Carr Church Allen Scandrick

Crawford Hayden Bass Selvie
Lawrence Sims Holloman
Claiborne Wilcox Heath Webb

Spencer, Bass, Crawford, and Ratliff never played. By week 9, Durant, Lee, Carter, and Allen were out. Hatcher and Ware were both playing hurt and shells of their early efforts. Backups Claiborne, Wilcox, and Holloman missed from 5 games to the whole season. So for example in our midseason Minnesota game had us trotting out the likes of:

Selvie Hayden Nevis Ware
Sims Lawrence Carter
Carr Church Heath Scandrick

Rayford Wynn Irvin Brown
Jones Bosworth
Moore Hamilton Webb

If you don't recognize some of the names on the second team don't worry about it. They were street FA we brought in. The above was what gave up all those points and yards in November and December. The first depth chart held but for Sims until week 7 where Ware hurt his quad. At that point they were 12th in the league for all of the massive points they gave up to Denver and the Giants. Then we trotted out this or a similar lineup for the next 7 weeks and that brought us from top half to worst. The last two weeks saw both Wilber and Holloman play and voila the middle of the field stopped being pitch and catch land.

The story of the offseason has been rehashed but coming out of TC this year our depth chartlooks something like

Selvie Hayden/McClain Melton Mincey
Carter McClain Durant
Carr Church Wilcox Scandrick

Crawford Bishop Coleman Spencer
Wilber Lawrence Hitchens
Claiborne Hamilton Heath Patmon

Now the obvious discussion is that injuries happen in the NFL and how can you be sure we won't get raped by injury once again? First of all we are already doing better than last year. We have lost Laurence for 8 weeks and Holloman for the year but last year we lost Crawford and Bass, Ratliff was talking about ligaments pulling off of bone, Spencer had a degenerative knee condition, and Wilcox had a death in the family. Now Melton and McClain may make a liar out of me but as of today they are supposed to play on Sunday. Even if neither can go their backups are much better than anything we had last year.

The DL is two deep across the board despite losing Lawrence for 8 weeks. This depth will improve as Spencer works his way in and Lawrence returns fromm injury. We have 5 DT that can play. Last year we had a starting 4 and a bunch of garbage when the right side of line started getting dinged it was over. That will not happen quite so easily this year.

LB has better depth as well where we can take yet another LB loss and still not have to trot out the likes of Ernie Sims. Both Wilber and Hitchens are superior players than Sims. Even this years version of Lawrence is better than Sims.

Secondary is where the issue is due to suspension. Moore is near replacement level and Patmon is green as grass. With Scandrick out for 4 weeks that could be problematic especially if Claiborne gets hurt again. this is my biggest worry on defense. Safety is razor thin where one injury can bring a return of the Heath show. Mind you that Heath level play is what we had straight out the gate last year.

Another thing to consider are all the names that are on the current depth chart now that were here last year. Of those starting only McClain, Mincey, and somewhat Melton are new to the scheme. The backups have a lot of youth but Wilber Crawford and even the much reviled Heath and Hamilton have a years experience.

The cover 3/2 system the team uses is not easy to execute. I feel that the experience will be invaluable.

We are not going to be able to absorb the upwards 100 games lost due to injury to a dozen players getting hurt like last year. No team in the league can handle that. OTOH, we can lose some front 7 players and still not have the wheels fall off. I don't forsee many Drake Nevis and Ernie Sims starts.

Incredible post. No way this defense is as bad as last year's IMO. That said, having a Sean Lee and DeMarcus Lawrence healthy was critical for it to be anywhere near "good".

It has to be the offensive side of the football that carries this team.
If I'm Garrett/Marinelli: demand excellence of execution in the redzone for both sides and we can compete in every game.

 

[tm1119]

You see 5 DT's on this roster that have proven they can play at an adequate nfl level? Can I borrow your glasses?

The silver lining in this defense for me is the 2nd half of the season. If we can survive the 1st half by beating the teams we should and have Melton, Spencer, R. McClain, Scandrick and Lawrence all fully healthy and back to game shape for the last 8 games there may be hope.

 

[JBell]

I don't know what you guys are seeing, but this year's depth chart looks a lot closer to last year's 2nd half defense than it does the 2013 opening day defense.

And did you purposely leave out Hatcher or was that a mistake?

 

[jobberone]

Great post Fuzzy. A lot is riding on Melton and T McClain. Not as optimistic about T Mac but not too worried about Melton. They'll just have to live with the quality snaps he can give them. Spencer is going to be back game 2-4 and he'll have to work his snaps up, too.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You see 5 DT's on this roster that have proven they can play at an adequate nfl level? Can I borrow your glasses?

The silver lining in this defense for me is the 2nd half of the season. If we can survive the 1st half by beating the teams we should and have Melton, Spencer, R. McClain, Scandrick and Lawrence all fully healthy and back to game shape for the last 8 games there may be hope.

I am confident that Melton, Coleman, McClain and Bishop can play better than Hatcher, Hayden, Wynn and Nevis.

I don't feel like going through the bother of defining what is 'adequate' and how one goes about 'proving' something. I think we have radically different standards.

 

[Common Sense]

I don't know what you guys are seeing, but this year's depth chart looks a lot closer to last year's 2nd half defense than it does the 2013 opening day defense.

And did you purposely leave out Hatcher or was that a mistake?

Honestly, I can't even tell if the original post is serious or not? The 2014 depth chart is horrendous, with or without injury. When your starting line is Selvie Hayden Melton Mincey, you're not even one-deep, much less two.

 

[CF74]

Sims was better than Hitchens, just couldn't stay healthy but overall good post..

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't know what you guys are seeing, but this year's depth chart looks a lot closer to last year's 2nd half defense than it does the 2013 opening day defense.

And did you purposely leave out Hatcher or was that a mistake?

Hatcher missed that game. Said he didn't want to put out bad tape. My point was to show the fools gold we had going into last season's TC and what type of lineups really caused the historically bad defensive performances we had.

Opening day 2013 looked like

Selvie Hayden Hatcher Ware
Durant Lee Carter
Carr Church Allen Scandrick

Wilber Cohen
Holloman Sims Lawrence
Claiborne Heath Wilcox Webb

 

[CCBoy]

Going into the 2013 season our depth chart looked something like:

Spencer Ratliff Hatcher Ware
Durant Lee Carter
Carr Church Allen Scandrick

Crawford Hayden Bass Selvie
Lawrence Sims Holloman
Claiborne Wilcox Heath Webb

Spencer, Bass, Crawford, and Ratliff never played. By week 9, Durant, Lee, Carter, and Allen were out. Hatcher and Ware were both playing hurt and shells of their early efforts. Backups Claiborne, Wilcox, and Holloman missed from 5 games to the whole season. So for example in our midseason Minnesota game had us trotting out the likes of:

Selvie Hayden Nevis Ware
Sims Lawrence Carter
Carr Church Heath Scandrick

Rayford Wynn Irvin Brown
Jones Bosworth
Moore Hamilton Webb

If you don't recognize some of the names on the second team don't worry about it. They were street FA we brought in. The above was what gave up all those points and yards in November and December. The first depth chart held but for Sims until week 7 where Ware hurt his quad. At that point they were 12th in the league for all of the massive points they gave up to Denver and the Giants. Then we trotted out this or a similar lineup for the next 7 weeks and that brought us from top half to worst. The last two weeks saw both Wilber and Holloman play and voila the middle of the field stopped being pitch and catch land.

The story of the offseason has been rehashed but coming out of TC this year our depth chartlooks something like

Selvie Hayden/McClain Melton Mincey
Carter McClain Durant
Carr Church Wilcox Scandrick

Crawford Bishop Coleman Spencer
Wilber Lawrence Hitchens
Claiborne Hamilton Heath Patmon

Now the obvious discussion is that injuries happen in the NFL and how can you be sure we won't get raped by injury once again? First of all we are already doing better than last year. We have lost Laurence for 8 weeks and Holloman for the year but last year we lost Crawford and Bass, Ratliff was talking about ligaments pulling off of bone, Spencer had a degenerative knee condition, and Wilcox had a death in the family. Now Melton and McClain may make a liar out of me but as of today they are supposed to play on Sunday. Even if neither can go their backups are much better than anything we had last year.

The DL is two deep across the board despite losing Lawrence for 8 weeks. This depth will improve as Spencer works his way in and Lawrence returns fromm injury. We have 5 DT that can play. Last year we had a starting 4 and a bunch of garbage when the right side of line started getting dinged it was over. That will not happen quite so easily this year.

LB has better depth as well where we can take yet another LB loss and still not have to trot out the likes of Ernie Sims. Both Wilber and Hitchens are superior players than Sims. Even this years version of Lawrence is better than Sims.

Secondary is where the issue is due to suspension. Moore is near replacement level and Patmon is green as grass. With Scandrick out for 4 weeks that could be problematic especially if Claiborne gets hurt again. this is my biggest worry on defense. Safety is razor thin where one injury can bring a return of the Heath show. Mind you that Heath level play is what we had straight out the gate last year.

Another thing to consider are all the names that are on the current depth chart now that were here last year. Of those starting only McClain, Mincey, and somewhat Melton are new to the scheme. The backups have a lot of youth but Wilber Crawford and even the much reviled Heath and Hamilton have a years experience.

The cover 3/2 system the team uses is not easy to execute. I feel that the experience will be invaluable.

We are not going to be able to absorb the upwards 100 games lost due to injury to a dozen players getting hurt like last year. No team in the league can handle that. OTOH, we can lose some front 7 players and still not have the wheels fall off. I don't forsee many Drake Nevis and Ernie Sims starts.

Thanks, Fuzzy...a quality discussion site read. It was good as well as insightful. As to all the 'informed' on site, they might start off by referencing that Russia is in the news a lot right now, and then start explaining vodka to us...while a bottle of Russo-Baltique Vodka was on the counter. Or the Jerry's march to the ocean is an all consuming scorched earth policy that deprives all remaining lemming from making it to Malibu and the ocean...after putting down a Ripple bottle:

With the stability arriving in both the linebackers and defensive line...I'm expecting the improvements in the secondary to be revealed as well.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Honestly, I can't even tell if the original post is serious or not? The 2014 depth chart is horrendous, with or without injury. When your starting line is Selvie Hayden Melton Mincey, you're not even one-deep, much less two.

You appear stuck in binary.

I admit there are no stars on this defense right now. That is besides the point.

 

[percyhoward]

The first depth chart held but for Sims until week 7 where Ware hurt his quad. At that point they were 12th in the league for all of the massive points they gave up to Denver and the Giants. Then we trotted out this or a similar lineup for the next 7 weeks and that brought us from top half to worst.

Since 2008, there have been 43 teams that finished the season ranked among the top 12 in pass rating differential, turnover differential, and points-per-drive differential. All 43 teams made the playoffs or won at least 10 games.

Last year, the Cowboys finished the season ranked 18th in PRD, 9th in TOD, and 17th in PPDD, but at the season's halfway point, the Cowboys ranked in the top 12 in all three categories.

We were on pace to win 10 games.

 

[Jack Burton]

I appreciate the write up and analysis, but do not share the optimism. We went an entire off-season and I still honestly can't say what kind of defense we will have due to not seeing many of our projected starters in action. I know the pre-season is vanilla and all scheme wise, but our guys getting blown off the ball in the run game and not getting a lot of push in the pass rush was a very bad sign. Combine that with musical chairs at linebacker, and you get a front seven that has a hard time inspiring confidence. I hope they prove me wrong, and play lights out, but I expect the ceiling on this defense is average at best. And that's if everything, and I mean everything, goes right.

 

[Ashwynn]

I think this is one of those deals where its going to get worse before it gets better..

 

[tecolote]

Good post. If we can make it through the first 8 games we could possibly have:

Spencer Mclain Melton Lawrence as the startinng d-line. Not exactly Doomsday but not bad.

 

[CCBoy]

I appreciate the write up and analysis, but do not share the optimism. We went an entire off-season and I still honestly can't say what kind of defense we will have due to not seeing many of our projected starters in action. I know the pre-season is vanilla and all scheme wise, but our guys getting blown off the ball in the run game and not getting a lot of push in the pass rush was a very bad sign. Combine that with musical chairs at linebacker, and you get a front seven that has a hard time inspiring confidence. I hope they prove me wrong, and play lights out, but I expect the ceiling on this defense is average at best. And that's if everything, and I mean everything, goes right.

That part is called analytical identification...next, comes the step of analysis, which Fuzzy provided.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I appreciate the write up and analysis, but do not share the optimism. We went an entire off-season and I still honestly can't say what kind of defense we will have due to not seeing many of our projected starters in action. I know the pre-season is vanilla and all scheme wise, but our guys getting blown off the ball in the run game and not getting a lot of push in the pass rush was a very bad sign. Combine that with musical chairs at linebacker, and you get a front seven that has a hard time inspiring confidence. I hope they prove me wrong, and play lights out, but I expect the ceiling on this defense is average at best. And that's if everything, and I mean everything, goes right.

You can spin tales about Spencer and Melton returning to 2012 form. Both McClains, Crawford and Coleman all emerging; Lawrence returning and contributing. Carter comes on at SAM. Wilcox and the secondary make more plays. Everyone stays healthy.

I am not so concerned about the ceiling. What I am concerned with is the floor like what has actually happened the last two years.

I am talking about guys like Nevis, Hayden, Sims, Peprah, McCray, Poppinga, and Heath who have all started at various times in the last two years.

 

[Common Sense]

You appear stuck in binary.

I admit there are no stars on this defense right now. That is besides the point.

No, it really isn't.