Did the Horse Collar Rule ruin Roy Williams?

whcarm

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I think it is very valid to look at Roy's decreased level of playmaking ability and to blame that on the horse collar rule. I don't mean to say that because of the rule he could no longer make those types of tackles and thus he was less effective. What I mean is that since the rule got implemented, it has been in his head and he has been more hesitant. That has made him less of a playmaker.

The rule got implemented during the 2005 season. Well, if you look at things, that was actually a pretty good season for Williams. He had more sacks that any other year in his career. He also had more forced fumbles than any other year in his career.

But the hitch is that in 2005, he was playing for a contract extension, which he got the summer after that season. Also, even in 2005 he had the second lowest tackles of his then four year career. He also had the lowest numbers of stuffs of his then four year career. Still, overall, not a bad year.

Since then, things have gone down hill. Is it because of the horse collar rule? Maybe. It could also be that after he got his contract extension that he simply got lazy. It is probably a little bit of both. But I feel certain that he has become much more hesistant sine the rule got put into place.

In 2006 and 2007 he has two of his three lowest tackle totals of his career. In the past two years he has not recorded any sacks, he had 6.5 sacks in the previous four years. He had 12 stuffs in his first four years. He has none during the past two years. He has not had a forced fumble in the last two years. Obviously, the last two years have been below par for Williams.

Again, you can argue that he just got lazy after the extension. But I think it is more than that. He obviously has been more hesitant and less of a balls-out type player. Instead of trying to get his hands on a player and force them down, which allows him to make more plays, cause more fumbles, stuff more guys and get more sacks, he instead tries to spear guys. That isn't good tackling, but it does ensure that he won't get penalized for horse collaring anyone.

Anyway, just something I was thinking about.
 

Cowboys22

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No, he still does it as often as he ever did. He got his money and quit giving a ****!!!!!!!!
 

Boyzmamacita

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There may be some validity to the original poster's theory. In the last two seasons Roy has looked outright timid when it's time to make contact. It's almost as if he's compensating for an injury or is afraid of something. Then, out of the blue, he'll nail somebody to the oohs and aahs of the crowd, but even this doesn't happen as much as it once did. Whatever is wrong with Roy seems to be mental. I think he needs to see a psychiatrist. Seriously. Is there any such thing as a sports shrink?
 

Nors

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Last I checked Roy never stopped horsecalling opponents.
 

TRUTH87

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Boyzmamacita;1862358 said:
There may be some validity to the original poster's theory. In the last two seasons Roy has looked outright timid when it's time to make contact. It's almost as if he's compensating for an injury or is afraid of something. Then, out of the blue, he'll nail somebody to the oohs and aahs of the crowd, but even this doesn't happen as much as it once did. Whatever is wrong with Roy seems to be mental. I think he needs to see a psychiatrist. Seriously. Is there any such thing as a sports shrink?

sure seems to be mental mamacita...seems like hes over-thinkin the idea of makin a mistake.
 

AdamJT13

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whcarm;1862352 said:
The rule got implemented during the 2005 season. Well, if you look at things, that was actually a pretty good season for Williams. He had more sacks that any other year in his career. He also had more forced fumbles than any other year in his career.

Roy's most forced fumbles came in his rookie year, when he had four (plus one on special teams).


Also, even in 2005 he had the second lowest tackles of his then four year career.

In 2005, he had the fewest tackles of his career, including this year.

But the notion that having more or fewer tackles means you had a better or worse season is preposterous. Aside from the inexact nature of recording tackles and other factors (scheme, positioning on the field, etc.), there can be a HUGE difference in the number of tackles that are even possible from one season to the next, because your opponents don't run the same number of plays each season, nor do they pass or rush in the same proportions. In 2002, for example, our opponents ran the ball 481 times and completed 334 passes, for a total of 815 possible tackles. The very next year, our opponents ran 413 times and completed 239 passes, for a total of 652 possible tackles. That's a difference of 163 possible tackles -- a 20 percent reduction. In other words, getting 80 tackles in 2003 would be the equivalent of getting 100 in 2002.

It could also be that after he got his contract extension that he simply got lazy.

The year after his contract extension, he led all safeties in takeaways, tied his career high with five interceptions (plus another one in the playoff game) and shattered his career high in passes defended.

In 2006 and 2007 he has two of his three lowest tackle totals of his career.

No, he has two of his four highest tackle totals of his career. This year is his second-highest total, and he's played in only 14 games so far. If you adjust for the number of possible tackles, he easily has his highest tackle numbers this season (107 tackles out of 635 possible).

In the past two years he has not recorded any sacks, he had 6.5 sacks in the previous four years.

But he has more quarterback pressures this season than he's had since 2004.

He had 12 stuffs in his first four years. He has none during the past two years.

No, he had two tackles for loss last season.

He has not had a forced fumble in the last two years.

According to the coaches' film review, he forced one against Tennessee last season.
 

theogt

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brando_shredder_1.jpg
 

03EBZ06

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Why is NFL sending a ruined player to the Pro Bowl?

All those coaches and players who voted for him (since he didn't lead fan voting) should be fired.
 

AdamJT13

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03EBZ06;1862418 said:
All those coaches and players who voted for him (since he didn't lead fan voting) should be fired.

Roy did lead the fan voting. But enough players and coaches voted for him to send him (reportedly) to the Pro Bowl as the first alternate.
 

03EBZ06

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AdamJT13;1862435 said:
Roy did lead the fan voting. But enough players and coaches voted for him to send him (reportedly) to the Pro Bowl as the first alternate.
Wasn't Sean Taylor the leading fan vote getter?
 

Rack

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He had 12 stuffs in his first four years. He has none during the past two years

Didn't he have a "Stuff" against the Packers on that play where he knocked the crap out of the RB?

Or did the RB gain an inch thereby making it a useless tackle since it wasn't a "Stuff"?
 

03EBZ06

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Kilyin

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That was a decent critique of Roy aside from the glaring amount of complete misinformation.

Good read.

Thanks for posting.
 

whcarm

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I've been around board for many years where Adam has been posting, so I believe what he said. I will say, that I got all my stats from CNNSI. My stats were correct according to them. If Adam has different stats then I'll bow down to them. However, I was not throwing up stats to try and back up my theory. I looked at the stats I saw and put up my thoughts on them. Not my fault if CNNSI is full of crap :)
 

ndanger

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I think Roy is the one who ruined a perfectly good way to tackle someone from behind. :mad:
 

burmafrd

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I think Roy is clearly more hesitent to just be agressive and hit people. THAT is where a lot of his plays were made. And its easy to see why he would be more hesitent now: penalities and a clear shift in the NFL about hard hits. Har d hits used to be a mark of pride to the NFL= now its an invitation to a penalty and/or a fine. It takes a while but it does have an effect. I think that is what has happened to Roy.
 
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