DMN Blog: Loss of Williams' effect on the secondary

[TVMan]

There are some here who simply don't "get it" and perhaps that's Roy's problem too.

Why the lecturing tone? Why should your opinion be valued more than any other?

The difference is supposed to be, that if you're a pro, you don't get caught up in the "heat of the moment"...you play with discipline.

You act like he attacked the guy with a club. He screwed up and pulled the guy down by his collar trying to make a play.

It's a stupid rule.

It isn't the only stupid rule that is inconsistently called in the NFL.

I will defer to you though, since I don't get it.

 

[AmishCowboy]

Well, At least we will most likely see Courtney Brown and maybe Alan Ball as well.

 

[Echo9]

And... you could argue that they let a few horsecollars go over the years... giving Roy plenty of time to adapt. Once the rule was in place... he kept doing it soon thereafter and they didnt always call it.

He was given a grace period. Suspension is warranted.

And, NO... I never tackled a guy in football... but I stayed at a Holiday Inn last night :laugh1:

I understand your point, but why is a suspension warranted really?

Do guys regularly get suspended if they facemask someone three times in a season?


Roy commited the penalty and deserved the 15 yd flag, but what makes this worthy of suspension when other personal fouls never even get talked about in regards suspensions?

The facemasking penalty was instituted because you could otherwise break someone's neck. It's a pretty serious offense. It's not less dangerous than a horsecollar. It's more dangerous if you ask me. Is it just that it's been around for a while so its not the hot new flag to throw?

Personally, I hate the horse collar rule. Preventing a defender for being allowed to tackle a guy from behind baffles me. But they made a rule, so it needs to be enforced. But I don't see why it qualifies for suspension when other more dangerous moves are.

 

[Juke99]

Why the lecturing tone? Why should your opinion be valued more than any other?

You act like he attacked the guy with a club. He screwed up and pulled the guy down by his collar trying to make a play.

It's a stupid rule.

It isn't the only stupid rule that is inconsistently called in the NFL.

I will defer to you though, since I don't get it.

Sorry...but I don't recall saying my opinion should be valued more than anyone else's. I had quite a heated discussion about this topic the other day..so my usual polite, gentle, sensitive manner is out the window.

My point is...it doesn't matter if the rule is stupid. I still don't quite understand why people keep referring to that as a way to excuse this. It's a rule. If the rule is stupid, bring it up in the offseason with the competition and rules committee. Until then, abide by it.

His own coach said they have tried but they haven't been able to coach it out of him.

As far as being the only stupid rule inconsistently called, that's far from accuate. Take a look at darn near every play and tell me you don't see offensive linemen holding. How about pass interference? There's a lot of inconsistency.

Fact is, even IF Roy is targeted because it's a rule that he largely caused...and even if he's targeted unfairly...that's the reality. And he just made it worse for himself. Now, if he goes to pat a guy high on the back after a game, they're gonna suspend him.

Sorry if my tone offended you.

 

[Doomsday101]

Sorry...but I don't recall saying my opinion should be valued more than anyone else's. I had quite a heated discussion about this topic the other day..so my usual polite, gentle, sensitive manner is out the window.

My point is...it doesn't matter if the rule is stupid. I still don't quite understand why people keep referring to that as a way to excuse this. It's a rule. If the rule is stupid, bring it up in the offseason with the competition and rules committee. Until then, abide by it.

His own coach said they have tried by they haven't been able to coach it out of him.

As far as being the only stupid rule inconsistently called, that's far from accuate. Take a look at darn near every play and tell me you don't see offensive linemen holding. How about pass interference? There's a lot of inconsistency.

Fact is, even IF Roy is targeted because it's a rule that he largely caused...and even if he's targeted unfairly...that's the reality. And he just made it worse for himself. Now, if he goes to pat a guy high on the back after a game, they're gonna suspend him.

Sorry if my tone offended you.

I agree. Not liking a call and dealing with the reality are 2 different things. The rule is here and I don't see it changing any time soon. Either Roy adjusts his game to this rule or this will not be the last time he ends up missing time. For me this is not a knock on Roy just the way it is.

 

[adamknite]

Roy commited the penalty and deserved the 15 yd flag, but what makes this worthy of suspension when other personal fouls never even get talked about in regards suspensions?

I think it's because the NFL is saying he's intentionally doing it/making no effort to stop. I'm sure if they see a guy ripping somebody down by the facemask and it appears this has become his new tackling style, they slap him with a suspension too.

I don't agree with it, but that is just my assumption on why he's getting suspended for it. So take it for what it's worth.... not much.

 

[Juke99]

I agree. Not liking a call and dealing with the reality are 2 different things. The rule is here and I don't see it changing any time soon. Either Roy adjusts his game to this rule or this will not be the last time he ends up missing time. For me this is not a knock on Roy just the way it is.

Thank you. Well stated. Now you can deal with the outcry for your opinion here...I'm gonna get a hot chocolate and watch.

Yep, that's my point. I'm not discussing the fairness..or the merits of the rule. Personally, I think it's a good rule. But even if I didn't. It's a rule.

 

[Doomsday101]

Thank you. Well stated. Now you can deal with the outcry for your opinion here...I'm gonna get a hot chocolate and watch.

Yep, that's my point. I'm not discussing the fairness..or the merits of the rule. Personally, I think it's a good rule. But even if I didn't. It's a rule.

People can complain all they want, heck I'm not crazy about the rule but it is the way it is so either Roy adjust and deals with it or as I said Roy will continue to face suspensions. I like Roy and yes sometimes I think he gets a bad rap around here but when all is said and done these are the rules and it is on Roy to change.

 

[Derinyar]

I just think its stupid that they don't enforce suspensions equally. I can't remember the last time someone got a suspension for personal fouls. I could probably look it up, but I'm feeling way too lazy right now. If there is one I bet its for head hunting.

 

[Juke99]

People can complain all they want, heck I'm not crazy about the rule but it is the way it is so either Roy adjust and deals with it or as I said Roy will continue to face suspensions. I like Roy and yes sometimes I think he gets a bad rap around here but when all is said and done these are the rules and it is on Roy to change.

I'm ok with the rule. It's a subjective call, so that's what bothers me about it. But then again, to one degree or another, just about every infraction is subjective.

Problem is, ya read a lot about how the game has become flag football...etc....but ya know, these guys are HUGE now. Back in the old days, LB's weighed 210 lbs. Big linemen weighed 270. The human body is only made to withstand so much. The rules have to change as the game and players evolve...whether we like it or not.

It's big money now. They're gonna put in rules to protect the players. Each player is a multi million dollar investment.

 

[adamknite]

I just think its stupid that they don't enforce suspensions equally. I can't remember the last time someone got a suspension for personal fouls. I could probably look it up, but I'm feeling way too lazy right now. If there is one I bet its for head hunting.

Honestly, I bet Roy is going to use that, or some variation with that basic principal in his appeal as a reason why he shouldn't be suspended.

 

[Doomsday101]

I'm ok with the rule. It's a subjective call, so that's what bothers me about it. But then again, to one degree or another, just about every infraction is subjective.

Problem is, ya read a lot about how the game has become flag football...etc....but ya know, these guys are HUGE now. Back in the old days, LB's weighed 210 lbs. Big linemen weighed 270. The human body is only made to withstand so much. The rules have to change as the game and players evolve...whether we like it or not.

It's big money now. They're gonna put in rules to protect the players. Each player is a multi million dollar investment.

I understand their reason of why but again just me I don't like the constant rule changes and think that is what helps lead to the bad calls as refs are constantly dealing with the yearly changes. Having said this, the players know the rules going into the season and has to adjust to them regardless if they like them or not.

 

[Derinyar]

Honestly, I bet Roy is going to use that, or some variation with that basic principal in his appeal as a reason why he shouldn't be suspended.

I think its a pretty good argument. I suspect there are players with more personal fouls this year that haven't gotten to the level of fine hes gotten much less been suspended for it.

They put in the rule cause he injured TO and now he gets hit for it more than others and then suspended for it.

 

[BehindEnemyLinez]

Man, I thought there would be a CELEBRATION going on here today! I mean, most on this board want Roy gone, right, at least now those who do get their wish for one game! We'll see how good the alternatives are since Mr. Williams apparently will be watching from his palatial home Sat night! BTW, I don't think that his repeated offenses of the horse-collar rule warrant a suspension but hey, what the hell do I know!

 

[eduncan22]

I would put Henry in as free safety. Have Newman and Reeves as corners move Hamlin to strong safety for our base defense. Fill Brown in for Watkins if he can't go in the nickel and Dime. Carpenter or Davis could fill in for Roy when he plays LB. Although losing Roy for a game is a negative, this could be in our favor to see how other players perform in different roles.

Interesting idea....

But...

Losing Roy for a game hurts our run defense. No doubt about it.

Hamlin is NOT as strong against the run.


Good ol' Keith Davis will just have to do.

 

[bysbox1]

It's a stupid rule.

It isn't the only stupid rule that is inconsistently called in the NFL.

That's the problem I have with it. There was a horse collar tackle last night on Monday night football that was not called.

Roy got suspended as a repeat offender, and that's fine. Just call the infraction consistently.

 

[bysbox1]

Honestly, I bet Roy is going to use that, or some variation with that basic principal in his appeal as a reason why he shouldn't be suspended.

Not that it matters. I honestly have never seen the league office lift a suspension.

 

[eduncan22]

That's the problem I have with it. There was a horse collar tackle last night on Monday night football that was not called.

Roy got suspended as a repeat offender, and that's fine. Just call the infraction consistently.

The NFL didn't like McNabb getting tackled like that.

 

[Hostile]

I'll say it again, the horse collar rule does NOT protect anyone. Not one single player is safer because that rule is in place. You can still grab the players from behind, drag them down, and land on their legs. As long as you don't do it high near the shoulders it is perfectly legal.

Has to be the most ineffective rule evere adopted. It absolutely accomplishes nothing.

 

[jterrell]

:

Well, THIS is why Roy should be kicked in the seat of his pants...The rule has been in place for three years. ENOUGH already.

There are some here who simply don't "get it" and perhaps that's Roy's problem too.

It doesn't matter if you agree with the rule or not...It's a rule and this is why you follow the rule.

Some spoke of "heat of the moment" and how anyone who's ever played football understands that things happen in the heat of the moment.

Well, many of us played football, I'm sure.

None of us played professionally.

The difference is supposed to be, that if you're a pro, you don't get caught up in the "heat of the moment"...you play with discipline.

And this is why.

So, we go into Carolina, for a game that we need to win, without our starting safety.

Well done Roy.

holding and jumping offsides are against the rules too but guys that do so seem to do so every game. have we cut flozell yet?

i think the play is just instinctual for him and forcing himself not to do it just means he makes less plays overall because he is stopping in the middle of a play to think about his next action.