Ellis & Glover Cap Hit, Adam?

[boysfanindc]

Trying to figure out the benefit of these moves besides potential draft picks, what would the overall picture look like as far as cap hit be if both guys leave via cut or trade.

Allen is the third question.

Are we better of in 06, cap space wise?

 

[AdamJT13]

Trying to figure out the benefit of these moves besides potential draft picks, what would the overall picture look like as far as cap hit be if both guys leave via cut or trade.

Allen is the third question.

Allen's cap number is $7,558,333. If we cut or trade him before April 1, he will count $4,116,668 against the cap, a savings of $3,441,665.

Glover's cap number is $7.2 million. If we cut or trade him before the first day of the league year, he'll count $1.2 million. If we cut or trade him after that, he'll count $2.7 million.

Ellis' cap number is $3,350,000. If we cut or trade him him before the 15th day of the league year, he'll count $2.4 million. If trade him anytime after that, or if we cut him after that but before June 2, he'll count $2.9 million. If the Collective Bargaining Agreement is extended and we cut him on or after June 2, he'll count $1.1 million in 2006 and another $1.8 million in 2007. (If the CBA isn't extended, it'll be the same on or after June 2 as it would have been before it.)

Are we better of in 06, cap space wise?

We'll probably have just a little less cap room than we did last offseason -- unless we do something with guys such as Allen, Glover, Ellis, Nguyen and Singleton to open up more cap room.

 

[TheHustler]

We'll probably have just a little less cap room than we did last offseason -- unless we do something with guys such as Allen, Glover, Ellis, Nguyen and Singleton to open up more cap room.

What happens if Nguyen retires as expected? Assuming his contract stays as is.

 

[AdamJT13]

What happens if Nguyen retires as expected? Assuming his contract stays as is.

Nguyen's cap number is $2,458,333. If he retires before the league year begins, he'll count $666,668, a savings of $1,791,665.

 

[Hiero]

Nguyen and Glover will give us a good salary cap relief. maybe dat can have a sideline role?

 

[Portland Fanatic]

Based off of cap money Glover is as good as gone...that's huge. Not sure how we can get rid of Allen....who will replace?

Ellis has a good salary to trade....

I bet we cut Glover, trade Ellis, and keep Allen.

 

[aikemirv]

I was for cutting Allen, but his cap number difference if cut really does not justify doing that.

I think Portland has it just about right and hopefully we take that money from Glover and get Hutchinson or Bently.

 

[Verdict]

With the cap numbers on Allen and Glover I think both of them get restructured or cut. I'd like to see us keep both of them actually, but not with those kind of cap numbers. I really think Ellis' deal is cap friendly making him ripe for trading. Dat's cap savings was something I didnt expect.

 

[AbeBeta]

Glover's cap number is $7.2 million. If we cut or trade him before the first day of the league year, he'll count $1.2 million. If we cut or trade him after that, he'll count $2.7 million.

Interesting -- if we think we can get a 3 or 4 for Glover, is it worth the 1.5 mill of cap space?

 

[GoCowboysGo]

Allen's cap number is $7,558,333. If we cut or trade him before April 1, he will count $4,116,668 against the cap, a savings of $3,441,665.

Allen is GONE!

His cap number if tooooo large to accept considering the number of missed blocks he had.

Hard to believe that he made the pro-bowl this year, although I know it's never really about substance to make the pro-bowl anyway.

 

[yesfan]

Maybe they can get back that #4 pick

 

[Portland Fanatic]

Interesting -- if we think we can get a 3 or 4 for Glover, is it worth the 1.5 mill of cap space?

Man it would be nice to trade Glover for a top notch young FS...much needed postion on this team and considering he may not get more then a 3rd...just a wild thought.

 

[AbeBeta]

I was for cutting Allen, but his cap number difference if cut really does not justify doing that.

How so? we save nearly 3.5 million. Cap savings is what is important here -- not the dead money

 

[Hiero]

How so? we save nearly 3.5 million. Cap savings is what is important here -- not the dead money

save 3.5 million, and create another hole on our porous oline. Allen isnt the same old allen, but he's better than anything else we have. If Peterman could ever get out there and prove something it may be a different story.

 

[AbeBeta]

save 3.5 million, and create another hole on our porous oline. Allen isnt the same old allen, but he's better than anything else we have. If Peterman could ever get out there and prove something it may be a different story.

3.5 million would be most of the cap hit for a good FA interior lineman.

Allen may have another year left in him but I didn't see anything this year that suggests that he has anything left.

And don't rule out Peterman -- I think people assume that since he didn't get snaps at LG that he sucks -- that may not be the case.

 

[playit12]

Ok.... lots of more information needed before I make this decision...

First... Even though you may only save 1 million by cutting a guy making 7 million, it might still be a good decision. You need to look at the life of the contract and plan ahead a little.

How many more years is LA under contract? How many years is his bonus still prorated and what is the amount per year? What is his base salary next year and subsequent years.

Larry Allen only had two more years under his contract. He is scheduled to make base salaries of 3.5 million next year and 2.5 million in 2007 (the last year of his contract). All the additional money counting against the cap for LA is due to either his prorated bonus or various types of Bonuses. Assuming for the moment that we don't owe him any bonuses, then we will be paying LA the same amount of money against the cap (over bases salary) if we cut him or let him play out his contract. In that instance, you need to look at just what you will be "additionally" paying Larry in his base salary over the next two yearsby keeping him on the team. Considering his level of play, I think 3.5 million and 2.5 million might not be that unreasonable. Of course, this is assuming no roster bonuses... which Adam can hopefully correct me on.

All cap hits and savings must be viewed in light of the cost of replacement for that player and the total cost of the alternative (not cutting or trading the player). Often times cutting highly paid players amounts to "rebuilding" a team, where the team will take large amounts of dead money in the short term (one or two years) in order to alleviate that cap space in the longer term. I don't think we are at a rebuilding stage over the next two years... so I think we have to consider that as well.

We could cut all three guys, but I don't think we could replace all three by way of Free Agency without taking up most of our cap room. Room we might need next year for other unforseen problems.

 

[playit12]

One more thing... I have seen projections for the cap increase over the next year to be much more than in previous years... If that happens you can expect drastic inflation on the cost of Free Agents. Don't expect to be able to find guys for the same price that you found them last year.

 

[MrPhil]

What are the chances of LA accepting a pay cut?

Assuming Dat retires and we get rid of Glover and Ellis, we are looking at what? $10M+ in cap savings before looking at LA? That is a good chunk of change.......

 

[wileedog]

3.5 million would be most of the cap hit for a good FA interior lineman.

Allen may have another year left in him but I didn't see anything this year that suggests that he has anything left.

And don't rule out Peterman -- I think people assume that since he didn't get snaps at LG that he sucks -- that may not be the case.

Parcell's comment on Peterman was that he is "one dimensional" - meaning he's had problems picking up other positions along the line.

That doesn't necessarily translate that he is a bad LG, just that he couldn't be moved to OT where he was needed.

The question will come down to who is available. $3.5M can certainly buy you a suitable replacement to the current Larry Allen, but is there one out there? Or do we use a high round pick on an OG and coun't on him and Peterman, using the cap savings to shore up FS or LB, or even on a vet RT?

The last concern IMO is the very good criticsm that I believe S. Spadowski brought up. Our line right now is a little schizophrenic. We have 'smaller', more agile guys like Johnson, Rivera and Peterman, as well as big, more immobile guys like Allen, Gurode and Pettiti. The combination isn't working well, as you can see every time we try to run one of those train-wreck screen plays - some guys are getting where they are supposed to be, and some guys aren't, and it only takes one not getting there to blow the play up.

Bill usually opts for a more athletic line. Removing LA from the equation would be one step towards creating a better functioning O-line, even if there is a slight decrease in talent (assuming LA has more left than I think he does, even).

Gonna be interesting to see how this plays out.

 

[playit12]

The last concern IMO is the very good criticsm that I believe S. Spadowski brought up. Our line right now is a little schizophrenic. We have 'smaller', more agile guys like Johnson, Rivera and Peterman, as well as big, more immobile guys like Allen, Gurode and Pettiti. The combination isn't working well, as you can see every time we try to run one of those train-wreck screen plays - some guys are getting where they are supposed to be, and some guys aren't, and it only takes one not getting there to blow the play up.

Bill usually opts for a more athletic line. Removing LA from the equation would be one step towards creating a better functioning O-line, even if there is a slight decrease in talent (assuming LA has more left than I think he does, even).

Gonna be interesting to see how this plays out.

One of the most accurate assessments of our Line I've heard recently.

I'd love to see our Front office just make a decesion on our line and start to work towards it. This mix and matching strong and slow with mobile and weak is a disaster.

Considering the pieces we have... I'd go with a big line.

On the big side we have book ends (FA, TT and RP)
Guard - LA
Center - AG

On the small side we have
Guard - MR
Center - AJ

I don't know where to put Peterman just yet. He's not the type of large guard I'd want, but he's not small either.

I'd draft one of the huge mawling gaurds (USC's Taitusi for instance) and let him either replace allen or Rivera. I'd live with the rotation at center we had this year and let both young players get better. I'd also work on making peterman be a backup on both sides.

I think Rob will get stronger in the off season and help solve our problem at RT for the time being. Either way, you can always afford to help one lineman. No team can afford 5 pro-bowl lineman.

This would really help to give our team an identity on offense.