Even more proof that Carp's a bust

[Fletch]

To THIS point, I'm with spectre. (with the exception it's TWO years in) Hasn't done one thing. We'll see tonight if he can turn it around. Even if he does, I get the feeling they're trying to pump his "value" up for a trade...........we'll see soon enough.

So 'tonight' we will know what we need to know regarding Carpenter? How about the rest of training camp and preseason before going off one game? One preseason game at that.

 

[Alexander]

I think Carpenter would start on a lot of other NFL teams. We just have so many Quality LB's that its hard to get him out there.

Start on what, bad teams? It is not just a case of talent (which he has), it is a case of him getting the things done to get on the field somehow.

I don't care that he is fourth on the depth chart. What disturbs me is that even the plans Phillips had for him last year (distinct packages designed for him) had to be scuttled because he did not step up.

He appears to be stepping up, so quite possibly the light has gone on. But I don't think you can arbitrarily excuse his inability to find even a niche role outside of special teams to a simple numbers game. You find ways to get talent on the field. They have to be the ones to make that absolutely necessary by being better than the others ahead of them, even if it is in specific roles.

 

[Alexander]

So 'tonight' we will know what we need to know regarding Carpenter? How about the rest of training camp and preseason before going off one game? One preseason game at that.

He's had 40 games or so to show he has something. He's shown something in about three, if that. How many more does he need?

 

[sago1]

Why both calling out the scouting department for the first round pick of Carpenter. You haven't a clue that they were responsible for that pick. Given Parcells well known track record for drafting somebody he wants over what the scouting department say (remember that OT from Cal that Parcells just had to draft in the 2nd round despite scouting reports he was soft & injuried).

Besides if you check the rate of success/failure of players drafted in the first round, fully half of those players picked don't live up to their first round selection. Actually the Cowboys have a good record of late with their first round picks, it's 2nd rounders we have trouble with.

 

[Woods]

Personally, I've been disappointed in Carp thus far.

But I'm not calling him a bust yet. (o.k., maybe just a boob.)

If he can step up this season, which is a real possibility, he is still young enough to contribute on defense for some time.

But I think even Carp knows that this season is critical for him.

Carp mentioned that last pre-season he was injured and could barely raise one of his arms. I didn't know that at that time. But this season he's been making plays in TC and is healthy. So there are really no excuses.

But I draw the line in terms of patience by the end of this season.

 

[JRid21]

I'd like to see any LB cover Witten.

D-Ware and Adalius Thomas

 

[fortdick]

Spencer has already played and contributed more than Carp in one season.

The difference in our coaches' opinions on Spencer's potential and Carpenter's potential, immediately beginning their first seasons, were black and white.

Spencer was kept at bay by someone (Ellis) miraculously playing at a Pro Bowl level which was unprecedented. Carp was not held at bay because of the talent ahead of him. He was held back because of his ineptitude at the position

That said... I will apply the same label to Spencer if he isn't able to contribute significantly to this team during this season.


It's not about dissing Carpenter or his lack of ability. It's more about calling out the scouting for overdrafting a mediocre player. Carp is not at fault for lofty expectations. Carp is just trying his best to do what is asked of him, I'm sure.

Carp contributed as much his first year as Spencer did. Spencer is kept at bay by a one time pro bowler, and Capenter is kept at bay by a 7 time pro bowler. Your arguments just show a bias against Carp that you don't apply equally.

 

[CrazyCowboy]

Nice thread. Thanks for posting.

:laugh2: :starspin

 

[dogberry]

How many years was Steve Young a bust with the 49ers?

 

[Alexander]

Carp contributed as much his first year as Spencer did. Spencer is kept at bay by a one time pro bowler, and Capenter is kept at bay by a 7 time pro bowler. Your arguments just show a bias against Carp that you don't apply equally.

Your reply shows not only a bias for Carpenter but a lack of knowledge of the facts as well.

Spencer started six games and posted three sacks to go along with 36 tackles. In his rookie season, Carpenter started one and had 1.5 sacks and 19 tackles. And Spencer had Ellis in front of him. Carpenter had a free path to the starting OLB job with only Al Singleton to hold him off and it never materialized.

 

[Alexander]

How many years was Steve Young a bust with the 49ers?

How many games did Steve Young show absolutely nothing? You can see when players are pushing for time. He was pushing Montana for years and eventually Walsh could not justify keeping him on the bench.

Carpenter hasn't pushed anyone, yet he keeps getting the benefit of the doubt for the lack of impact. Why?

 

[theogt]

How many games did Steve Young show absolutely nothing? You can see when players are pushing for time. He was pushing Montana for years and eventually Walsh could not justify keeping him on the bench.

Carpenter hasn't pushed anyone, yet he keeps getting the benefit of the doubt for the lack of impact. Why?

All but a handful of games in his first several seasons. It's a silly comparison to make because of the difference between the positions, but you can't pretend like Young did much early on.

It'll be interesting to watch him tonight, and the next few weeks, because from everything I've read he's had a very good camp.

 

[dre1614]

Didn't Carp have a very good playoff game vs Seattle 2 years ago?

 

[Alexander]

All but a handful of games in his first several seasons.

For Young to have been even close to the disappointment Carpenter has been he'd have to have ridden the bench from day one of his professional career. He started for Tampa Bay and also started nine times in three seasons for San Francisco. It was a completely uninformated and pathetic attempt to excuse Carpenter's failure by invoking the name of a Hall Of Famer.

It's a silly comparison to make because of the difference between the positions, but you can't pretend like Young did much early on.

You also can't pretend the Steve Young case has any relation to having hope for Carpenter. Young did more. So it isn't a silly comparison. It was completely ignorant.

 

[theogt]

For Young to have been even close to the disappointment Carpenter has been he'd have to have ridden the bench from day one of his professional career. He started for Tampa Bay and also started nine times in three seasons for San Francisco. It was a completely uninformated and pathetic attempt to excuse Carpenter's failure by invoking the name of a Hall Of Famer.

Some might say that consistently putting up QB ratings in the 30s, 40s, and 50s is worse than not starting at all.

You also can't pretend the Steve Young case has any relation to having hope for Carpenter. Young did more. So it isn't a silly comparison. It was completely ignorant.

Obviously, you're just talking out of your *** here. It's relevant in that it shows that players can develop. The comparison was used to show how someone can perform so poorly in early years (and not even see the field for the most part), yet go on to be a HOFer. It's just a bad comparison because the curve is quite a bit different for each position.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Isnt this the same guy who created HAVOC in playoff game vs. Seattle... IN HIS FIRST YEAR?

I aint writing this kid off... besides Romo likes him and hangs out with him :laugh2:

 

[Achozen]

It was Bradie not Bobby

That's a made up quote that Jason Witten was saying last year. (To Bobby)

It's a spin off from the Bradie quote.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

That's a made up quote that Jason Witten was saying last year. (To Bobby)

It's a spin off from the Bradie quote.

lol what?

you think youre gonna get away with making up quotes from the Cowboys on a Cowboys board?

 

[tomson75]

I vote Matt off of my island.

 

[Achozen]

lol what?

you think youre gonna get away with making up quotes from the Cowboys on a Cowboys board?

It was a joke.
Damn. Some of you need to... :shoot6: