Finding Romo's Replacement

[Galian Beast]

How is that a " straw man" argument?

When you assume an argument for someone that they never made, just because it is easier to defeat that argument, that is a straw man.

I never said finding a future qb was a binary situation. I think there are many avenues, but I think one of the worst is drafting a guy while Romo is still extremely productive.

 

[Idgit]

1 and a half years worth of snaps. Thats when both Romo and Rodgers got extended ( not counting Romo's 2 year deal in 2016)

They really need to let teams carry a third QB at all times. If we think we like Vaughan, he ought to get all the preseason snaps we can give him other than what absolutely need to get Romo ready.

And if we had the extra mid rounder, I'd have rather spent that at QB than on a RB. Don't see much point in the Weeden experiment right now. The only thing he gives you is the starters snaps he got for being overdrafted in CLE. Those snaps are valuable. If Romo goes down, I'd rather give them to the second year young player and hope he's got something. And use the other QB spot for a legitimate alternative if he does not. A 30 year old stopgap is too expensive to carry and develop. Even if you hit, you're still in the market for another franchise QB.

 

[Galian Beast]

He team also hasnt drafted a QB before the 4th round in 17 years. They haven't exactly tried

But other teams have, and they've mostly failed...

 

[ThreeandOut]

With the spread offenses being so popular now in college, I think its even more likely that you're going to see more NFL quarterbacks sitting the bench the first couple of years. Most of these players need a couple of years to learn things that they are not taught in college.

 

[Hardline]

Heck ..Why not increase your odds and use every draft pick you have for QBs?

 

[darthseinfeld]

When you assume an argument for someone that they never made, just because it is easier to defeat that argument, that is a straw man.

I never said finding a future qb was a binary situation. I think there are many avenues, but I think one of the worst is drafting a guy while Romo is still extremely productive.

I was making a logical response to your statement that the alternative to grooming a QB behind Romo is drafting one when he retires.

The other alternatives youve stated are to trade for a future franchised player ( of which I haven't seen any candidates, or hope for stroke of amazing luck like a Manning or Bree's situation

 

[burmafrd]

Like with all other positions, the odds are worse > round 1

But there are 8 QBs currently in the league that have won a SB.
5 were 1st rounders (Manning , Manning, Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Flacco
3 were not 1st rounders (Brady, Brees, Wilson)

Brees was the first pick in the 2nd rd so frankly that is reaching. Wilson frankly does not belong- he might yet develope into the real Franchize QB but he is not there yet.
So that leaves Brady. vs how many QBs since 2001 have been drafted after the first rd and have done what?

 

[theogt]

That new QB would be ready to take over? NFL Draft history shows that they are more likely to not be ready, and worse, they would be more expensive given their rookie contract would be up.

Going back to the well? Now you want to draft yet another quarterback, taking MORE resources away for Romo, the actual franchise qb...

Nonsensical indeed.

Yes, finding a QB takes resources. Your plan would be disastrous for this franchise over the long term. You should probably re-read my post because it's clear you misunderstood it.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Here is a stat. 7 of the top 12 QBs in passer rating last year didn't start as rookies. 6 of 11 if you discount Fitsgerald

Romo, Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Rivers, Palmer

 

[viman96]

When nearly every starting qb in the NFL is a 1st round draft pick... The odds of finding a qb outside the first round are extremely slim. But don't let reality bother you.

You said, "reading is important", right?

 

[DFWJC]

Brees was the first pick in the 2nd rd so frankly that is reaching. Wilson frankly does not belong- he might yet develope into the real Franchize QB but he is not there yet.
So that leaves Brady. vs how many QBs since 2001 have been drafted after the first rd and have done what?

Hey, I'm not calling any of these guys franchise QBs or not.
You mentioned Super Bowl winning QBs and all I did was list the active ones.

Dilfer was a 1st round SB winning QB and he certainly doesn't qualify as a franchise guy,IMO.
He's out of the league, so not on the list

 

[Crown Royal]

I believe that you build the best possible team so that the transition between your current franchise player and next QB is as seamless as possible.

I'm also of the opinion that Age of the QB is going to give way for a while here soon. Not to say that you don't need good QB pay, but I think the position has become ever so slightly overvalued.

 

[Alexander]

It is not just getting the QB, it is about developing them and being patient with them.

Does anyone actually think that without the patience by Bill Parcells and the continued support from ownership to keep Romo that he would have turned out like he did being some undrafted rookie?

Bill Parcells believed in Romo and didn’t turn up the pressure too soon and they had a good base of talent capable of helping him when he was ready. He was handled in a way that you likely will never see happen again, at least for that length of time. In many cases, a player like Romo would have either been traded to New Orleans or cut rather than be committed to like he was before he even became a starter.

This is about time. It is almost a case of marinating. Depending on the talent, you can but you need to marinate first. There needs to be buffer time unless you are getting a once in a lifetime prospect like Manning or Luck at the top. Most of the time you see bad teams taking these QBs at the top without the proper coaching and development teams in place to aid the player who is going to take over what is the hardest job in the NFL.

Romo also got quality coaching from David Lee to start his career and that addressed a lot of flaws. I do not have a single bit of faith in Wade Wilson do develop anyone, he has never done it in any stop he has been at, but that is another story. The coaching and patience, and the right scheme once he does play helps a great deal.

And no, waiting until Romo is done and gone is not the right solution. All that does is puts the pressure immediately to rush that player into being the franchise QB he was drafted sooner than later. And as we have seen with tons of QBs fail when thrust into that. Take them, often, and continue to throw talent at it until successful. In the meantime, you might be able to pawn on some of that QB talent into a few draft choices along the way.

That is what made Ron Wolf and the Packer formula doubly successful. And even that was hard even with people like Holmgren, Gruden and Andy Reid on the staff. But it is an organizational commitment, nearly every year, even when you have the franchise, to plan and cultivate for the future.

I see why we started looking in earnest this draft, even with a mediocre class. It will need to be a necessity next April.

 

[Crown Royal]

It is not just getting the QB, it is about developing them and being patient with them.

Does anyone actually think that without the patience by Bill Parcells and the continued support from ownership to keep Romo that he would have turned out like he did being some undrafted rookie?

Bill Parcells believed in Romo and didn’t turn up the pressure too soon and they had a good base of talent capable of helping him when he was ready. He was handled in a way that you likely will never see happen again, at least for that length of time. In many cases, a player like Romo would have either been traded to New Orleans or cut rather than be committed to like he was before he even became a starter.

This is about time. It is almost a case of marinating. Depending on the talent, you can but you need to marinate first. There needs to be buffer time unless you are getting a once in a lifetime prospect like Manning or Luck at the top. Most of the time you see bad teams taking these QBs at the top without the proper coaching and development teams in place to aid the player who is going to take over what is the hardest job in the NFL.

Romo also got quality coaching from David Lee to start his career and that addressed a lot of flaws. I do not have a single bit of faith in Wade Wilson do develop anyone, he has never done it in any stop he has been at, but that is another story. The coaching and patience, and the right scheme once he does play helps a great deal.

And no, waiting until Romo is done and gone is not the right solution. All that does is puts the pressure immediately to rush that player into being the franchise QB he was drafted sooner than later. And as we have seen with tons of QBs fail when thrust into that. Take them, often, and continue to throw talent at it until successful. In the meantime, you might be able to pawn on some of that QB talent into a few draft choices along the way.

That is what made Ron Wolf and the Packer formula doubly successful. And even that was hard even with people like Holmgren, Gruden and Andy Reid on the staff. But it is an organizational commitment, nearly every year, even when you have the franchise, to plan and cultivate for the future.

I see why we started looking in earnest this draft, even with a mediocre class. It will need to be a necessity next April.

I think Sean Peyton gets some credit too.

 

[TwoDeep3]

A lot of people seem to be fixated on finding Romo's replacement. I understand the feeling after what happened with Troy Aikman, but I think the sentiment is mistaken.

First, I think the best chance we have to win is by giving Romo every resource we have in terms of draft picks. A franchise QB gives you the best chance to win a super bowl. A rookie quarterback on the bench doesn't help Romo.

Second let me address this issue. The salary cap. This isn't the 90's nor is it the early 2000's. The best aspect of having a rookie QB is to have them play for you for cheap so you can give that player a better team with the money you aren't spending on them. You used to be able to sign rookies for 6 years before you had to pay them. Now you can only get them for 4 years before you have to pay them. Note the 5th year option is basically the franchise tag, not quite as expensive, but none the less... It is 16 million dollars next year.

The next point takes me to the high level of nfl busts drafted in the first round. The bust rate is higher than 50%

Rather than draft a rookie quarterback EARLY and have them sit while Romo continues to improve as a player, I would rather sign a veteran qb in their 6th year even if they receive the franchise tag.

I'd rather give up two first round draft picks for a sure thing at QB and pay the player a veteran salary, than draft a quarterback in the first round HOPE he turns out good and sit him for 3-4 years and then pay him a veteran salary anyways....

The game has changed and your way of thinking needs to change with it.

Teams are destroyed by first round QB busts. And you would probably have us spend 2 to 3 first round draft picks on the position trying to find a proper legitimate successor to Romo.

It really worries me that part of your strategy for replacing Romo is just hoping that we find a great quarterback in the first round on our first try, despite the fact that teams across the league fail at this at a high percentage. Most drafts have 0 franchise quarterbacks, some have 1, and very very few have 2 or more, but magically we will get it done because?

First, the bolded areasin your post I find interesting.

The bust rate is 50%. I'd imagine that is the case for most positions.

First try? So how about all the skill positions. Do you worry about first try with them?

This is not so much about Romo's skills set diminishing as it is about continuity if and when they do.
The youth this team has right now on the offensive line, and their ability to be really good for a long while indicates you need to capitalize on this.

My example here is pretty evident to me. You have a great line and mediocre talent at running back. All the woulda, shoulda, coulda about these bench warmers is meaningless until they prove they can function in all three aspects of the running back position.

Rushing
Passing
Blocking

I keep seeing the assurances they can accomplish these tasks. To be determined.

So why would you waste a segment of the front lines life in the game by rolling the dice and passing if opportunity presents itself?

Well you would if you talk yourself out of it because of fear of failure.

The surest way to fail is not to try at all.

 

[Alexander]

I think Sean Peyton gets some credit too.

Cannot deny that. By the time he left, the work they put into him was pretty much ready. That is why he wanted him in trade and why the team was smart to turn him down.

 

[sbark]

They really need to let teams carry a third QB at all times. If we think we like Vaughan, he ought to get all the preseason snaps we can give him other than what absolutely need to get Romo ready.

And if we had the extra mid rounder, I'd have rather spent that at QB than on a RB. Don't see much point in the Weeden experiment right now. The only thing he gives you is the starters snaps he got for being overdrafted in CLE. Those snaps are valuable. If Romo goes down, I'd rather give them to the second year young player and hope he's got something. And use the other QB spot for a legitimate alternative if he does not. A 30 year old stopgap is too expensive to carry and develop. Even if you hit, you're still in the market for another franchise QB.

The entire NFL marketing scheme is about scoring, especially big highlights via the passing game, and yet they constrict themselves by limiting development of QB's. Each team should be able to protect a developing QB on a practice squad, which long term should enhance the number of teams with competent qB's.. Now long until the Patriots find a grey area to exploit would be the question............

 

[burmafrd]

It is not just getting the QB, it is about developing them and being patient with them.

Does anyone actually think that without the patience by Bill Parcells and the continued support from ownership to keep Romo that he would have turned out like he did being some undrafted rookie?

Bill Parcells believed in Romo and didn’t turn up the pressure too soon and they had a good base of talent capable of helping him when he was ready. He was handled in a way that you likely will never see happen again, at least for that length of time. In many cases, a player like Romo would have either been traded to New Orleans or cut rather than be committed to like he was before he even became a starter.

This is about time. It is almost a case of marinating. Depending on the talent, you can but you need to marinate first. There needs to be buffer time unless you are getting a once in a lifetime prospect like Manning or Luck at the top. Most of the time you see bad teams taking these QBs at the top without the proper coaching and development teams in place to aid the player who is going to take over what is the hardest job in the NFL.

Romo also got quality coaching from David Lee to start his career and that addressed a lot of flaws. I do not have a single bit of faith in Wade Wilson do develop anyone, he has never done it in any stop he has been at, but that is another story. The coaching and patience, and the right scheme once he does play helps a great deal.

And no, waiting until Romo is done and gone is not the right solution. All that does is puts the pressure immediately to rush that player into being the franchise QB he was drafted sooner than later. And as we have seen with tons of QBs fail when thrust into that. Take them, often, and continue to throw talent at it until successful. In the meantime, you might be able to pawn on some of that QB talent into a few draft choices along the way.

That is what made Ron Wolf and the Packer formula doubly successful. And even that was hard even with people like Holmgren, Gruden and Andy Reid on the staff. But it is an organizational commitment, nearly every year, even when you have the franchise, to plan and cultivate for the future.

I see why we started looking in earnest this draft, even with a mediocre class. It will need to be a necessity next April.

Packer formula? It worked ONCE. Romo was a true lottey win and no other way to put it.
Bottom line is that the only way that has any decent odds is to use a first round pick. And pray.

 

[EPL0c0]

Call off the dogs, we found him. Jameill Showers. Search is over.

(yes, I'm a UTEP alum and homer )

 

[Galian Beast]

First, the bolded areasin your post I find interesting.

The bust rate is 50%. I'd imagine that is the case for most positions.

First try? So how about all the skill positions. Do you worry about first try with them?

This is not so much about Romo's skills set diminishing as it is about continuity if and when they do.
The youth this team has right now on the offensive line, and their ability to be really good for a long while indicates you need to capitalize on this.

My example here is pretty evident to me. You have a great line and mediocre talent at running back. All the woulda, shoulda, coulda about these bench warmers is meaningless until they prove they can function in all three aspects of the running back position.

Rushing
Passing
Blocking

I keep seeing the assurances they can accomplish these tasks. To be determined.

So why would you waste a segment of the front lines life in the game by rolling the dice and passing if opportunity presents itself?

Well you would if you talk yourself out of it because of fear of failure.

The surest way to fail is not to try at all.

Again, I'm not saying that you don't get a quarterback, I'm saying timing is extremely important and the resources you use up to the point in which romo retires is also important.

Resources used to help Romo win now, will also help a qb win who replaces him.

But most importantly is you don't keep wasting picks on QBs hoping to hit the lottery. That directly reduces Romo's ability to win now.