For those unhappy with Rob's firing...

[unionjack8]

For the record, I am defending Garrett's work as an OC. I see it as the biggest non issue ever. A fan crutch for avoiding talking about the lack of talent up front. An OC hire does nothing to improve the team. Similar to how Callahan replacing Houck did nothing.

What about the issues when ha had 3 pro bowlers for three straight years, including a 1st team all pro and a second team one.
Flo, Gurode and Davis?

 

[Risen Star]

i disagree wholeheartedy RS, however i have read enough of your posts to know that you admit when you are wrong

so, if we hire a new OC (with playcalling responsibilities) and do better as an offense (bottom line score more points not yards) will you give up on defending Garrett?

i believe his system and playcalling are a significant part of the problem

Depends. Did we also add some significant pieces to the OL? Because I would attribute the improvement to that over the OC and play caller.

 

[visionary]

Depends. Did we also add some significant pieces to the OL? Because I would attribute the improvement to that over the OC and play caller.

fair enough, i think we will (and should) upgrade the OL so maybe we will never know for sure

 

[big dog cowboy]

Firing Ryan and keeping Garrett makes zero sense.

The movie isn't over yet.

 

[Shinywalrus]

the actual position held by me, and many like me, is the head coach has to have the authority to pick who he wants.

If Garrett loses his play calling against his wishes, I would not support that.

Those that do put way too much stock in the opinion of the GM.

This is a fair point, but is there a middle ground where Jason considers and admits that he's just trying to do too much right now and gives it up willingly?

People might say it was Jerry's decision, and there may be something in that, but I don't know that it's fair to draw that conclusion.

 

[AKATheRake]

The movie isn't over yet.

Good, it shouldn't be.

 

[Redball Express]

...because Garrett's offense was more of the problem, here is something to consider. This also addresses those concerned that Ryan's firing was Jerry firing him out from under Garrett.

Let's say, for argument's sake, that Jerry and Garrett looked at the season and agreed that BOTH offense and defense were awful and big changes were needed.
Step one would be to fire the respective coordinators and hire replacements, right?
Okay, so head coach Garrett fires Rob Ryan, and in the days to come will hire his replacement.

But is head coach Garrett supposed to release a press statement firing OC Garrett? "We appreciate OC Garrett and all his efforts the past few years but we've decided to move in a different direction?"

I submit that, since head coach Garrett is staying, that all he has to do is hire the new OC, and the firing will have happened. He doesn't have to fire himself publicly, no matter how much some might enjoy seeing it.

If I was in Garrett's position, I would do it just like this. Fire Rob, hire new DC, and hire new OC then announce that the new OC is calling plays.

A lot of you are mad at other posters, thinking that if they are happy Rob is gone, it means they like the job Jason was doing at OC. I have seen very few if any posters defend Garrett at OC. It's Garrett the head coach that many, including myself, want to keep. I REALLY want a new OC, though, and I see no reason to believe we won't get one.

Garrett as the OC/HC isn't going to fire himself.

He's set up in the organization wearing two hats identically like Jerry Jones as owner and GM.

So there is the bottle-neck.

Sure, making changes on the defensive side is alot easier than doing on the offensive side where Red rules.

Thing about it, I never thought Ryan was RedBalls choice. Therefore, it's not on Garrett we should pound but on Jerry. Now that it's being corrected..it's imperative whoever gets hired for DC it MUST be a choice made by Garrett.

Not Jones.

The DC must be accountable to Garrett not Jerry Jones.

DO that and maybe we progress going forward.

If we could get a quinella out of this and also get a doable OC in place to help Garrett get Romo put back together as well as the OL and running game and playcalling..

oh goodness..that's alot of help Garrett needs from an OC isn't it..?

Better we just get a whole new HC instead.

Back to square one, folks.

Never mind.

:starspin RedBaLL ExPreSS:starspin

 

[Eric_Boyer]

For the record, I am defending Garrett's work as an OC. I see it as the biggest non issue ever. A fan crutch for avoiding talking about the lack of talent up front. An OC hire does nothing to improve the team. Similar to how Callahan replacing Houck did nothing.

I feel the same way.

 

[Risen Star]

I feel the same way.

We share a foxhole. We'll sleep in shifts.

 

[Beast_from_East]

...because Garrett's offense was more of the problem, here is something to consider. This also addresses those concerned that Ryan's firing was Jerry firing him out from under Garrett.

Let's say, for argument's sake, that Jerry and Garrett looked at the season and agreed that BOTH offense and defense were awful and big changes were needed.
Step one would be to fire the respective coordinators and hire replacements, right?
Okay, so head coach Garrett fires Rob Ryan, and in the days to come will hire his replacement.

But is head coach Garrett supposed to release a press statement firing OC Garrett? "We appreciate OC Garrett and all his efforts the past few years but we've decided to move in a different direction?"

I submit that, since head coach Garrett is staying, that all he has to do is hire the new OC, and the firing will have happened. He doesn't have to fire himself publicly, no matter how much some might enjoy seeing it.

If I was in Garrett's position, I would do it just like this. Fire Rob, hire new DC, and hire new OC then announce that the new OC is calling plays.

A lot of you are mad at other posters, thinking that if they are happy Rob is gone, it means they like the job Jason was doing at OC. I have seen very few if any posters defend Garrett at OC. It's Garrett the head coach that many, including myself, want to keep. I REALLY want a new OC, though, and I see no reason to believe we won't get one.

You may have a point, Garrett the OC may be getting fired as well (meaning somebody else is going to call the plays next year).

If this is the case, I got no problem with Garrett getting one more year as a walk around head coach. However, I make it perfectly clear to him that if we do not make the playoffs next season he is gone, no questions asked.

 

[Miller]

You may have a point, Garrett the OC may be getting fired as well (meaning somebody else is going to call the plays next year).

If this is the case, I got no problem with Garrett getting one more year as a walk around head coach. However, I make it perfectly clear to him that if we do not make the playoffs next season he is gone, no questions asked.

I go with this more than anything. I am not a great fan of Garrett as HC but I think if there is room for improvement than he has to let go of play calling. I keep seeing the Kubiak reference..which I disagree with..but even he gave controls to young Shanahan for a year.

 

[Doc50]

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and say that the organization has become convinced that JG is a leader in the Tom Landry mold. It therefore makes sense that they keep the head coach, but bring in an OC so that he can focus only on leading, and do that while changing DC's so that it has some symmetry.

We really could be heading in the right direction.

 

[DFWJC]

I'm not here to defend Garrett as OC--I'd prefer he didn't have the dual role.

But the bottom line is :

Total Offense: 6th in the league
Scoring offense: 15th

Total Defense: 19th
Scoring Defense: 23rd


This is after the Cowboys spent 50 mil on Carr and the first 5 draft picks (and 6 of 8) on defense

Top 2 picks for Claiborne
3rd pick for Crawford
4th pick for Wilber
5th pick for Johnson
7th for McSurdy

 

[bracey]

I'm not here to defend Garrett as OC--I'd prefer he didn't have the dual role.

But the bottom line is :

Total Offense: 6th in the league
Scoring offense: 15th

Total Defense: 19th
Scoring Defense: 23rd

And if the team is using anything that simplistic to make their decisions, we are doomed.

 

[ufcrules1]

And if the team is using anything that simplistic to make their decisions, we are doomed.

Haha.. bingo! Just goes to show you how stats can can be skewed just about any way. What have the constants been here there last 7 years? Maybe we should be looking at those guys a LOT harder.

 

[Miller]

And if the team is using anything that simplistic to make their decisions, we are doomed.

Agree. I just put this in another thread but I believe we set a record for 4th quarter scoring the last 5-6 games. So the first few quarters of games we struggling and depending on the defense to keep us in games and then we make our either successful or failed comebacks in the 4th. That skews the numbers. The defense wasn't always successful but they kept us in games at times...especially with the early struggles the O had.

 

[DFWJC]

And if the team is using anything that simplistic to make their decisions, we are doomed.

I agree.

But we are talking Jerry here.

Just bottom line numbers. Kind of like wins and losses are the ultimate bottom line numbers. There's way more, of course, that goes into it.
I thought Ryan had those guys playing their hearts out down the stretch. They still were not good, but then again, they weren't true starters either.

I not really defending Ryan or Garrett here, just dropping some bottom line numbers that surely Jerry is aware of after spending a fortune both in the draft and via FA on defesne.

 

[Everlastingxxx]

I'm not here to defend Garrett as OC--I'd prefer he didn't have the dual role.

But the bottom line is :

Total Offense: 6th in the league
Scoring offense: 15th

Total Defense: 19th
Scoring Defense: 23rd


This is after the Cowboys spent 50 mil on Carr and the first 5 draft picks (and 6 of 8) on defense

Top 2 picks for Claiborne
3rd pick for Crawford
4th pick for Wilber
5th pick for Johnson
7th for McSurdy

I am sure Garrett presented those same stats to Jerry and said “See i am doing my job, but he is holding us back, fire him!”

Nevermind the season before the defense was basically ignored.

 

[BrassCowboy]

They're the ones who make life so difficult on those of us who share your opinion, as I do. I'm not thrilled about Garrett - not fully bought in as a Head Coach - but I do think there's evidence that he's just overwhelmed with the various responsibilities, and that his skills and strengths better suit focusing on developing the team's personnel, culture and organization.

Check any thread on Jason's gameday management and you'll find a couple dozen defenders of that dimension.

Anyway, good post.

yeah I kinda think like you. I do not feel he is very good at managing his gametime situations and I do question his job at team preparation for gametime situations, but I feel his playcalling is so much worse.

My opinion is we should get both a head coach and an offensive coordinator, but we absolutely must get an OC atleast.

 

[DandyDon1722]

I get this, however, I ask myself if Jason Garrett isn't being retained as a OC then why the heck is he even here in the 1st place? He supposed genius offensive mind is the whole reason why we were told he was a good HC candidate.

If you hire a playcalling OC (in addition to a DC) what is left that JG is particularly good at?

I'll be honest, I've never understood the whole "emasculation of Garrett" if they bring in an OC. Rip on the process all you want but we saw a different team in December than we have in previous years. I think there are building blocks in place.

However, I am in agreement with most of you that he is in over his head in a variety of ways. So let him be the head coach, let his process continue with experienced coordinators and see what happens for a year.

Worked for Jimmy didn't it?