Greg Ellis now becomes our DE again...

[Spectre]

It takes 2 years for a young player to return from an achilles injury. Ellis will be a 3rd down situational DE pass rusher next year. He will not play in the 3-4 OLB spot, and probably will not ever again.

yup


achilles injuries are among the absolute worst.

I had one... never been the same since.
And mine was probably minor compared to Ellis.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

I think Greg might get traded to Denver yet, between Denver and the Skins both seem to love Dallas's older linemen. Canty I gave a pass to last season and I have much higher expectations for this upcoming season.

No team in their right mind will trade for a 32-year old DE/OLB coming off an achilles injury. I think Greg Ellis might get cut this year if he doesn't recover in time for training camp.

 

[BouncingCheese]

yup


achilles injuries are among the absolute worst.

I had one... never been the same since.
And mine was probably minor compared to Ellis.

what "has never been the same since"?

I am just curious to know if there is any lingering effects for you.

 

[Spectre]

what "has never been the same since"?

I am just curious to know if there is any lingering effects for you.

?

Haven't been able to turn the foot without pain in the heel since.

 

[BouncingCheese]

?

Haven't been able to turn the foot without pain in the heel since.

oh..damn...ouch

 

[Rack]

Greg Ellis now becomes our DE again...

No, he won't. He's still our SOLB.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

No, he won't. He's still our SOLB.

Correction, Ellis will be our situational SOLB, I believe Spencer will start.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Ellis can still play at a very high level, nothing from reporters or Wade has indicated that hes rehabing slowly. Our defense's solid play was a direct reflection of Ellis being on the field, when we lost our leader - Jon Kitna became a comedian. Its no coincidence either, Ellis even as a 3-4 OLB was the heart and soul of our defense.

I look at Spencer as more of an insurance policy for Ellis, not an immediate replacement. We all saw how Bobby Carpenter looked last year, Spencer will be no different - it takes a while to adjust to the game.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

Ellis can still play at a very high level, nothing from reporters or Wade has indicated that hes rehabing slowly. Our defense's solid play was a direct reflection of Ellis being on the field, when we lost our leader - Jon Kitna became a comedian. Its no coincidence either, Ellis even as a 3-4 OLB was the heart and soul of our defense.

I look at Spencer as more of an insurance policy for Ellis, not an immediate replacement. We all saw how Bobby Carpenter looked last year, Spencer will be no different - it takes a while to adjust to the game.

You are wrong, Spencer is a pass rush specialist who will start opposite of Ware. Carpenter is no where as physical as Spencer and doesn't have the pass rush moves either!

 

[Apollo Creed]

You are wrong, Spencer is a pass rush specialist who will start opposite of Ware. Carpenter is no where as physical as Spencer and doesn't have the pass rush moves either!

So you think its as easy as Ware and Spencer just putting their head's down and rushing each play? He is going to have to make a big adjustment, and he might even have to cover WRs. Is Spencer ready for that kind of role?

Don't speak negatively about Carpenter around here, you know better than that.

 

[Rack]

So you think its as easy as Ware and Spencer just putting their head's down and rushing each play? He is going to have to make a big adjustment, and he might even have to cover WRs. Is Spencer ready for that kind of role?

Don't speak negatively about Carpenter around here, you know better than that.

Some "people" feel the need to criticize one player in order to "hype up" another player. It's ridiculous. Spencer may - or may not - be a better pass rusher next season, but no doubt Carp will be the better LB.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

Anyone else think that since we got Anthony Spencer, he is going to replace Greg Ellis at OLB and play a Demarcus Ware type role and Greg Ellis is going to become our starting defensive end? I would imagine Ellis would start over Canty or Spears and there would possibly be a rotation. Thoughts?

No. No. No. And No.

If we're lucky enough to get him back, he gets moved around in a rotation and attacks from the DL or LB... or even, DT.

Gotta love the guy's versatility. Not to say he won't play DE, but he'll move around. Wade will mix it up quite a bit.

If he's healthy and we can use him, he's not going anywhere.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

There answer is no. Ellis can't play a 3-4 DE. There is no way he would start over Spears or Canty even if he could.

I highly disagree.

 

[Rack]

I highly disagree.

Then you're highly incorrect.


As a 3-4 DE, Ellis can't hold Spears' or Canty's jock. He's pretty much said himself he can't play DE in that defense.


As a 4-3 DE, I'd take Ellis over Spears for sure. Not sure on Canty.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

Ellis is too small to be an every-down 3-4 end... Spencer is too much of a specimen, maybe more than D-Ware coming out of college, to let him sit in obvious passing downs. Spencer will SOOO replace whoever is opposite D-Ware. Funny, a few months ago I was concerned that we were letting go of al singleton, now we have so many talented guys I don't know if we can give all of them any reps...seriously, what are we going to do with burnett for example? I think he has the physical tools, but to do what, I have no idea in this D. I hope Wade Phillips is salivating right now at all the things he can do. Damn I am getting amped just thinking of my own stupid diabolical ideas haha.

I'm sure that we can negotiate some sort of trade if we get stacked with too much depth.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

Some "people" feel the need to criticize one player in order to "hype up" another player. It's ridiculous. Spencer may - or may not - be a better pass rusher next season, but no doubt Carp will be the better LB.

If "Carp" is sooooo good why did Dallas feel the need to trade back into the first round to get Spencer? Bottom line is Carpenter is better suited to play inside and nickel...

 

[Ben_n_austin]

Then you're highly incorrect.


As a 3-4 DE, Ellis can't hold Spears' or Canty's jock. He's pretty much said himself he can't play DE in that defense.


As a 4-3 DE, I'd take Ellis over Spears for sure. Not sure on Canty.

Incorrect according to you. But I think Ellis can actually clog the lane pretty well. Granted, Spears is somewhat of a lane clogger or defensive tackle type. But he's a tub but and lacks mobility that is necessary. Even for a 3-4 type linebacker, Spears is slow and somewhat ineffective at times if you pay attention closely.

Now Canty I think has the athleticism of Ellis, but he's kind of an upright player and really hasn't shined at all at the 3-4 DE position. In fact, I think that he's been a disappointment - same goes for Spears.

And while Canty may be athletic, I don't see much that Canty can do that Ellis doesn't. Ellis definitely has the stats to back up the notion that he could probably play any position on the defensive front.

Saying that I'm highly incorrect is nonsense, particularly since all of this is merely conjecture. And Ellis has handled quite a few offensive linemen. His experience gives him the edge.

Don't forget this post when you see him line up at multiple positions, including defensive end, if he does indeed return healthy.

 

[Rack]

Incorrect according to you. But I think Ellis can actually clog the lane pretty well. Granted, Spears is somewhat of a lane clogger or defensive tackle type. But he's a tub but and lacks mobility that is necessary. Even for a 3-4 type linebacker, Spears is slow and somewhat ineffective at times if you pay attention closely.

Now Canty I think has the athleticism of Ellis, but he's kind of an upright player and really hasn't shined at all at the 3-4 DE position. In fact, I think that he's been a disappointment - same goes for Spears.

And while Canty may be athletic, I don't see much that Canty can do that Ellis doesn't. Ellis definitely has the stats to back up the notion that he could probably play any position on the defensive front.

Saying that I'm highly incorrect is nonsense, particularly since all of this is merely conjecture. And Ellis has handled quite a few offensive linemen. His experience gives him the edge.

Don't forget this post when you see him line up at multiple positions, including defensive end, if he does indeed return healthy.

And according to Ellis himself.

And he might play some DE this year, but it won't be when we line up in a 3-4.

I think he'd be a better DE in Wade's 3-4 then in BP's 3-4, but still not as good as Spears and Canty.


And about this...

Even for a 3-4 type linebacker, Spears is slow and somewhat ineffective at times if you pay attention closely.

Huh? Spears doesn't play Linebacker.

 

[Ben_n_austin]

And according to Ellis himself.

And he might play some DE this year, but it won't be when we line up in a 3-4.

I think he'd be a better DE in Wade's 3-4 then in BP's 3-4, but still not as good as Spears and Canty.


And about this...



Huh? Spears doesn't play Linebacker.

Yeah, I know that. My mistake. That's not what I meant. But I we also have Hatcher... and I think that Greg Ellis actually can play the 3-4 as good, if not better than Spears, Hatcher and Canty (if healthy), particularly if they were in a rotation - even in the 3-4. Greg Ellis is a play maker. And he can clog up the middle.

You're comparing Canty and Spears, guys who have pretty much done nothing, to Greg Ellis. That's silly. Greg Ellis is a team player. So he said those guys could play their positions better than him. When it was all said and done, Greg had more production as an outside linebacker - a position that MANY said that he wasn't suited for.

As Parcells once said, it's about being a better football player. Not some guy who can only play one position.

We'll have to agree to disagree here. But I think you're entirely off base. Ellis is the one guy that can play outside linebacker or defensive end. Just like I think that Spears can play DE in a 3-4 or a DT in a 3-4 or 4-3....

I just think you underestimate Ellis' obvious talents, whether he says something or not about what he can do. He smoked both players as far as production last year.

He's been known to be a modest guy. I'll let Greg's actions, aka statistics, speak louder than his words.

 

[Rack]

and I think that Greg Ellis actually can play the 3-4 as good, if not better than Spears, Hatcher and Canty (if healthy), particularly if they were in a rotation - even in the 3-4. Greg Ellis is a play maker. And he can clog up the middle.

No, he can't... by his OWN admission. If he says he doesn't fit DE in that Defense, then I'm pretty sure he doesn't fit DE in that defense. You have more confidence in him then he has in himself.

You're comparing Canty and Spears, guys who have pretty much done nothing, to Greg Ellis. That's silly. Greg Ellis is a team player. So he said those guys could play their positions better than him. When it was all said and done, Greg had more production as an outside linebacker - a position that MANY said that he wasn't suited for.

You're comparing what Ellis has done in the past - and in the 4-3 - to what Canty and Spears do in a 3-4. Extremely silly.

On average, 3-4 DEs don't put up the numbers that 4-3 DEs put up. So you're remembering all these "Plays" Ellis made while in the 4-3 and wondering why our THREE-FOUR DEs aren't putting up the same numbers. Simple, 3-4 DEs usually DON'T put up as big of numbers as 4-3 DEs (sound like a broken record?).

As Parcells once said, it's about being a better football player. Not some guy who can only play one position.

Funny you mention Parcells... he's the guy that moved Ellis to OLB ... in the 3-4. I guess that man you so admire also didn't feel Ellis could play DE in the 3-4.

We'll have to agree to disagree here. But I think you're entirely off base. Ellis is the one guy that can play outside linebacker or defensive end. Just like I think that Spears can play DE in a 3-4 or a DT in a 3-4 or 4-3....

He can play 3-4 OLB or 4-3 DE, but not 4-3 OLB or 3-4 DE.

I just think you underestimate Ellis' obvious talents, whether he says something or not about what he can do. He smoked both players as far as production last year.

Pretty much an ignorant statement being that Ellis played OUTSIDE LINEBACKER last year and both Canty and Spears played DEFENSIVE END... in the 3-4.

By the way, 3-4 Outside Linebackers usually put up bigger numbers then 3-4 DEs.

He's been known to be a modest guy. I'll let Greg's actions, aka statistics, speak louder than his words.

His "actions" (aka stats) are irrelevent being that they are either from him playing DE in a 4-3 or OLB in a 3-4. He played half a season as a DE in the 3-4 (and played most as just a nickel rusher about halfway through the season).