Has anything changed?

[RoyTheHammer]

Nice post, Dhargon.

I have to say that I see some of the same things you do in your #5. Haven't seen anyone else say that before, but I've felt it for a while.

I guess we both have to hope Hell has Sunday Ticket.

I've been saying for awhile that he sounds like a robot. Honestly, its half jokingly, but the frequency with which he repeats his "go to" couple phrases is ridiculous. If you're going to speak like a puppet or tape recording all the time then you better win ALOT of football games, that's all i can say. You don't win, it goes from impressive to strange real quick.

 

[Dodger]

LOL, I was wondering if anyone would take a swing at that softball pitch.

Here are what in my eyes are reasons not to keep Jason Garrett as HC all in one place, free of charge:

1) Red benefited from the spike in a team's attention when the HC was fired (Wade). Just like when Leslie Frasier took over in Minnesota, the players recognized their own career mortality and the next few games they played their A-game. We all saw how good this team COULD play in those first few games, beating the Giants, the Colts and almost the Saints.

That established what this team is capable of. Now fast forward to the last few games. Where we won or almost won against playoff caliber teams, we now can't even win against the very worst teams. I guarantee that team playing against the Giants, Colts and Saints would not have lost or even been in a close game against the Skins or the Cardinals.

The team has lost its edge again. A great coach could have maintained that level our team achieved. Red has not. The team which could beat the Giants and Colts is no more. Now they cannot beat the lowly Cards. I want a coach which can get and maintain the best in our team. Sue me.

2) Red has not even now fully learned the OC job. How long will it take him to learn to be a HC well enough to win a Superbowl? Probably several years at best.

I truly feel Romo is a top notch QB capable of winning a Superbowl if we have a top notch HC/OC to help him. Before Red can become that he will need some on-the-job-training. By that time Romo might no longer be in his prime and capable anymore.

3) Jerry has been more out in the press than ever since Red has become HC. This will continue if Red keeps that job. More Jerry spouting off is NOT what we need. Less Jerry is. That will only occur if we get a strong, respected HC in here.

The stronger the better. No one can keep Jerry out of it completely, not even Parcells. But a coach with skins on the wall would probably be able to limit the amount of Jerry at least a little. Any decrease in Jerry is a good thing IMO.

4) Red is NOT Sean Payton. Most people have so much rueage over losing Sean Payton that they just can't seem to believe that maybe Red is NOT the same. For every Payton, there are many more young hotshot coordinators given the chance only to fail horribly. Just because Red is fairly young and has some well known supporters (Aikman, Babe, etc) doesn't mean he is all that.

You got to separate Red from Payton, but I believe many on here just can't do that. He doesn't have the same experience or temperment.

5) Red seems fake to me. I once had a boss who would read all sorts of books on leadership and management. He would quote stupid phrases out of those books all the time. The books told him how he was supposed to act towards people. It came across fake and most saw right through him.

Garrett, in his PC, sounds scarily similar to those books. Different phrases he uses sound eerily similar to what my former boss used to say. I'd be willing to bet Red has some of the same leadership books he studies. Comes across fake to me. If players start to see the same, they will be turned off as well.

5) Various other more minor things, but since this is already long enough and aren't too important, I'll skip.

These are your reasons?

Aside from #1 in which you might have a claim, the rest are a collection of assumptions and irrelavancies, none of which I'd even remotely label a "sound argument."

 

[RoyTheHammer]

These are your reasons?

Aside from #1 in which you might have a claim, the rest are a collection of assumptions and irrelavancies, none of which I'd even remotely label a "sound argument."

Pretty much everything that anyone says about Garrett right now is an opinion generated by a collection of assumptions as well. None of us have any real knowledge of what goes on or what changes he's made or how the players are taking to him, etc.. especially since Garrett says next to nothing to the media.

Its pretty much all speculation. The only thing we know for sure is what we see on the field, and we try and make intelligent observations and conclusions based on that.

 

[Dodger]

Pretty much everything that anyone says about Garrett right now is an opinion generated by a collection of assumptions as well. None of us have any real knowledge of what goes on or what changes he's made or how the players are taking to him, etc.. especially since Garrett says next to nothing to the media.

Its pretty much all speculation. The only thing we know for sure is what we see on the field, and we try and make intelligent observations and conclusions based on that.

I understand that and agree, but I was referring to the quote below.

I've argued plenty against Red using multiple sound arguments....

I just don't see any "sound" arguments here.

 

[theebs]

Pretty much everything that anyone says about Garrett right now is an opinion generated by a collection of assumptions as well. None of us have any real knowledge of what goes on or what changes he's made or how the players are taking to him, etc.. especially since Garrett says next to nothing to the media.

Its pretty much all speculation. The only thing we know for sure is what we see on the field, and we try and make intelligent observations and conclusions based on that.

actually we have heard the players say things like he has let it be known its his way or else, we have heard bradie james say things like he comes in and sits in the film study with random defensive groups, sensebaugh also talked about this.

I think it is safe to say he has made the only changes he can make when you are in the middle of a season. If you were expecting him to install a different defensive scheme or release players Your A. Nuts and B. uninformed.

If he gets hired and makes no changes and starts with excuses about the defense then it will be time for this type of thread. Right now I really dont understand what else people want changed? Is he suppose to fire his staff the week of halloween for the sake of it? Release mike jenkins for the sake of it?

If he gets hired in a few weeks I am sure once the cba is settled we will see all kinds of changes.

 

[Dhragon]

These are your reasons?

Aside from #1 in which you might have a claim, the rest are a collection of assumptions and irrelavancies, none of which I'd even remotely label a "sound argument."

They are sound in my mind, lol.

To each his own. I'm sure whatever "sound arguments" you might make in favor of retaining Red would not seem sound at all to me either.

I wouldn't object to you or someone else making your own list of reasons we SHOULD keep Garrett. I'd be interested in seeing it even if I doubt I'd agree with them.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

actually we have heard the players say things like he has let it be known its his way or else, we have heard bradie james say things like he comes in and sits in the film study with random defensive groups, sensebaugh also talked about this.

I think it is safe to say he has made the only changes he can make when you are in the middle of a season. If you were expecting him to install a different defensive scheme or release players Your A. Nuts and B. uninformed.

If he gets hired and makes no changes and starts with excuses about the defense then it will be time for this type of thread. Right now I really dont understand what else people want changed? Is he suppose to fire his staff the week of halloween for the sake of it? Release mike jenkins for the sake of it?

If he gets hired in a few weeks I am sure once the cba is settled we will see all kinds of changes.

So again, none of us really knows what "changes" he's actually made, other than the dress code. "He comes and sits with us in the defensive meetings" isn't really a change now is it?

 

[theebs]

So again, none of us really knows what "changes" he's actually made, other than the dress code. "He comes and sits with us in the defensive meetings" isn't really a change now is it?

actually sensebaugh and bradie said it was a huge change, basically said he was in there to let the guys know that he is involved in everything and you better be focused and working at all times.

Yes, that is a change.

I mean if you want to harp on the dress code or color of his hair that is fine.

I really nor can anyone else stop that kind of thing. If that is the path you choose for the next 6 months as a fan, so be it.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

actually sensebaugh and bradie said it was a huge change, basically said he was in there to let the guys know that he is involved in everything and you better be focused and working at all times.

Yes, that is a change.

I mean if you want to harp on the dress code or color of his hair that is fine.

I really nor can anyone else stop that kind of thing. If that is the path you choose for the next 6 months as a fan, so be it.

Im not "harping" on the dress code. Im saying its the only real change that we know of. Although gotta admit i've always had a thing for red heads..

:laugh2:

BTW.. saying that Wade wasn't a part of the defensive meetings or film sessions?

 

[Zman5]

This team has tendency to play down/up the level of competition.

This still hasn't been fixed. We play up for Giants/Saints/Colts and then play down to Washington and AZ.

It's as though they are still taking their opponents lightly. 5-10 team shouldn't do this but they still do.

It's HC's job to keep the players level headed ("Don't eat the cheese" speech). Either through veteran leadership or communicating it directly to the players. By looking at the past 2 games, I don't think JG has done anything to fix that.

 

[theebs]

Im not "harping" on the dress code. Im saying its the only real change that we know of. Although gotta admit i've always had a thing for red heads..

:laugh2:

BTW.. saying that Wade wasn't a part of the defensive meetings or film sessions?

really need this explained to you?

Do you think it means wade wasnt in on the meetings? Ask yourself that.

or just tell me about the tie's again...either way ...

 

[Cowboyz88]

And how'd those speeches work out for Mr. Parcells? The trophy case is no different than when he arrived.

All these "a real coach should do this" criteria that a lot of fans are espousing as criticism for Mr. Garrett are conveniently being overlooked in reference to other coaches.

I saw another poster state that Mr Garrett should be "in charge" of limiting the drops of Mr. Austin. Again using that same standard, Mr. Belichick must be a terrible coach considering Wes Welker leads the league in drops.

It's HC's job to keep the players level headed ("Don't eat the cheese" speech). Either through veteran leadership or communicating it directly to the players. By looking at the past 2 games, I don't think JG has done anything to fix that.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

really need this explained to you?

Do you think it means wade wasnt in on the meetings? Ask yourself that.

or just tell me about the tie's again...either way ...

:laugh2:

Yes i think our head coach and defensive specialist was a part of the defensive meetings.. so again, its not really a change.

Other than this, what changes do we know of? You know, besides your favorite point of interest "the ties"?

Go ahead and list them for us all..

 

[Cowboyz88]

Here's one...it's called winning percentage.

Other than this, what changes do we know of?

 

[theebs]

:laugh2:

Yes i think our head coach and defensive specialist was a part of the defensive meetings.. so again, its not really a change.

Other than this, what changes do we know of? You know, besides your favorite point of interest "the ties"?

Go ahead and list them for us all..

wow.

K buh bye then.

:

 

[RoyTheHammer]

wow.

K buh bye then.

:

Oh, you can't list all the changes Garrett has made for us?

What a suprise..

 

[birdwells1]

Until the last two blowouts ...

That was a powerful observation.

So we're not getting blown out and we're in games?

I'd say that's different than what we did under Wade. We had an opportunity to get blown out by the Cardinals and the Saints and the Eagles and we did not.

I think that speaks to the difference.

Yah!!! So we go from, at the start of the season, having playoff aspirations to "at least we're not getting blown out".

People give me a break, if anyone would have taken over after Wade this team would have got a bump in concentration and performance.

Following Wade is like following a comedian who just bombed and was booed off the stage, the next comedian might not be that good but next to the guy that got booed he seems hilarious.

You don't have to be good you just have to be better than Wade. To fairly judge Garrett you have to take Wade out of the equation but looking at the pro-Garrett post on this board, that seems hard for some to do.

 

[Aven8]

Garrett lost me after the last game when he ddn't bench Barber after he took off his helmet! He should have benched him or sent him to the locker room. Just another push over coach who cannot control his team.

Yes he's bright and may be great some day, but it won't be here in Dallas.

 

[Dodger]

They are sound in my mind, lol.

To each his own. I'm sure whatever "sound arguments" you might make in favor of retaining Red would not seem sound at all to me either.

I wouldn't object to you or someone else making your own list of reasons we SHOULD keep Garrett. I'd be interested in seeing it even if I doubt I'd agree with them.

Actually, I'm on the fence as far as retaining Garrett.

 

[Zman5]

And how'd those speeches work out for Mr. Parcells? The trophy case is no different than when he arrived.

All these "a real coach should do this" criteria that a lot of fans are espousing as criticism for Mr. Garrett are conveniently being overlooked in reference to other coaches.

I saw another poster state that Mr Garrett should be "in charge" of limiting the drops of Mr. Austin. Again using that same standard, Mr. Belichick must be a terrible coach considering Wes Welker leads the league in drops.

Where did I compare JG to any other coaches? Only coach I'm comparing JG is the one he replaced. Read my posts closer and comprehend before replying to it.