Holding - no calls

[Longboysfan]

Well we see the referees have redefined holding - or - no holding.

I was curious if Lawrence Taylor chimed in on this.
During his prime did he feel he was being held and no calls?
Is there a stat on holding calls kept?
Against / for one team?

 

[Cowboys5217]

We hear the sports cliche all the time - "the big stars get the calls".

People fail to include the fine print on that - "unless they play for the Dallas Cowboys".

 

[Jake]

Well we see the referees have redefined holding - or - no holding.

I was curious if Lawrence Taylor chimed in on this.
During his prime did he feel he was being held and no calls?
Is there a stat on holding calls kept?
Against / for one team?

The Cowboys have been the beneficiaries of 9 offensive holding calls on their opponents. That's tied with five teams. Seven teams have received more, 19 less.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

The Cowboys have been the beneficiaries of 9 offensive holding calls on their opponents. That's tied with five teams. Seven teams have received more, 19 less.

Shhhh…

The conspiracy can’t be perpetuated with that kind of info.

 

[Runwildboys]

The Cowboys have been the beneficiaries of 9 offensive holding calls on their opponents. That's tied with five teams. Seven teams have received more, 19 less.

Sure, but who else has Micah Parsons bearing down on their QB???

 

[JBS]

Shhhh…

The conspiracy can’t be perpetuated with that kind of info.

I’m not into conspiracies and I’m not into blaming refs

but no other team in the nfl has parsons..being ranked 8th or whatever means nothing

 

[TwoDeep3]

The Cowboys have been the beneficiaries of 9 offensive holding calls on their opponents. That's tied with five teams. Seven teams have received more, 19 less.

This is the argument where logic flies out the window to analytics. The assumption is all teams have the same opportunities and the difference in holding penalties proves things are equal. No two circumstances are alike, so counting on your fingers the number of times holding has been called on one team versus the other ignores the most basic problematic issue which questions your assertion.

There are different officiating cadre that work together. It is spoken about here as games come up which team of officials is working the Cowboy game and what their tendencies are.

If for no other reason this disqualifies an over-arching thesis comparing raw numbers and this gives you an answer even close to accurate.

And since you included all teams, it further loses its authenticity when discussing each defense and how many have that edge rusher who causes such disruptions, defensive coordinators adjust their game plans to account for that player and to attempt to alter their business as usual offense to overwhelm him to win play after play.

I have never appreciated analytics because the results can support any narrative by framing the right question.

 

[Creeper]

The Cowboys have been the beneficiaries of 9 offensive holding calls on their opponents. That's tied with five teams. Seven teams have received more, 19 less.

This is not really a big enough sample size, and even so, it does not give any indication of calls that should have been made. When I rewatched the Bears game, rewinding plays to watch repeatedly I saw numerous holding penalties committed with few called. In fact, the one holding called where the OT grabbed Parsons, I thought was the least egregious of all of them. And the holding was not limited to Parsons. We saw Fowler dragged to the ground too. There were holds on other plays were Bears blockers pulled Cowboys defenders away from the play, etc. As I watched the Cowboys OL, I saw a couple of minor infractions but nothing that significant. I was a little surprised actually.

The theory by some Cowboys fans is the holding calls were not holding because the "rip" move creates an exception to the holding rule. It allows the blocker to wrap his arm under the defenders neck and use it to impede the defender from the play. But when I watch the game again, I didn't see Parson use the rip move on any of the plays where holding should have been called. It appears to me the refs have decided arm bars are not legal blocks when they were called holding in the past.

If the refs are consistent, I generally don't care, but on egregious holds, like when Parsons and Fowler were pulled to the ground, they have to call those. No one wants the NFL to turn into a wrestling match.

btw, during my rewatch of the game there was a pass play where Tyler Smith blocks a Bears guy downfield, then came off the block and blocked another guy. He should have been called for a penalty there. Maybe he didn't realize what the play was or he lost his place but it is something he should watch in the future.

 

[MarcusRock]

The Cowboys have been the beneficiaries of 9 offensive holding calls on their opponents. That's tied with five teams. Seven teams have received more, 19 less.

Here, let me help.

"But, but it's not the number but WHENNNNN they call them. That penalty at 14:55 of the 1st Quarter changed the entire complexion of the game when you consider we lost by only 49."​

 

[Mannix]

Shhhh…

The conspiracy can’t be perpetuated with that kind of info.

Sure it can....11 gets held on EVERY play!!!

 

[America's Cowboy]

Lmao! There is tons of video of Micah getting held consistently, yet no flags are thrown. Nah, let's just go by some typed up stats that clearly don't explain why Micah being held so many times is not flagged.

 

[DripTooHard]

Shhhh…

The conspiracy can’t be perpetuated with that kind of info.

Get real. It is the timing of the calls/no calls and not the number.

 

[DripTooHard]

Lmao! There is tons of video of Micah getting held consistently, yet no flags are thrown. Nah, let's just go by some typed up stats that clearly don't explain why Micah being held so many times is not flagged.

I trust the player when he goes public and has said it. Which Parsons has done. Clearly he knows the rules and was prompted to ask the ref ***?

 

[Point-of-the-Star]

I’m not into conspiracies and I’m not into blaming refs

but no other team in the nfl has parsons..being ranked 8th or whatever means nothing

Especially with the aggressive pass rushing team that the Cowboys have. Cowboys 1st in pressures. And the defensive philosophy is a fault in their aim is to pressure the passer at the expense of their run defense. Giving some weak single stat like the number of calls and the position of the team in that department is meaningless without context (which I just gave).

The other context would be game situation.

Now, IMO some teams are favored by refereeing and some are punished. Some are nothing burgers . I don't think this year is near as bad as previous years (I mean, how does a team go 10 games and the opposition OL doesn't get called for holding?). Another was the call on L.P. Ladouceur on the FG attempt which hadn't been called in years in the League and every LS does it. Cost Dallas and the timing was crucial. The list is long albeit anecdotal. Of course there's no "proof". How can you prove intent? (you really can't in this case).

It has to be deducted via a body of work (examples). There's that long list of oddities though. As Pa told me when I was young "Don't pi$$ on my foot and tell me its raining."

Whatever. I ain't gonna argue this stupid stuff with my fellow Cowboy fans. It is what it is. I've said my bit! Period !

 

[MarcusRock]

This is the argument where logic flies out the window to analytics. The assumption is all teams have the same opportunities and the difference in holding penalties proves things are equal. No two circumstances are alike, so counting on your fingers the number of times holding has been called on one team versus the other ignores the most basic problematic issue which questions your assertion.

There are different officiating cadre that work together. It is spoken about here as games come up which team of officials is working the Cowboy game and what their tendencies are.

If for no other reason this disqualifies an over-arching thesis comparing raw numbers and this gives you an answer even close to accurate.

And since you included all teams, it further loses its authenticity when discussing each defense and how many have that edge rusher who causes such disruptions, defensive coordinators adjust their game plans to account for that player and to attempt to alter their business as usual offense to overwhelm him to win play after play.

I have never appreciated analytics because the results can support any narrative by framing the right question.

Weren't you going to look up an alleged holding play for me to comment on the other day?

 

[MarcusRock]

I mean, how does a team go 10 games and the opposition OL doesn't get called for holding?

Ask the Detroit Lions. Did you know they underwent a similar streak as we did to the tune of only one less game that same season (I looked it up)? So maybe it's more common than one would think if other teams are actually considered to make an informed argument and context is provided. Coincidentally, I see that's what folks are asking for here in response to sheer numbers. Interesting.

 

[Doomsay]

Packers game will be interesting. Non-holding calls have been instrumental in their recent playoff victories against us.
Also, Dez’s catch, except for those with ref daddy issues.

 

[Jake]

This is the argument where logic flies out the window to analytics. The assumption is all teams have the same opportunities and the difference in holding penalties proves things are equal.

The only one making assumptions is you. All I did was post the numbers.

 

[Jake]

This is not really a big enough sample size, and even so, it does not give any indication of calls that should have been made.

All I did was post the numbers. The sample size is the same for every team.

 

[Jake]

Sure, but who else has Micah Parsons bearing down on their QB???

All I did was post the numbers. Seems some folks are upset that they don't comport with their feelings. Not sure why they're coming at me about that.