How disillusioned with this team are you?

[Cowboys_22]

That was a Long...Long time ago and Far...Far away, right?

It was during our lifetime so it can't be far far away. When Emmitt is SS age then I'll consider it long ago

Stay positive my friend

 

[TheHerd]

It's the same coaches from last year's 13-3 team.

Where is the defensive roster that much worse?
DE better with healthy DLaw
LB same if Lee/Hitchens together
DT worse at 1-tech but McClain faded last season.
FS same or better
Scandrick same or better

So far that's a net positive with a Healthy DLaw more than offsetting the 1-tech issue.

That leaves:
Lewis - Probably as good as Carr in this scheme already.

Brown - Started over half of 2016 so he can only be better.

Heath vs Church - Church better against the run but not much if any better against the pass. Woods or Awuzie probably start taking snaps from Heath. Woods has played a lot already and Awuzie played when healthy.

First, many on here, and I'm one, never trusted the coaches even last year. We won in spite of them, not because. Dak was otherwordly and Zeke was MVP quality. At critical points, either the opposing QB would suck it up or the defense would make a play. I think we forget a little that some of last year's success was due to the former.

DL is not all around better. DLaw is balling out and the pressure is better, but the line has been atrocious against the run, and that has killed us so far. When you're averaging allowing 6 ypc on first down, anything you can do against the pass is somewhat diminished.

Brown is not better this year than last, at least not yet. Can he be? Sure, but he hasn't played these first 5 games as well as he played the last 5 last year.

You are right that IF everyone plays we'd be ok at LB. But that hasn't happened yet, and with Jaylon's travails we are significantly worse this year than last at LB. We can hope for the best but we're razor thin.

Heath (or Woods) so far this year has been significantly worse than Church, even though I don't think Church is more than JAG. Again, we can hope this improves and it very well may, but to this point safety has been another major downgrade.

 

[xwalker]

First, many on here, and I'm one, never trusted the coaches even last year. We won in spite of them, not because. Dak was otherwordly and Zeke was MVP quality. At critical points, either the opposing QB would suck it up or the defense would make a play. I think we forget a little that some of last year's success was due to the former.

DL is not all around better. DLaw is balling out and the pressure is better, but the line has been atrocious against the run, and that has killed us so far. When you're averaging allowing 6 ypc on first down, anything you can do against the pass is somewhat diminished.

Brown is not better this year than last, at least not yet. Can he be? Sure, but he hasn't played these first 5 games as well as he played the last 5 last year.

You are right that IF everyone plays we'd be ok at LB. But that hasn't happened yet, and with Jaylon's travails we are significantly worse this year than last at LB. We can hope for the best but we're razor thin.

Heath (or Woods) so far this year has been significantly worse than Church, even though I don't think Church is more than JAG. Again, we can hope this improves and it very well may, but to this point safety has been another major downgrade.

Good post. I don't completely agree but good job of making your point. This is the type of civilized debate that I enjoy.

My post was with regards to going forward.

 

[LittleD]

It was during our lifetime so it can't be far far away. When Emmitt is SS age then I'll consider it long ago

Stay positive my friend

Alrighty then?

 

[DenCWBY]

Except they are going to have the same coaching staff and the same defense in December.

This. Coaching is the difference in December/Jan that separates us from the Pitts, NE, Den, Sea, GB, ATL who are all "struggling" today.

 

[TheHerd]

Good post. I don't completely agree but good job of making your point. This is the type of civilized debate that I enjoy.

My post was with regards to going forward.

Going forward it's difficult to disagree.

Lee's presence alone makes the LB better. And though I think he probably ** could ** have maybe played last week, the team decided to let the soft tissue heal so it's not a year long problem. We complain when they rush guys too early and things linger, and we complain when they don't.

Woods HAS to be an upgrade at this point.\

I can't figure out what happened to Brown. He just looks unsure of himself and is getting even more grabby than he used to be. If Chido can get his hammy figured out he could be better in any event.

 

[xwalker]

This. Coaching is the difference in December/Jan that separates us from the Pitts, NE, Den, Sea, GB, ATL who are all "struggling" today.

Have the Cowboys really had a roster that would win a Super Bowl even with Belichick coaching them?

I'm not going to fixate on coaching until I see a roster that is good enough but is held back by coaching. I just don't think we've seen that roster since Garrett has been the HC. Maybe back around 2007 it was good enough but in recent years the defense just has not been a complete unit.

 

[Sydla]

Have the Cowboys really had a roster that would win a Super Bowl even with Belichick coaching them?

I'm not going to fixate on coaching until I see a roster that is good enough but is held back by coaching. I just don't think we've seen that roster since Garrett has been the HC. Maybe back around 2007 it was good enough but in recent years the defense just has not been a complete unit.

Yes, I think high level coaching can overcome some deficiencies in talent. We don't have that kind of coaching staff IMO.

I struggle with this whole concept of "well we can only find out how good our coaching staff is when they have a roster loaded with talent". That makes little sense to me. I want a coaching staff who makes a team better, not a team that makes the coaching staff better.

 

[xwalker]

Going forward it's difficult to disagree.

Lee's presence alone makes the LB better. And though I think he probably ** could ** have maybe played last week, the team decided to let the soft tissue heal so it's not a year long problem. We complain when they rush guys too early and things linger, and we complain when they don't.

Woods HAS to be an upgrade at this point.\

I can't figure out what happened to Brown. He just looks unsure of himself and is getting even more grabby than he used to be. If Chido can get his hammy figured out he could be better in any event.

I analyzed 1 game where almost all of the completions Brown gave up were with him playing outside leverage and then he didn't get the proper held to the inside that is required when the CB plays that technique. Jaylon was the intended help defender on many of those plays.

IMO Brown is good enough if the LBs and SS do their jobs.

 

[JoeKing]

Losing to the Rams hurt. We knew going into the other 2 games we lost that it could go either way. I don't feel disillusioned at all.

 

[xwalker]

Yes, I think high level coaching can overcome some deficiencies in talent. We don't have that kind of coaching staff IMO.

I struggle with this whole concept of "well we can only find out how good our coaching staff is when they have a roster loaded with talent". That makes little sense to me. I want a coaching staff who makes a team better, not a team that makes the coaching staff better.

Yes, if your hiring a new coaching staff that makes sense; however, dumping a coaching staff because they didn't win with a roster that Belichick couldn't win with is just churning.

It could get worse. We've seen worse coaching staffs with this team.

The thing I like about Garrett is that a new HC would inherit a good situation if Garrett was replaced. The players have a decent sense of discipline and always play hard.

Wade was the opposite. He inherited a good situation and turned it into a cesspool of under-achieving quitters. They had to replace most of those players after he was gone just to get the entitlement attitude out of the lockerroom.

 

[Stash]

Have the Cowboys really had a roster that would win a Super Bowl even with Belichick coaching them?

I'm not going to fixate on coaching until I see a roster that is good enough but is held back by coaching. I just don't think we've seen that roster since Garrett has been the HC. Maybe back around 2007 it was good enough but in recent years the defense just has not been a complete unit.

What about the offense? I'd invite anyone to go top to bottom and find an offensive roster more talented overall than this one. And they still manage to get shut down enough to lose games.

As for the defense, it's always something isn't it? Plug one hole in the dike and another one pops up. Last year, it was pass rush. Fix that and everything will be great. Now that's better, but linebacker play and run defense sucks.

Everything's been changed but the results.

 

[Sydla]

Yes, if your hiring a new coaching staff that makes sense; however, dumping a coaching staff because they didn't win with a roster that Belichick couldn't win with is just churning.

It could get worse. We've seen worse coaching staffs with this team.

The thing I like about Garrett is that a new HC would inherit a good situation if Garrett was replaced. The players have a decent sense of discipline and always play hard.

Wade was the opposite. He inherited a good situation and turned it into a cesspool of under-achieving quitters. They had to replace most of those players after he was gone just to get the entitlement attitude out of the lockerroom.

That's where we disagree.

I think with a better coaching staff, this team makes the NFC Title game last year. I think they also wouldn't be 2-3 right now.

If this team fails to make the playoffs this year, that would be 7 full seasons with Garrett. Only two playoff appearances. One playoff win.

I think it would be foolish to continue with this staff at that point.

 

[TheHerd]

Yes, if your hiring a new coaching staff that makes sense; however, dumping a coaching staff because they didn't win with a roster that Belichick couldn't win with is just churning.

It could get worse. We've seen worse coaching staffs with this team.

The thing I like about Garrett is that a new HC would inherit a good situation if Garrett was replaced. The players have a decent sense of discipline and always play hard.

Wade was the opposite. He inherited a good situation and turned it into a cesspool of under-achieving quitters. They had to replace most of those players after he was gone just to get the entitlement attitude out of the lockerroom.

I agree with the sentiment overall. Garrett isn't complete horse **** as so many on here try to parade out. He's a poor in game coach, imo. He is too risk averse. But he does get players to play hard and buy into a philosophy and not accept entitlement.

I've though about this a little and have a theory. Those who are really coordinators at heart, like Wade, tend to be more friendly toward players, particularly talented players, than a head coach should be. It's like good cop/bad cop, where the head coach can be the heavy and the OC/DC can soothe the player if that's what is needed. This is sort of the mid level manager/director vs. the executive in the corporate world.

One thing I wish Garrett would embrace is to take the fall for losses and assign "blame" only when we win. And the better coaches tend to be more critical after wins and more conciliatory after losses. Good players already know they screwed up after a loss and just need to get motivated to fix it, and also need to be talked away from their high horse after a win.

 

[Stash]

That's where we disagree.

I think with a better coaching staff, this team makes the NFC Title game last year. I think they also wouldn't be 2-3 right now.

If this team fails to make the playoffs this year, that would be 7 full seasons with Garrett. Only two playoff appearances. One playoff win.

I think it would be foolish to continue with this staff at that point.

What else can be changed that hasn't already?

Some people want to go half way yet again - fir Marinelli - as if everything else is working just great. It isn't.

The defense is the biggest failing to be sure, but the rest of the staff doesn't help in that failure either. Especially the guy who brought this Kiffin/Marinelli scheme to Dallas.

7 years in the seat, with a decade of input overall, is more time than anyone deserves.

 

[LittleD]

What's sad is this would have been a perfect year to potentially go to the super bowl if we had a sold team. Even with these pathetic coaches we have. The parity in the NFL right now is astounding.
But you don't go 21 years with no success for no reason. Thanks Jerry.

Jerry is doing exactly what he wants. He's got a billion dollar stadium and now a billion dollar complex at the Star with restaurants, hotels and retail
all over his land. He's making millions each year on this team and his franchise is the most valuable in the NFL. I think Jerry is very successful at
doing what he does best. Making Moola!!! By the way, ask any NFL owner, that's what this business is all about. Making Moola!