Twitter: I don't buy Zeke's knee injury excuse

Coogiguy03

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This
I don’t think the knee injury helped.


That being said. You very well may be right. I can’t imagine the number of “knicks” a running back gets over the course of a season. I’m sure after years of carrying the load. Zeke’s entire body probably hurt all season long and everything compounds.


I’ve learned my lesson as a fan. Never pay a RB a big dollar, long term guaranteed deal.

Unfortunately we are stuck with Zeke for one more year at least.


The bigger concern is the fact that the coaching staff or front office, still insisted on Zeke getting the primary load, while Pollard was overall playing very well this season.

I even said during the playoff game. “I look forward to Zeke getting 15 Carries for 3 YPC”


Meanwhile, he didn’t even get 3 YPC.


This is normal, yet people think we should run an offense through him
 

Sydla

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Been there, and done that as Dallas Cowboys fans remember...see link...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...average/f05d4e26-5d16-4f06-bfdb-7896e75f6631/

Zeke was hurt mid year. No running back wears a knee brace like that not to protect an injury. There is a difference for hurt and injured.

You can not use a back with Elliott's talent as runner, receiver and block with 10-15 touches per game. All these Tony Pollard fans were the same Arlington Jonesboys that was saying let Demarco Murray go and play Joseph Randle. How did that work out? Remember that Tony Pollard has never carried any RB load at Memphis and was 3rd string. He was a tweener between RB and WR and was not 1st or 2nd team at any of those positions.

This is about a GM and coaching staff knowing what they have and how to use what they have (see David Shula and Emmitt Smith). Elliott literally ran Ohio St. to a NCAA Championship in the end running rough shod over Nick Saban Alabama defense. So what did we do in the 2021 Divisional playoff game when he was ready and in better health? Arlington Jonesboys gave him 12 carries and 1 reception.

One, comparing Elliott now to what he was in college is just foolish. He was younger, fresher, more explosive as a college player than he is now. Two, Elliott is the highest paid TB (by total contract size). Given the cap hits he's going to eat up, he has to be more than a bruiser TB that wears down defenses and then is effective after that 14th touch in a game.

Three, the Murray angle doesn't help your case here. In fact, it kind of hurts it. For one, the Cowboys came out and said after 2014 that they couldn't commit to the years and money Murray wanted because their data showed TBs drop off after so many carries and the kind of usage Murray had. And guess what? They were right. Murray was never the same after that 2014 season. He struggled in Philly, came back with a 1,200 yard season in Tennessee, but then fell back and was out of the league by 2017. You also conveniently left out to big storylines in 2015 - one, it wasnt just Randle they wanted to run the ball, they also signed Darren McFadden, who actually ran for 1,000 yards that year. The other issue was that it wasn't not having Murray that killed the 2015 season, it was that Romo got hurt and we had to play a majority of the season with guys like Brandon Weeden at QB. And think about that, McFadden ran for 1,000 yards (starting only 10 games too that year) and did so with crappy QB play.

If anything, the Murray thing shows it's more wise to invest in the OL than eat up oodles of cap space on a TB.
 

Coogiguy03

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Again, by all accounts he was in the best shape of his career coming into camp. His numbers the first month of the season were right on pace with what he was doing in his second season. All signs were pointing to him being a top 3-4 rusher and having a great bounce back season. Maybe you're confused, a 26 year old doesn't just fall of a cliff 5 weeks into the season.


Try several years ago!!! Times where he didn't get many 20 yard runs that was the decline
 

StuckMojo

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I don’t think the knee injury helped.


That being said. You very well may be right. I can’t imagine the number of “knicks” a running back gets over the course of a season. I’m sure after years of carrying the load. Zeke’s entire body probably hurt all season long and everything compounds.


I’ve learned my lesson as a fan. Never pay a RB a big dollar, long term guaranteed deal.

Unfortunately we are stuck with Zeke for one more year at least.


The bigger concern is the fact that the coaching staff or front office, still insisted on Zeke getting the primary load, while Pollard was overall playing very well this season.

I even said during the playoff game. “I look forward to Zeke getting 15 Carries for 3 YPC”


Meanwhile, he didn’t even get 3 YPC.
Hard to do with a blocking scheme that allows LBs to hit RB as soon as he touches the ball 3 yards deep.

And yes TP should have gotten more touches in Zeke’s place and while Zeke is in the game too.
 

LACowboysFan1

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It is clearly obvious that when Zeke is in the game, the defense keys on him. Stop Zeke, the rest of the offense falls apart.

It's also clearly obvious that the assumption by many is that if the Cowboys just played Pollard as the "bell cow" back, or at least many more carries than Zeke, the running game would be just fine.

That first of all is an assumption that cannot be made, since Pollard has not been the bell cow back.

Now should he get the chance? Sure, I'd love to see 3-4-5 games in a row where Pollard got like 15-20 carries every game, and see how he does. But what I don't want is another Marion Barber situation, where a part time back is not very successful as a full time back. Have to be cautious there, IF the Cowboys can get the o-lne back up to snuff, I suspect Zeke would return more to his 2016-2018 self.

But realistically, unless the o-line improves even Emmitt in his prime wouldn't do that well running the ball...
 

Cowboysheelsreds053

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Will this thread bring out my Zeke buddy, who I missed this season not posting “Aria”. Use to have fun going back and forth with him on this matter.
 

jnday

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Even if Jerry fired himself, the idiot son is right behind him and probably even worse than Jerry.
The only difference between Jerry and Stephen is that Stephen is a tight wad with money. Jerry would spend whatever money that it takes to sign players, Stephen will not.
 

Sydla

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It is clearly obvious that when Zeke is in the game, the defense keys on him. Stop Zeke, the rest of the offense falls apart.

It's also clearly obvious that the assumption by many is that if the Cowboys just played Pollard as the "bell cow" back, or at least many more carries than Zeke, the running game would be just fine.

That first of all is an assumption that cannot be made, since Pollard has not been the bell cow back.

Now should he get the chance? Sure, I'd love to see 3-4-5 games in a row where Pollard got like 15-20 carries every game, and see how he does. But what I don't want is another Marion Barber situation, where a part time back is not very successful as a full time back. Have to be cautious there, IF the Cowboys can get the o-lne back up to snuff, I suspect Zeke would return more to his 2016-2018 self.

But realistically, unless the o-line improves even Emmitt in his prime wouldn't do that well running the ball...

I don't think it's clearly obvious at all. In fact, if you look at the data about stacked boxes, etc Elliott doesn't face more stacked boxes than most TBs. So I am not sure if one can just assume defenses focus on Elliott anymore.

However, as pointed out by some of the beats/analysts, when Elliott is in the game, defenses do adjust in the sense they basically don't worry about the edges anymore. Zeke isn't a guy that's going to get outside and burn you for a big gain. Teams pretty much crashed down with their outside edge players when Elliott got the ball because there was little fear he was going to bounce outside and burn them. In fact, Dallas seemed to understand his limitations as well as they rarely ran sweeps, tosses to Elliott in games.
 

LACowboysFan1

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One, comparing Elliott now to what he was in college is just foolish. He was younger, fresher, more explosive as a college player than he is now. Two, Elliott is the highest paid TB (by total contract size). Given the cap hits he's going to eat up, he has to be more than a bruiser TB that wears down defenses and then is effective after that 14th touch in a game.

Three, the Murray angle doesn't help your case here. In fact, it kind of hurts it. For one, the Cowboys came out and said after 2014 that they couldn't commit to the years and money Murray wanted because their data showed TBs drop off after so many carries and the kind of usage Murray had. And guess what? They were right. Murray was never the same after that 2014 season. He struggled in Philly, came back with a 1,200 yard season in Tennessee, but then fell back and was out of the league by 2017. You also conveniently left out to big storylines in 2015 - one, it wasnt just Randle they wanted to run the ball, they also signed Darren McFadden, who actually ran for 1,000 yards that year. The other issue was that it wasn't not having Murray that killed the 2015 season, it was that Romo got hurt and we had to play a majority of the season with guys like Brandon Weeden at QB. And think about that, McFadden ran for 1,000 yards (starting only 10 games too that year) and did so with crappy QB play.

If anything, the Murray thing shows it's more wise to invest in the OL than eat up oodles of cap space on a TB.

It's not a matter of stacked boxes, it's when Zeke is in the backfield by himself, as soon as the ball is snapped every defensive player on the line, and usually another player, zoom straight to Zeke, many times they are in the backfield the same time as Zeke gets the ball. The o-line is too slow (except of course Martin, the perennial Pro Bowler) to get over to make a block, and if they do manage to do that, the defender just pushes them aside. Every other player on the offense is basically ignored. And it also is pretty obvious that defenses know the Cowboys' plays so that it's seldom a question as to if Zeke is going to do a running play, and what hole he's trying to get through, defenses know exactly where to go.

It's almost getting to the point that I want Zeke gone, to some team that has an at least pretty good line, so we can put to bed once and for all the question - is it Zeke that's the problem or the line/play calling? But then we would have Pollard or some other running back not being as good at picking up blitzes and rushers as Zeke, and Dak or Rush of whoever will get sacked 8 times a game.

Not saying it's you, but for many it's the same old same old - if the starter isn't doing well then the backup should be starting, e.g. like Marion Barber. The lack of in-dept analysis is so bad by many it's laughable...
 

Doomsday

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Zeke being injured is a bigger indictment of Moore and McCarthy for not using Pollard more.

It was painfully clear that he needed more reps.
 

rambo2

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I'm sure most of you don't either but some of you might.

Consider this. He apparently injured the knee week 4 against the Panthers.



Now if Zeke's knee injury was so limiting why would he rush for 110 yards and 5.2 yards per carry the very next week? How is that possible 7 days after a ligament tear yet it's so debilitating the rest of the season?

I'm sure he had a knee issue but I think it's been used to cover for a rapidly declining once superstar. A player the Cowboys are not only heavily invested in and loyal to because of the contract but the fact that he's the QB's best friend.

This is a real problem and it's not going away in 2022. No matter how many awesome offseason workout videos he posts.


It wasn't an excuse. It is a fact.
 

Sydla

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It's not a matter of stacked boxes, it's when Zeke is in the backfield by himself, as soon as the ball is snapped every defensive player on the line, and usually another player, zoom straight to Zeke, many times they are in the backfield the same time as Zeke gets the ball. The o-line is too slow (except of course Martin, the perennial Pro Bowler) to get over to make a block, and if they do manage to do that, the defender just pushes them aside. Every other player on the offense is basically ignored. And it also is pretty obvious that defenses know the Cowboys' plays so that it's seldom a question as to if Zeke is going to do a running play, and what hole he's trying to get through, defenses know exactly where to go.

It's almost getting to the point that I want Zeke gone, to some team that has an at least pretty good line, so we can put to bed once and for all the question - is it Zeke that's the problem or the line/play calling? But then we would have Pollard or some other running back not being as good at picking up blitzes and rushers as Zeke, and Dak or Rush of whoever will get sacked 8 times a game.

Not saying it's you, but for many it's the same old same old - if the starter isn't doing well then the backup should be starting, e.g. like Marion Barber. The lack of in-dept analysis is so bad by many it's laughable...

Again it isn't an either/or situation. It's not Elliott by himself. It's not the OL by itself. Shoot it's not even Moore by himself. They are all culpable in what is an inept run game. And let's be clear, I don't think Pollard is Alvin Kamara our there, a true 3 down back either.

Watch some of our recent games and watch the DEs, in particular. How many times do you see DEs set the edge against Elliott? Not often. In that Cards game, the DEs were constantly crashing down on Elliott because they know he's no threat at this point as an outside runner. There was one play and bunch of people noted this in that game (or maybe it was the Eagles game) thread where the left side of the OL collapsed the Eagles OL and Elliott cut outside. Pollard or someone like Kamara would have gotten 10+ years easily. Elliott got 6-7 and tried to juke the defender but just ran straight into him and got dropped.

He's, frankly, much easier to defend now than he was 4 years ago. We don't even bother running that many sweeps or tosses to him because we know, he's just not that kind of running back anymore. So when you try to argue defenses know where to go, while that could be play design, it's also based on the kind of TB Elliott is now. They simply don't respect his ability to get outside and make big runs outside. So if you are a defense facing a TB with little ability to burn you outside with speed and quickness, what would you do? That's right, attack between the tackles.

The reality is next year we have a TB that is a shell of himself commanding am 18 million chunk of our cap. That's downright insane.
 

ThatJerryKid

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I'm sure most of you don't either but some of you might.

Consider this. He apparently injured the knee week 4 against the Panthers.



Now if Zeke's knee injury was so limiting why would he rush for 110 yards and 5.2 yards per carry the very next week? How is that possible 7 days after a ligament tear yet it's so debilitating the rest of the season?

I'm sure he had a knee issue but I think it's been used to cover for a rapidly declining once superstar. A player the Cowboys are not only heavily invested in and loyal to because of the contract but the fact that he's the QB's best friend.

This is a real problem and it's not going away in 2022. No matter how many awesome offseason workout videos he posts.

Can’t wait until training camp when we hear about how great of shape he is in and how explosive he looks.
 

CowboyRoy

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I'm sure most of you don't either but some of you might.

Consider this. He apparently injured the knee week 4 against the Panthers.



Now if Zeke's knee injury was so limiting why would he rush for 110 yards and 5.2 yards per carry the very next week? How is that possible 7 days after a ligament tear yet it's so debilitating the rest of the season?

I'm sure he had a knee issue but I think it's been used to cover for a rapidly declining once superstar. A player the Cowboys are not only heavily invested in and loyal to because of the contract but the fact that he's the QB's best friend.

This is a real problem and it's not going away in 2022. No matter how many awesome offseason workout videos he posts.


Its a nice excuse for his apologists, but those that know RBs know Zeke sucks at this point.
 

Walker

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They had a better RB where you do not have to "argue" which is better, and they played the one that is broken more.
 

buybuydandavis

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One of Jerry's best decisions - paying Elliott what he did.

There were a lot of smart people here that said it was a bad idea. There were also a lot of people here who thought Elliott was this transcendent player that we had to sign. Those people look completely foolish at this time.

DLaw. 14.5 sacks the last 3 years. Hasn't had a sack in the playoffs since *2014*. 4 playoff games since 2016. 0 sacks, 1 QB hit.
"Hot Boyz"
 

buybuydandavis

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They had a better RB where you do not have to "argue" which is better, and they played the one that is broken more.

The refusal to play Pollard more is just weird. Seems more like an unwillingness to make it clear that Pollard is our best back, and therefore that extending Zeke was a mistake.

Our best formation once Gallup went down was probably The Hulk with Pollard as the back. No need for Zeke's blocking in The Hulk.

Another "what might have been".
 

Redsfan_83

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For MM the idiot to have all these facts and still trot Zeke out there play after play, while ignoring playing the better Rb....how on earth can this be acceptable by ownership? Outside of the obvious reason to this question, why do we fans continually put up with this hot garbage year after year?
 

JayFord

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im sure he did Tear his PCL

dude was running like a dumptruck going up a muddy hill

thats a sign of injury
 

Floatyworm

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I'm sure most of you don't either but some of you might.

Consider this. He apparently injured the knee week 4 against the Panthers.



Now if Zeke's knee injury was so limiting why would he rush for 110 yards and 5.2 yards per carry the very next week? How is that possible 7 days after a ligament tear yet it's so debilitating the rest of the season?

I'm sure he had a knee issue but I think it's been used to cover for a rapidly declining once superstar. A player the Cowboys are not only heavily invested in and loyal to because of the contract but the fact that he's the QB's best friend.

This is a real problem and it's not going away in 2022. No matter how many awesome offseason workout videos he posts.


I got the solution............:popcorn:

Isaiah Spiller RB Texas A&M

KN3y67
 
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