I hadn't known Deion's history

tyke1doe

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Oldschool7;2495252 said:
I had never read much about Deion's impact on the Cowboys until tonight. This whole little Owens fetish all makes sense now. In a number of respects Sanders just sees himself.

Everything that Irvin and Troy were in terms of team and practice and work---Sanders was opposite.

It really sounds like he was as much a part of the team demise as he was with any of it's success. You might even say he was a trojan horse that led to the downfall of the franchise. Tease you with his talent, kill the whole team with his worthless influence.

They say Sanders was just a lazy, apathetic slacker who blew about everything and everyone off. Switzer was the enabler. Sound familiar?

Aikman viewed the guy's influence as poison on the younger players.






Excerpts from Jeff Pearlman's book:


For all his Jim Thorpe-esque skills, Sanders was sleeping-dog lazy. In practices, he went all-out every third or fourth play and refused to wear shoulder pads because, he would say, "I'm not gonna tackle anyone anyway." In meeting rooms, he was known to doodle and doze off. Told early on that Cowboys who refused to participate in the team's weight training regimen would be fined, Sanders dramatically whipped out his checkbook and jotted down a five-digit figure.

When Mike Woicik, the team's gruff strength and conditioning coach, complained about Sanders' indifference, Switzer sided with his new star. "We're talking about Deion Sanders here," Switzer told Woicik. "If he doesn't want to do something, he doesn't have to."

Woicik was speechless. Credited by many players as a key to the back-to-back Super Bowls, Woicik was a no-nonsense taskmaster who demanded maximum effort. "For Mike, anything short of a funeral was an unacceptable excuse to miss a session," says Kevin Smith. "Mike had the personality of a lamp, but if you had to bench press he knew exactly how many you were supposed to do. When you came in and you didn't do it, he'd say, 'You were out f-----' around last night. You must've been drinking last night. You must have been drinking two nights ago.' He'd be pissed. He wouldn't speak to you for a week. If you tested on the bench and you didn't make it, he wouldn't say a word to you for a whole week until you came in and did it. That's how he was. Your goals were his goals."

Throughout the locker room, Woicik was as respected as any Cowboy coach or official. And Deion Sanders had the nerve to treat him … like this?

Who were the Dallas Cowboys becoming?

"I still remember Deion's first team meeting," says Clayton Holmes, the veteran cornerback. "We were so fundamental about film. The way we studied it was critical. Well, Deion comes in, puts his feet up on a table and doesn't even watch." When Dave Campo, the Cowboys new defensive coordinator, asked the $35 million man to break down a play, Sanders let out a sly laugh. "Hey, Coach," he said, pointing toward the screen, "I got that dude right there. Wherever he goes I go. All that Cover Two stuff you're talking about -- y'all work that out."

Seeing that the Cowboys' defensive back meetings lasted significantly longer than they had in Atlanta or San Francisco, Sanders took a page out of the Barry Bonds Playbook by investing in a black leather executive's chair and rolling it into the conference room. As his peers sat in standard metal folding chairs, Sanders lounged in comfort. "Guys thought that was kind of funny," says Schwantz. "Maybe not right -- but funny."

Although most veterans accepted Sanders' ego and indifference in exchange for the promise of otherworldly play, Aikman -- who had offered to defer part of his salary to help Dallas afford the defensive back -- was disgusted. It was bad enough Switzer approached discipline as if he were the proprietor of the Moonlite Bunny Ranch. Now here was "Neon Deion," teaching via example that image is everything and practice is overrated. From across the locker room, the quarterback would watch Sanders' postgame dressing ritual and cringe. As Jeff Rude of the Dallas Morning News described it: "Most people slip on a shirt when they get dressed. Deion puts on a jewelry store."

Around his neck, Sanders placed two thick gold chains with dangling diamond-studded 21s. He wore a diamond-studded Rolex watch, two gold diamond bracelets and matching diamond horseshoe earrings.

"There was a division between Deion and Troy that began to bubble over," says Kevin Smith. "We called it 'Double Doors' at Valley Ranch. Once we walked through those double doors it was football. We could laugh and joke, but it was all about football. To Aikman, that was sacred.

"When Deion came in, something changed for the worse. Guys who should have been studying football on a Wednesday at 12 o'clock were focused on other things. Deion was such a freaky athlete that he could shake one leg and be ready to cover anyone. But the guys following his lead weren't nearly as talented. You know what they say about dogs that chase cars -- they don't live long."

One of Sanders' most devoted disciples was Sherman Williams, the rookie running back with much talent but zero work ethic. "Deion had Sherman's ear 100 percent," says Kevin Smith. "He was a rookie who'd show up around 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock in the morning, smelling like weed and rolling with a posse. Guys like Sherman needed to be reminded of the importance of hard work. That did not come from Deion."

"You led by example," adds Dale Hellestrae, the offensive lineman. "And his example wasn't very good."

It's a shame how talented the Cowboys were, how they had the pieces to be a true dynasty with the disciplined coaches and leaders they had and then to have numbskulls and lazy players come in and ruin a great run.

This team should have won five straight Super Bowls. And I'm convinced they would have had Jimmy Johnson not left. (Of course, there's no way to prove that. Just my feeling. Oh, and I remember Jimmy Johnson said he would not have signed Deion Sanders. Jimmy knew talent, but he knew hard work is what drives talent.)
 

Muhast

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"oldschool7" yet you didnt even know about a star player we had in the mid 90s? Did you just become a fan lately or something?

I don't get it
 

tyke1doe

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Oldschool7;2495261 said:
dcfanatic

Ratliff in postgame all but admitted the Werder story (as if there was any point in denying it).

Rat was trying to defend Owens but he says, "It *doesn't matter* if Werders' story is true or not."

Uh. Yeah, we understand.

Exactly.

Wade did the same thing with his "brothers fight in a family" comment.

If there was nothing to the story, you think the Cowboys would be making those statements? "Husbands and wives smack each other around in a marriage." :rolleyes:
 

tyke1doe

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Temo;2495299 said:
That "reveal your sources" thing is more, I think, to find out who breached the trust of the locker room than anything else. Tension between players happens all the time, but this stuff should never come out into the open.

That's a tactic to deny the veracity of a negative story.

People do it all the time, as if they don't understand the nature of the press and anonymous sources.

The press will defend the anonymity of it sources even to the point of jail. I had a colleague who went to jail to protect his sources.

I wish someone would ask T.O. has he ever been an anonymous source. Many players are themselves anonymous sources, talking to reporters and telling them inside information on the team off the record.

I wonder if T.O. has ever done that. My guess is yes, he has.
 

xWraithx

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tyke1doe;2495721 said:
That's a tactic to deny the veracity of a negative story.

People do it all the time, as if they don't understand the nature of the press and anonymous sources.

The press will defend the anonymity of it sources even to the point of jail. I had a colleague who went to jail to protect his sources.

I wish someone would ask T.O. has he ever been an anonymous source. Many players are themselves anonymous sources, talking to reporters and telling them inside information on the team off the record.

I wonder if T.O. has ever done that. My guess is yes, he has.

:laugh2:

translation: one of my homies got sent to the pen cuz he didn't wanna snitch and get placed faced down in a ditch

;)
 

Boyzmamacita

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You guys keep saying there is truth to the story. So what? Guys fight all the time, then take care of business on game day. Why anyone would side with the unprofessional way the media handled this is beyond me. Who cares if you like Owens or not? You should not let that fact cloud your ability to recognize a hatchet job when you see one.
 

Yakuza Rich

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Owens is known as one of the hardest practicing guys out there. Now, he does take some practice time off in the past usually to rest his hamstrings, but he's also 35 years old. Everywhere Owens has gone, they have not knocked his effort in practice except for Parcells who wouldn't give Emmitt Smith a rest if he had coached him. Not to knock Parcells, it's just that's his philosophy. But most NFL coaches tend to give veterans some rest from time to time.

I think it's just that Deion geniunely likes Owens for whatever reason and he admires great receivers (he admired Rice).

But if I've said it once, I'll say it again...Mr. Blue Suit's sources have been wildly inaccurate for years, time and time again, particularly with Owens. After awhile he either needs to find new sources because using them again either means he's stupid or has a big time vendetta OR he's making this stuff up.

In reality, making excuses for Mr. Blue Suit is a crock. As a reporter IT IS HIS JOB to make sure that his sources are telling the truth. If they are not, you don't report what they tell you. Perhaps if it was a one time thing, I could understand (still doesn't mean he's doing a good job as a reporter), but this has been going on for quite some time and the timing (after weeks of Owens refusing to answer his questions) is quite peculiar.

I understand some people wanting to think the best of people and think that reporters don't lie and make up stories, but it happens much more than you think and I've seen it happen in person.






YAKUZA
 

dcfanatic

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Hostile;2495652 said:
He blocks downfield for RBs. I think he doesn't get near enough credit for that. Hines Ward may be the only WR better at it.

Ummm, he's not even the best at it on his own team.

Roy Williams.
 

Muhast

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dcfanatic;2498611 said:
Ummm, he's not even the best at it on his own team.

Roy Williams.

Roy Williams is NOT a better blocker than t.o.

Williams is the reason Witten didnt get into the endzone
 

RainMan

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dcfanatic;2495253 said:
I liked Deion and thought he was cool until he blatantly lied on national TV about Pacman not drinking at the hotel that night.

I get it that he bonded with the kid, but lying for him isn't helping him.

He has no room to call Werder a liar after that incident.

He calls Werder a liar when it could have been a number of things.

Werder's sources have it in for T.O. so they lied or they are telling the truth.

But Deion going along with the ridiculous conspiracy theories about Werder making up sources is not going to get him any points with the people at NFL Network or his peers there.

I also think it's highly unprofessional of Deion to call out Werder like he has. Look, it's one thing for the accused player (T.O.) to do it. But Deion, you're in the media too, and it's just stupid to see you calling out some reporter.
 

RainMan

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Muhast;2498632 said:
Roy Williams is NOT a better blocker than t.o.

Williams is the reason Witten didnt get into the endzone

I dunno, he's had some pretty darn good blocks this season. But I also think it's a craft of T.O.'s that is somewhat underrated.
 

Royal Laegotti

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zrinkill;2495646 said:
Exactly ..... Owens is a childish, emotional, Diva who can get his feelings easily hurt and thinks everything is about him and the world revolves around his actions.

He is also a hard worker who never gets in any trouble with the Law and does all he can to help the young guys.

I will take that over a criminal or drug user any day.
So would you take T.O. now or Irvin in his prime, who was a user but a far better teammate?
 

TwoDeep3

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Oldschool7;2495259 said:
Wow I so quickly forgot that episode. That was so spare.

You listen to Deion talk about the Cowboys now and two things stand out:
1. He is re-living his strong hatred of Troy Aikman in his hating on Romo.
2. He is defending his own destructive influence on the Cowboys by trying to defend Owens.

It obviously is always more complex than a single player but right after Deion came to Dallas the Cowboys record went down four years in a row.

Bad seed.

This is one of the more absurd threads I have read lately.

You are aware that Deion and Romo play basketball in the off season, aren't you?

And all Deion could do is brag on Romo.

Amazing.
 

Oldschool7

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TwoDeep3,

Deion is co-back-stabber, with that little interview he pulled and his BS commentary.

Wanna bet they won't be playing together this next offseason? You just prove my point.

The cancer spreads and divides. Deion has made his bed with his buddy.
 

Oldschool7

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Royal Laegotti, drugs destroy--as Michael will stand and preach.

But drugs are nothing compared to the destructiveness of the Owens and Deions of the world.
 

Oldschool7

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tyke1doe;2495681 said:
It's a shame how the Cowboys ruined a great run. This team should have won five straight Super Bowls.

tyke1doe, really you have to ask, how many championships and games has Jerry squandered?

Jerry's anti-leadership destroyed what he inherited from Jimmy Johnson. Now he is destroying what he inherited from Parcells.

Jerry Jones is pissssing away the Cowboy with his enabling ways, and the power he ultimately invests in the most worthless players.

His comments tonight represent the nadir of the franchise.
 

NextGenBoys

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Oldschool7;2495252 said:
I had never read much about Deion's impact on the Cowboys until tonight. This whole little Owens fetish all makes sense now. In a number of respects Sanders just sees himself.

Everything that Irvin and Troy were in terms of team and practice and work---Sanders was opposite.

It really sounds like he was as much a part of the team demise as he was with any of it's success. You might even say he was a trojan horse that led to the downfall of the franchise. Tease you with his talent, kill the whole team with his worthless influence.

They say Sanders was just a lazy, apathetic slacker who blew about everything and everyone off. Switzer was the enabler. Sound familiar?

Aikman viewed the guy's influence as poison on the younger players.


For what it's worth, I had an interview with Chad Hennings a few years back, and in talking to him about the Super Bowls, he said that Deion did indeed divide the lockerrom, and was a distraction. Also said he was selfish, but didn't have time to get into that whole deal.

I will find the audio of it, and post the quote here in a bit.

*Edit* Here it is...
Q: The Cowboys recent signing of TO, is similar in a way to the Cowboys of your day signing Deion Sanders. What was the reaction of the players on the team, considering this was the guy who kind of ended your season in 94 with the no call PI on Irvin in the NFCC game. Was he embraced, or an outcast?

A: No, he was friends with alot of the guys. He was best buddies with Michael Irvin, so they went way back. He was a great athelete, so he was a guy there was no animosity for, he was a guy that was going to come in, and help us win that Super Bowl, SB 30, which he did, but sometimes you have to pay the pipe or two, because sometimes that mentallity, and alot of the things that be brought, over time, I think hurt the team, even if he was an immediate impact.

Q: Do you think he was mis-portrayed by the media, or was that a fair assumption?
A: Misportrayed in what way?
Q: That he was, in a way, a locker-room divider, sort to speak.
A: He wasn't- Well, he was a little bit, he was very opinionated, you know looking back on it, very selfish. I'll put it this way, he was maybe the straw that broke the camels back, because there was alot of issues building before, and there was alot of issues that his actions and conduct or whatever, I'm not blaming Deion, but it brought forth alot of pain and aingst wich the coaches and the whole system in general that things just got out of hand."


Take it for what its worth coming from two NAMED sources. I should take Ed Werders job, I name my sources :)
 
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